Dog Community

Science diet vs. Raw - oh dear...

Posted : 10/22/2009 9:51:29 PM

So as some of you know from my other posts, Mika's been having some bladder issues lately (stuvite crystals in her urine) that we are trying to deal with (but having a hard time with our current vet...long story). Anyway, we need to change her food (she is currently on Wellness Complete Health Lamb). The vet wants her on prescription science diet (c/d). I am thinking of switching to raw. AHHHH!!! The two are total opposites, and it would seem impossible to actually be COMPARING these two options. But I'm just really confused and I need some advice.

On the one hand, there are a lot of people telling me that S.D. has saved many a dogs life, and it is formulated 'perfectly' for dissolving the struvite crystals. And our vet told us a story of a lady who 'got convinced' not to feed her cat presciption S.D. and the cat died... etc. etc. It's what our veterinarian is telling us to do, saying it's the only thing that will help her situation. But. I look at the ingredience on the bag, and here it is: (try not to throw up)

"Ground Whole Grain Corn, Pork Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric adic), Chicken By-Product Meal, Soybean Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Soybean Mill Run, Chicken Liver Flavour, Calcium Sulphate, Soybean Oil, Flaxseed, Iodized Salt, L-Lysine, vitamins..."(and a long list aof vitamins etc., I won't bother typing it.)

When I read this, everything in me screams "Don't feed this to your dog!" There is nothing in there even resembling a quality ingredient (except maybe flax, but even that, shouldn't be heated...). It seems to me, basically they grind up corn, add fat and flavours for taste, and more fillers to make it more than a corn kernel smothered in rancid fat. So okay, clearly I'm not a fan of cheap kibbles... so why am I even considering it?? But then there are people around me - more than just my vet - who are saying I should put her on it, even if just for a while.

Honestly, what I feel like doing right now is dumping all little bits of identical brown things in the garbage and giving her a bone :) I know quite a bit about home prepared feeding, as I did so for our last dog for the last few months of his life, so it's not like I'd just be giving her whatever... I'd figure out a balanced meal plan and all... but honestly I think even that is overrated. I mean, we don't even do that for ourselves or our kids. We focus on including healthy, whole foods, but we don't obsess over whether EACH meal is PERFECTLY balanced. Why be so scared of feeding our dogs real food?

I'm sorry for this rather confusing post. I'm torn... I am SO scared of something happening to Mika, as I just lost my last dog so recently. I absolutely want what's best for her. I don't know if I could bear giving her ground corn to eat... but if I knew it would help her...

Any and all comment, suggestions or advice would be GREATLY apprciated. I just need to hear from people who understand how much this matters to me, and also from people who can help me make the choice. Thanks all :)

-bernerbear

shamrockmommy

Posted : 10/22/2009 10:43:56 PM

When my girls were fighting struvite crystals (hm, I was also feeding wellness at the time they developed the crystals, repeatedly) I did some research on the pH of c/d. It is 6.4. Then I called a bunch of dog food companies and found out what the urine pH numbers were.

I ended up picking PetGuard (dry and canned) because it had a range of 6.2 to 6.4. I also made sure to add a good amount of water to the dry. I added a noon "soup" which was a teaspoon of canned plus probably 1/4 cup or so of water, all mixed up. I shoudl add, they will pee a lot (flushes the crysals!) so I hope you are home quite a bit or he has a doggy door ;)

Anyway, I also got some pH test strips and checked their morning urine which I taped lightly with scotch tape right over their vulvas,(because they were freaked out wiht me following them tryign to get asample LOL). Removed the strip and checked the pH. They have not had a recurrance since, even with me switching around among dry, canned, cooked raw and every which way. I think a lot of it has to do with water intake and potty opportunities (the more the better).

Also, crystals only form in the presence of infection, so he should be on an antibiotic for a few weeks to clear anything out.

Good luck, this is what I can best remember from a few years ago.

chelsea_b

Posted : 10/22/2009 10:59:48 PM

shamrockmommy
When my girls were fighting struvite crystals (hm, I was also feeding wellness at the time they developed the crystals, repeatedly)

The only time Cherokee has ever had any sort of urinary issue (and it was struvite crystals) was after she ate Wellness for a few months. Apparently Wellness is somewhat notorious for this, I found out afterwards...

willowchow

Posted : 10/22/2009 11:12:20 PM

Willow also had struvites develop while on Wellness.

I never used a prescription diet for them. But, she had a urine culture and the was placed on a long term course of the right antibiotic for the bacteria they found. After she finished the medication she went back for a recheck to make sure they were gone. While she was on the antibiotics she ate a canned only diet. And, I used plain unsweetened cranberry juice in some of the bowls. Also, I wiped her private area every time she came in from outside. And, I take her out frequently. She can hold it fine if we are out or whatever. But, if I am home, I take her out every 3 hours or so.

She was getting them very badly to the point where one night we took her to the ER. But, she hasn't had one in over two years since I did what I mentioned about.

As was mentioned above if you ever do put her back on kibble, check with the companies to find out what the target urine Ph is. There is an ingredient called DL methionine(sp) that is a urinary acidifier so I used to look for products that had this.

jessies_mom

Posted : 10/23/2009 7:03:00 PM

bernerbear
I'm sorry for this rather confusing post. I'm torn... I am SO scared of something happening to Mika, as I just lost my last dog so recently. I absolutely want what's best for her. I don't know if I could bear giving her ground corn to eat... but if I knew it would help her

Feeding raw may not be a good idea right now because large amounts of phosphorus in the urine can cause struvite crystals to form, and meat is high in phosphorus. Would it really hurt to feed the Science Diet until the crystals are gone and then put Mika on a raw diet? Good luck in deciding what to feed her and I hope she gets better soon.

bernerbear

Posted : 10/23/2009 7:11:35 PM

Hi everyone, thanks for the replies,

We've decided to put her on the Science Diet for a few weeks at least. We will then get another urinalysis done, and go from there. I hope it doesn't cause any "side affects" (I've read of others whose dogs have had problems from S.D.). It still doesn't feel right... but right now we're just going to go with vets advice.

We're also giving her a cup of water with each meal, plus two flavoured drinks of 2 cups each every day. So she's drinking 6 cups total (she's 50lbs), which will hopefully also help flush her bladder.

Thanks again...fingers crossed, prayers and good thoughts please!

-bernerbear

jennie_c_d

Posted : 10/23/2009 9:16:07 PM

If you decide to go to raw, perhaps a consult with a nutritionist would be helpful? I fed my Teenie Weenie the diet from Monica Segal's Optimum Nutrition, after her bladder stone surgery (she had a belly full of fish gravel!).