Conformation Handling - lead/collar positioning

 I actually taught my puppy to hold her head up ("nose up!";) when she is wearing a show lead, and she was always shown on a loose lead. I've never heard of anyone cutting off a dog's air supply. How can the dog have attitude if it can't breath?

When I put Resco or kindness leads on, I did place them high to avoid the "cutoff" look, but when I found a flesh colored slip collar, I let it stay around her lower neck (she was totally leash trained). I always thought that you put the collar under the dog's chin to sort of hide it. The idea is to show off the dog, to the best of your ability.

jennie_c_d

...I always thought that you put the collar under the dog's chin to sort of hide it. The idea is to show off the dog, to the best of your ability.

That's the way I always understood it, too.

 A conformation dog has to be trained to show.  If you don't train, then perhaps you'll drag the dog around the ring on a slip cutting off its air supply.  If you train, a show dog can basically present themselves.  You learn gaiting patterns, stacking, table.  The lead at that point is simply a guide, a tool to give the dog little cues that can help them look in a different direction, re-stack feet, etc.  When I'm gaiting one of my dogs, they are constantly moving.  They move WITH me.  The lead at that point is basically just a connector, keeping us together and on the same page.

I always place my dogs' leads high on the neck, so that the bottom is basically sitting under the chin.  I'd be crazy to place it lower because THEN you risk choking the dog (unless, as I've already said, they are well trained in conformation and you have taught them to show on a loose lead).  My placement is also for my breed.  I don't want their coat being divided on the back of the neck by a low-placed lead.

Also, it bears note that there are many different show leads now.  For instance, Honor shows solely on a martingale.  It is virtually impossible for me to choke her on it even if I wanted to.  Nikki shows on a stopped swivel.  Again, very little chance of choking.  Eli is my only show dog who shows on a true slip, and he's been so well trained in conformation that I never have to pop/string/etc (whatever you want to call it).  His show lead sits relatively loose in correct position, with just enough tension to stay in place, but I will NEVER pull up in a manner that would choke him.  

I must say, I have never heard that to place the lead high is for the purpose of cutting off the air supply.  It has always been my understanding that lower is more dangerous, as the lead can constrict directly onto the trachea, possibly causing damage and well as air restriction.  This is the first time I have heard such a statement.

 Also, table breeds, you ALWAYS "pull" up he collar on the table. That is mostly just a reassurance. Any dog can be intimidated by a stranger approaching them from the front, when they can't get away. Mom's hand in the collar, on your neck, helps. Also, when the judge looks at the dog's front, you don't want a visible collar.

 I also find that its position has something to do with asthetics.  Lower on the neck and it makes the neck look funny, cutting down on the appearance of length of neck, or shortening an already short neck is not desirable.  It can also clean up the extra skin, if there is any, at the throat latch area give a nice, clean appearance and showing off their length of neck and (in my breed) showing off the arch.  As far as for movement, I like it when my dogs drag me around the ring with me/handler at the end of the leash.  That is truly beautiful!

 The higher placement does give you the best control but that isn't just with show leads - it is true regardless of the collar you use. The intention certainly is not to cut the dog's air off though, that doesn't make any sense since if the dog was being hung it certainly wouldn;t show well.

 I usually use a higher placement but with some of my dogs I use a loose collar/lead. It depends in the dog, their strengths/weaknesses and their level of training.

Having shown dogs, I have always placed the collar high on the neck, right behind the dog's ears. Not to "choke" a dog....if you train a dog properly and kindly, your dog does not need to be manhandled around a ring. The dog should know it's job like any other sporting training. No, placement of the collar helps present a dog in a certain manner, and it is aethetically pleasing (which is, of course, the point of a dog show - to properly present the conformation of the dog!).

For me specifically, I showed Mini Schnauzers, and if the lead was draped loosely it really made the dog look strange and would affect the look of the neck into the shoulders when it pressed against the hair because of the coarse terrier hair. So to keep the nice sleek, even topline it was placed such that it blended into the hair at the base of the skull and then it was also hidden under the beard.

Will some folks place the collar high on the neck to use as a training aid for control? Sure. But not all by any means, and even then most folks don't choke to cut off air supply....these are expensive, top-quality animals and generally animals who cannot breathe are not going to "show" well in a conformation ring.

When I am showing my dog (UKC and formerly AKC), I move the collar around depending on what I'm doing.  When moving the dog around the ring, I generally like it lower on the neck and not restricting.  I want the dog to pull out and look natural; I don't want him to look like I am the one holding his head up.  If he's not moving well, then that tells me we need more ring training and practice.  With a male German Shepherd that is easily stronger than I am, there's not a lot I can do to really control his movement in the ring, for us the gaiting is all training.

