Opinions of website info on dog food

I generally agree with you, Dyan.  I don't think corn is per se bad.  Rather it's the use of corn gluten meal as a cheap meat protein substitute that has earned it a bad rep.
 
I disagree that food allergies are extremely rare.  This board's members alone contain a fair number of people whose dogs act immediately adversely to certain ingredients.

I disagree that food allergies are extremely rare.  This board's members alone contain a fair number of people whose dogs act immediately adversely to certain ingredients.
 
I don't know, read the link that I provided,,,its kind of interesting.  I know Ollies skin specialist told us the same thing,,,Also, a couple of years ago here on Idog, we conducted a survey on what everyone dog was allergic to, and in the end there were very few that were food.
 
I personally wonder how many people that say their dogs are allergic to some food, actually know they are. To begin with, here at Idog pose the question and 75% will probably say CORN,,, just under general princibles.  LOL!  Seriously, I would love to do that survey all over again and see what people know their dog is allergic to..not guess what it is.  I just bet it would be a very small percentage if they were being honest.

Dyan - I completely agree with you and only recently have done some deeper thinking about the whole allergy issue and what's good or bad for our dogs.  I have been guilty of being very uneducated in regards to animal nutrition and health until the last couple of years and still have sooooo much to learn.  I find that there are many hard held beliefs that, discussed long enough, become factual in people's mind.  I have thought from the beginning of Sassy's problems that she had a food allergy.  So, off I went trying to figure out what it is/was and changed foods, that helped a little, changed again and that seemed to make it a little worse, and now I'm doing an elimination diet, but honestly I don't have much faith that this is going to give me the answer to her problems.  It's an inexpensive and harmless trial though, so I'm willing to ride it out.  If I had to put my money on food allergies versus environmental allergies, I'd have no hesitation to put it on the enviromental side.  Sassy hasn't eaten a food with corn in it since we've had her (3+ years) and she's got some very bad allergies.  I actually wish it were something like corn as the culprit, since that would be so easy to eliminate. 

I suspect you're right, Dyan, in that food allergy is probably often incorrectly cited as the offending condition.  On the other hand, I know one of mine is allegic to poultry - if he eats chicken, duck or turkey, within 24 hours lesions will appear on his inner ears, then heal if no further poultry is consumed.  If poultry continues to be eaten, the lesions will increase in size and number.   No poultry = no lesions.  It's happened several times, so the cause and effect is pretty certain.

EXACTLY Cathy,,,if our dogs were allergic to certain foods we could just eliminate them.  That would be great.   But most of us are still putting up with problems because our pups are allergic to things we can't do a darn thing about, such as dust, grass, pollen etc etc..    just like humans!

If poultry continues to be eaten, the lesions will increase in size and number.   No poultry = no lesions.  It's happened several times, so the cause and effect is pretty certain.
 
Yep,,, sure sound like a food allergy to me!!!  

Dyan,
 
You have brought up some really great points to consider. BRAVO! I do believe that true "allergies" do exist, but IMO, many of the so-called allergies are actually "sensitivities". I think there is a real difference in the two.
Many of you may remember my quest for a couple of dog food lines to sell at the kennel where I work, and so far we are selling Eagle Pack exclusively. We have seen GREAT response to it and many of the dogs who are now eating EP are doing good on it. I really like the food and the company as a whole. It doesn't bother me that some of the "flavors" have whole ground corn. I feel it is providing proper nutrition and EFA's necessary for good health.

Yes, there are corn allergy dogs........

I did do food allergy testing early on because of symptoms.  It has a rating of 0-5 or 0-6, can't quite remember what the high end number was.  Anyway, the higher the number, the worse the allergy.  Found corn, wheat, yeast to be rated a #2, which was "low" allergy.   Well, two protein sources were rated as a #1, "very low" allergy.

Well, real life experience has shown me that those protein sources listed were correct. And, real life experiences make me believe that that #1 "very low" rating should have been higher.  I don't consider the response to be "very low".   The only ones listed were in fact the only ones I have seen a problem with. 

