Conformation Handling - lead/collar positioning

rwbeagles

Meh, to me it seems like an opinion and one not open to any input. Not so much about logic, and much as "right-ness", methinks.

Methinks you're on to something Gina.

rwbeagles

Meh, to me it seems like an opinion and one not open to any input. Not so much about logic, and much as "right-ness", methinks.

 Corinthian, do you show dogs? What venue? I'm assuming you show them on a harness, so that their tracheas are unaffected??

quote user="Corinthian"]

 None of the pictures you have are of a dog with a collar up on the neck. Near the jawline as Millan likes to use.  The sole purpose of such a placement is to asphyxiate the dog.

I assure you, at no time has my dog been asphyxiated nor was that ever my intent.  The higher placement on the neck, up behind the ears actually helps my dog recognize that a totally different set of behaviors is expected compared to carting, playing, obedience, rally, agility or herding.  The collar is high during a stack since she is a "smooth" coated dog and this does improve her silhoutte.  It also pulls up a bit of the skin under the jaw which is one of her faults ( could be a bit tighter).

In all my years in dog training and just plain living a while, I am of the opinion that  absolute pronouncements rarely describe the realities.

 They stack on their own, they run on their own. The lead is only for  (ahem) show.

Corinthian

 They stack on their own, they run on their own. The lead is only for  (ahem) show.

So what makes your dogs any different than anybody else's?  I don't understand how other conformation people "choke" their dogs, but your leash is only "for show."

 And nobody else who does conformation has trained dogs.

Corinthian

 They stack on their own, they run on their own. The lead is only for  (ahem) show.

You still have not told me how many dogs are having truoble breathing in the link i posted

Corinthian,

      The collars are almost always "for show". That is exactly what everyone is trying to tell you. The choice of show leads and collars has a lot of history and tradition behind it. Different breeds have different presentations, and the show "attire" reflects this.

      Placing the collar behind the ears makes the neck line look much better. A loose collar low on the neck while free stacking is very beautiful, but when moving that collar can flop around or pull snug, ruining the elegent picture, Think Dobe!  Also, some breeds such as setters, are shown in a slip type lead that stays in place behind the ears, and they are rarely free stacked. The lead is slipped off the dog and on to your own arm while the judge is examining your dog.

       Perhaps you started your dog by "choking" him, but believe me, most of use do not! Show collars are for the day of the show, and for use on a trained show dog. I find your assertion to be be both insulting and foolish!!

BEVOLASVEGAS

*removed by moderator*

*removed by moderator - rude and baiting*

 Corinthian

 With respect, where did your information/experience come from that resulted in your assertion that the collar position was specifically to hurt the dog? 

I started as a performance "snob" from the obedience venue.  I looked down about many conformation folks for what appeared to be out of control dogs ( I still get cranky about those you do not manage their dog's elimination on the show sites).  

That perception on my part started changing as more of my time was spent with folks who believe that titles should be on both ends of a dog's name (does not matter if the dog is in a breeding program; it manners that you continue to demonstrate the versatility of the breed).  I started to see the amount of training that actually goes into training dogs for the conformation ring.  It was a major shift when I purchased by first "show" dog and have since finished two champions.  I have had to work just as hard to get those titles as I did to get novice titles in performance venues.

Dogs who have been too harshly corrected by collars often end up lagging or resisting movement.  You rarely see that in anything other than an occassional puppy class (with respect to dog shows).

 If you are an experienced conformation exhibitor than I would ask does your experience tend to be in primarily one breed?

Conformation is really expensive and time consuming.  At least for me, there is no way I'd be doing it if I had a dog that seriously needed to be choked just to get it under control enough to go around a little ring for a few minutes.  Let's be real, conformation training is really not difficult compared to sport and work venues, but you still do have to TRAIN the dog to show well, and some dogs even with training don't ever show well.  The last several shows my dog has been in, he's been in the ring maybe 3-4 minutes max per show.  We probably spent 10 times that amount of time training and conditioning the week or two leading up to the show.  Like someone else said earlier, my show leads only go on the dog for a show because of how they LOOK.  At home my dog wears no collar at all, or a Fursaver which is only attached to a lead on the dead ring.  This is how we train.  The difference in the "equipment" on the dog has nothing to do with controlling the dog, it's more comparable to me training in sweats at home but wearing a nice jacket the day of the show.  I am not comfortable using slip and choke collars on a live ring for conformation or *any* type of training or performance.  But yet I haven't had any problems showing my dog in four different conformation venues without choking him, hmmmm......