In the UKC, I use either a black rolled leather martingale (gold chain) with a matching thin black leather lead with a gold snap, or a thinner nylon collar/lead combo that goes over the dog's head and then has a slider for the collar.  It's not a choke; it does not tighten if you pull, in fact, the slider starts moving up and the collar gets loose.

I also have a thin black leather slip collar which I often use in training but on the DEAD ring.  I don't show the dog in it typically because on the dead ring, it's a little big yet.

When I am stacking the dog for the judge, I move the collar up under the chin so that it's easier for me to hold and not have it sliding all over the place.  I generally step/walk my dog into a stack for the front and then adjust the rear legs if needed.

Now for the SV ring, everyone uses the collars below.  The first is the "puppy" collar, basically a Fursaver with a leather pad.  The second is the standard Fursaver.  The third is a more expensive Herm Sprenger show collar that fits on the neck.  While being shown the dog is always on a DEAD ring.  Even though a Fursaver is a "choke chain", that is NOT how it is used in the SV ring.  Also, a dog typically wears a Fursaver many sizes larger than what they'd need to use as a regular choke collar.  Nikon wears a 21" Fursaver for tracking (also on a dead ring), but he wears a 27" Fursaver in the show ring.  Even for a 3 month old puppy, the 18" Fursaver I have is considered too small.  It needs to sit low and loose on the dog's neck so he can pull into it without being choked off.  Again, if the dog cannot be controlled without choking and being strung up, then he needs more training, not a choke collar!

Puppy collar

Fursaver

How a Fursaver is worn - large and loose so the lead basically attaches at the wither.  First a puppy, then a young dog, then an adult...

Show collar (notice that you cannot use this as a choke collar even if you wanted to)

You can't see the front, but this dog is wearing the show collar

The adult dogs have to gait off lead, so yeah, it's really all about training!

IME with both large and small breeds...there are different reasons. In a small breed it's a little bit control and mostly aesthetics. In a large breed it's more about control....esp if you have a large hardheaded breed. It's not about air (after all a dog that cannot breath probably is not going to show all that well, ya know? they like animation in the ring but I am not sure choking and flailing about turning blue counts as "animation" lmbo) as much as it is about control...same concept of the high collar in regular training...to even the playing field in the case of strong dog/smaller/weaker owner.

I mean if I am showing Cleo she is so darned HAIRY that the line of neck is less of an issue...but control is important. If I am showing a hound then the line of the neck is super important as is keeping their nose OFF the floor. LOL.

Sera_J

 I also find that its position has something to do with asthetics.

 I agree. With Aussies and other coated breeds, placing the lead up high ensures that the lead doesn't obstruct the profile of the dog. (It's basically out of the way.)

I gait Luna on a lose lead, so she has the freedom to move and show her gait. She's been trained to the point that she knows the patterns, but I also alway cue her when we are going to turn so she doesn't get a correction accidentally. (She shows on a traditional slip.)

I do know people who use corrections in show handling, but even those folks don't place the lead up high to cut of the air supply.
 

I agree with pulling up the collar for aesthetics.  Maybe not as much when I'm gaiting since I like a loose lead, but definitely for stacking and usually for the down and back.  Since GSDs have a good deal of coat and also have quite a bit of loose skin on their neck, it looks bad to have the collar pinching inward in the middle of that.  Because of the hair, you generally cannot even see the collar itself, but if it's not placed correctly it can break up the line (whereas with a very short coated breed, being able to see the collar can also break up the line).  You are trying to present a smooth, rounded line from the chin down through the chest.  I hold the collar right up under the chin when presenting my dog.  It's not choking, it's only staying up there b/c I'm holding it there.

 You are holding the collar up. The dog wants to put its head down. You fight it because you want the head up.  It feels its air being cut off, it puts the head up to relieve the feeling. - it's clear.

Thanks all, I was astonished to hear someone state something so blantantly nonsensical, and to say a "knowledge of anatomy" supported their assertion was what prompted me to get your feedback.  Thanks especially Liesje with the photos to clearly illustrate some of the various collars/leads used in showing.

Corinthian

You are holding the collar up. The dog wants to put its head down. You fight it because you want the head up.  It feels its air being cut off, it puts the head up to relieve the feeling. - it's clear.

No, the dog is ring trained to keep his head up and also why we expend so much effort double handling. You can't exactly hold a dog's head up with the dog resisting when using a 27" Fursaver on a dead ring.  It's really not something you can fake.  The dog is able to drop his head if he wants to and it has cost my dog places because I spend very little time ring training my own dog (and FWIW we ring train dogs on a regular harness, talk about having NO control!). 

I guess I didn't include enough photos earlier....