I have not chosen to "challenge" for the other ingredients, but I am fairly confident that corn is correct because when I first got my dog, I used Cheerios as training treats.  There were allergic reactions.  So, at that time, I thought it was an allergy to oats, since Cheerios is made of oats.  So far, I don't think there is a  problem with oatmeal, but I may challenge for it and see what happens, and the allergy test did not indicate a problem.  But, guess what?   The next ingredient is modified corn starch, and corn starch again.   Is it a corn "allergy", or a "sensitivity" because the orginal food was changed, or modified, from it's original source?   That's an excellent question. Maybe, just maybe, real corn wouldn't be a problem, but corn ground up and heated in kibble is a problem?  I don't know.  I haven't tried to find out.  So, I will admit, maybe it was the oats as I haven't really tried oatmeal very much.  But, I suspect the corn as it was listed and oats was not listed on the allergy test and that test seems to have been fairly accurate about other issues.

This is really not on the exact topic, but I did want to respond to those who think corn allergy is just a "marketing" tool.  Nope, I think it's real.  At least for some.  Which brings me to my last point, which is more to the point, and fact:

Some dogs are allergy dogs, and those allergies are going to vary.  I can't give many top brand foods b/c of another allergy that wasn't mentioned above.  So, any food can be an allergy for a particular dog.  And, as someone else pointed out -- there are waaaay too many on this board that know certain foods are a problem.  Sensitivity or allergy -- either way, it's best to avoid those triggers.   And maybe the sensitivity or allergy to corn is higher in dogs overall than other possible triggers.  So, if you take the number of food allergy dogs, then you might truely get a higher percentage of corn, wheat, dairy, etc.  So, then there would be a point to having this food available that doesn't have it in it.   There are people who have allergies to all kinds of things, but if you say, as a human, that you are allergic to a certain food, then what comes to mind first?  Most likely peanuts.  Then, maybe seafood.  Because there is a higher percentage of allergies to these products than others.  And, with dairy, then that probably would be a "sensitivity", as kennel.keeper pointed out.  There is a difference, but that difference doesn't change the response.  Either way, you want to avoid the food.  The only way it might matter was if it was a "sensitivity", then maybe giving digestive enzyemes might help the problem.  If it helps, then great. But, then how important is it to give a food that your dog has a sensitivity to?  Isn't it still better just to avoid the food that's a problem, even if you could eliminate the reactions by "giving" something else? 

As you indicate (I think) very few things are black and white when it comes to this subject.  Isn't it possible that you could throw an ear of fresh corn to your dog and have them nibble it off with no problems but then feed them a kibble with corn meal the next day and have a flare up?  I think this is quite possible.  Even as I've been doing this elimination diet, part of me thought "yes, I'll stay away from any food I believe Sassy's had before", but another part of me thought "I'll bet if I fed her something she's had before but in a purer form (not kibble) it might not cause a reaction". I think when you have a dog like mine with so many issues, it could be anything from the first ingredient on the list to the last (most minimal) ingredient.

Well, I just read and read and read on food allergies tonight!  Trying to find some real information on the Internet that is NOT someones own OPINION, or trying to sell something, is really hard. I wanted true scientific information....I guess I will go back tomorrow, because right now I swear my eyes are bleeding.   
I found a few interesting things that were said on a few sites..and one is that dogs are not allergic to food from the beginning,,,that they become allergic to them after being on them for a while....I guess that would be a great reason to give them different food.   
The other thing that was mentioned in several places that if there is a food allergy that its mostly to proteins such as beef and chicken, then dairy products, and eggs...then grains and soy!

I've done a real, live elimination diet, and I feel like Emma's LIFE is an elimination diet, LOL. I have to be SO careful if I'm trying something new, or different. She is actually allergic to corn. She has environmental allergies, and other food allergies, as well. Of course, Emma is rather atypical in everything she does and is.