Meat/meat-meal

brookcove

So I put him on Bil-Jac Puppy and again we had magic.  Cord on Bil-Jac - beautiful coat, no UTIs, great condition (fat, even, since he doesn't work anymore).  Cord off Bil-Jac and on premiums and even the best grain frees - dry thin brittle dull coat, UTIs every few weeks, not interested in food and loses weight.  Bil-Jac could NOT be all that bad!  The lesson I learned - don't be TOO eager to knock a food.  There really are nasty bad foods out there but generalizations are really difficult.

  When we adopted Jessie from the shelter, the shelter worker told us to feed a food with meat as the first ingredient. She fed her rescued Border Collie Bil-Jac, and her dog did great on it. Not too long after that, I meant a lady at PetsMart buying it for her German Shepherd, which was 16 years old.

dyan

and I know people here ( including me ) are saying meal meal is better.  But then...he is saying when its cooked twice...how can it be better.   And it makes me think twice.      I suppose that is why I started the conversation and then thru in a few other things that he said.   Such as by-products... lamb from New Zealand and two companies that were not affected by the last recall.  Somehow this guy, who I thought was kind of nice, was made to me "not so nice!"

Maybe I understand a little better, now. He's just speaking what he knows or has read as it pertains to why he thinks Biljac is better. I think it's apples and oranges, in this case, to compare raw to cooked. And, as a fan of "if it works, don't fix it," I applaud your decision to stay with EP. And that's not just because I feed it, too. I would applaud your decision even if I fed Biljac, or whatever.

Good thing I'm not in sales, huh? Actually, I might be good at it. The idea of sales is to separate customers from their cash and not offend them in the process.

abbysdad

I find it somewhat ironic that many people that agree that fresh foods are the best way to feed a dog then contradict themselves and say meals are better than fresh chicken, while these meals are cooked and dried out and sit in a barrel until needed, not unlike protein powders that body builders would use. So I am of the opinion that if the amino acid profile of the food is being met and the protein levels are being met, why not use the fresh stuff, that is only cooked once.  Also, corn being used as an ingredient has minimal protein in it, if a company wants to increase the level of protein in a food with a plant source, they would use corn gluten meal.  The bottom line is that the companies that use the meal will advertise and market that it is superior ingredient, and the companies that use the fresh stuff will do the same, so the only way to cut through all the mysths and the marketing is to try a particular food and see what results you get.

   I think it depends on how many meats are listed;  Bil-jac lists 2 fresh meat sources and a meat meal in the first four ingredients so IMO it's a meat based food even though the fresh meats will be much further down in the ingredient list after processing. I started cooking a carefully balanced diet for Jessie a few months ago, and I do think fresh food is best, but I still think that kibbles with meat meals as the first ingredient are the best choice when feeding dry food.

I guess I am still not sure why if a food is using fresh meat instead of a meal and is satisfying the protein level of the dog, and is fulfilling the amino acid profile required by a dog, why is a "meal" better?

abbysdad

I guess I am still not sure why if a food is using fresh meat instead of a meal and is satisfying the protein level of the dog, and is fulfilling the amino acid profile required by a dog, why is a "meal" better?

It's not, it's just that meal in the ingredients is indicative of more animal protein due to the higher meat per volume ratio.

abbysdad, where you been????    I haven't seen you around for a while!

And your right...honestly I was a believer in meat meal.....but honestly....I'm just not so sure anymore.   And the more I read about kibble....the more I think you guys that are homecooking got the right idea.

dyan

And your right...honestly I was a believer in meat meal.....but honestly....I'm just not so sure anymore.   And the more I read about kibble....the more I think you guys that are homecooking got the right idea.

Bottom line is, neither meat nor meal is anything remotely close to fresh meat. That's why I feed raw

jenns

Bottom line is, neither meat nor meal is anything remotely close to fresh meat. That's why I feed raw

At least the BilJac Frozen or Fresh Pet LOOKS like real meat.

well you know it may have been fresh meat when it went into the kibble processor but when it hits the dog it is over cooked, dried up, heavily processed preserved stuff. Not fresh. Feeding your dog kibble, any kibble, is very similar to feeding your kids on dehydrated mashed potatoes, beef jerky, dried fruits and vegetables, twinkies, and vitamin pills. No one is going to claim such a diet is especially good and likely to promote a long, healthy life. Kibble same thing. It's very handy for owners, very bad for dogs. You realize kibble wasn't invented until the mid 1950's? and overall doggy health seems to be going down, down, down since then.

the only reason "meat meal" on the ingredient list is better than "meat" is that you have a better idea of how much of the food is actually meat and not corn or other cheap calorie sources.

dyan

abbysdad, where you been????    I haven't seen you around for a while!

 I was thinking the same thing; it's great to have you back.

abbysdad

I guess I am still not sure why if a food is using fresh meat instead of a meal and is satisfying the protein level of the dog, and is fulfilling the amino acid profile required by a dog, why is a "meal" better?

  Fresh meat has more water than meat meal and after processing would be much farther down in the ingredient list. One point in favor of more of the protein coming from meat sources is that studies have shown it produces less waste, making it easier on the liver. One of the functions of the liver is to remove protein by products from the blood.