Dog Community

Demodex & Moducare? Anecdotes?

Posted : 6/19/2006 1:48:59 PM

Hello everyone,
I am a new member and this is my first post. I found this site while searching online for a holistic remedy for demodex. My 14 month old Border Collie Mix, Dora, has been fighting localized, small bouts since I got her from a no-kill last August. In the past 3 weeks, she has gotten much worse - she is terribly scared of fireworks, and people here have been shooting them off since Memorial Day! I think the stress pushed her overboard, and now it is starting to look like a generalized case on her legs and face. We have been treating her with a topical solution of ivermectin, but she can't take it internally as I was told collies often have bad reactions.

I am committed to a holistic remedy, especially right now, because she seems so healthy and happy otherwise. She is not at all lethargric (a'la Border Collie!), and has a normal appetite. So, I currently have her on a holistic, organic (real meat based) kibble and giving her Pet-tab vitamins.

I have been reading here that Callie is the person to contact, and I did send her an email last night, but haven't heard back. (Callie: I used an email I found in an old post, is this still ok?) So, I don't know all the details of the remedy that she recommends other than what others have posted. I would love to know more.

Right now, my bit question deals with Moducare, an immune system booster. I have read that this can be used in combination with neem oil treatment, but I wonder if anyone has used this product? It looks like I will be spending a lot of money in the next few days, so I don't want to get something I don't need. Any opinions, experiences, or words of encouragement would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance!
Jen

dyan

Posted : 6/19/2006 2:08:29 PM

There used to be a person ( I think was a fellow) that used to post here years ago...he had a dog, I think a husky or Malamute with horrible allergies. I have an email printed out from him,,,,he said he read every book about allergies and dogs, and tried every remedy and fed raw from the beginning. He said the dog started his problems within 2 months of vaccinations. After different treatments including holistic treatment with chinese herbs and all, they ended up with Milk Thistle and Moducare. He said it took about 3 months of this before his dog cleared up. He swore by it. I wrote the company (turns out it is Ohio where I am from) but we never had to use it,,clearing up our Ollie with allergen shots. I would try it in a flash, but other then him, I really haven't heard of others using Moducare. I do give Bubby Milk Thistle around any medications I give her including heart worm pills.

glenmar

Posted : 6/19/2006 2:09:19 PM

Callie has a critically ill dog right now, but she WILL get back to you. She seems to get through her own traumas BEST by helping others, so hang in there, she'll get back to you soon. Callie works full time AND I believe she was traveling today to take Billie to a specialist.

loveukaykay

Posted : 6/19/2006 2:17:04 PM

Benzoyl Perozide shampoo... lather it up really good for ten minutes or so and rinse well. Then follow by cupping a mixture of tea tree oil and water over the body. You may need to bathe every other day like this until you can get it under control.

There are many suppliments that can help you boost the immune system such as vitamins A, C, and E, colostrum, echinacea, fish oil, flax oil... you will need to suppliment with way more IU per dose than a multi-vitamin will provide. Callie does have great info explaining everything.

Jennifer Adams

Posted : 6/19/2006 3:53:36 PM

Thanks everyone for the suggestions! I am sorry to hear of Callie's dog - what an awful time! I certainly wouldn't expect anyone in that situation to be online with any regularity! I will wait around a bit to hear more about the supplements I will need to add to her regimine, but I'm off to find the shampoo right now! Thanks again for everything so far! This is such a trying condition, especially since my vets think I should be committed for opting out of the dip or interceptor!! lol!

Jen

dyan

Posted : 6/19/2006 4:44:46 PM

According to this fellow with Moducare...here is what he wrote:
Allergies are the results of a dysfunctional endocrine system (the adrenal glands) where too little cortisol is produced. Too little cortisol results in an unbalanced immune system where too few of certain immunoglobulins are made. Allergens are then allowed to interact with mast cells in the skin and other places to create the standard allergic response. The reason steroids work is that they provide cortisone and thus the endocrine system is supported. Moducare being plant sterols also appear to behave as cortisone and given in reasonably small doses does not caue side effects. The low doses taken also means that the prescription must be taken for a few months before any beneficial effects are seen. I believe he got this from a vet in California....no names mentioned.
Hope I typed that correctly!

loveukaykay

Posted : 6/19/2006 8:52:17 PM

Jen I PMed you... I would be glad to share all info I have from Callie since se is so busy right now.. I have her article along eith lots of info she gave me personally and woul be glad to share.

calliecritturs

Posted : 6/20/2006 12:18:19 AM

If Dyan's info is correct I don't like Moducare -- it is NOT that simple, and you start messing with Cortisol levels and you are inviting things like Cushings in with a big red carpet. NO way would I use that -- that sounds scarey to me honestly.

It would take serious vet intervention to tell you where your dogs cortisol level is -- and messing with that willy nilly just makes no sense.

I HOPE I emailed you the article. I didn't get your email -- my home email is pretty easy.

callie at critturs dot com

take out the spaces and change the punctuation and that's it. (now you know where critturscallie comes from).

I wish I was more awake -- but yeah, I did drive up and back to Gainesville today (that's 'nother whole post). The demodex thing -- altho the article is like 25 pages -- breaks down easy:

1. Frequent bathing (benzoyl peroxide shampoo which chemically opens the pores and allows YOU to flush them out with a WARM bath) and tea tree oil and water rinse -- keeps down staph and repels mites.

2. vitamins/supplements to change the body on a cellular level + herbals to 'jump start' the immune system and help introduce it to the good 'habit' of responding. THIS

ART IS CRITICAL

3. Identify stressors and elminate them -- this is a labor of love -- it includes everything from teething to weather changes and everything in between (aside from the obvious like vaccines (make them count and MINIMAL) and spay/neuter (you gotta alter a demodex animal ... and the sooner the better).

It bothers me folks are having trouble getting me. *sigh* My provider's been a royal pia lately -- so if you don't get me yank my chain on here HARD. Thanks

dyan

Posted : 6/20/2006 7:16:30 AM

I knew you would "show up" to help Callie, its just you!
One last thing I have printed about Moducare, it came from an email answer from the company that sells it, back when we were going to give it a try as a last resort:
Moducare has been used for dogs, cats and horses for many years now both here in North America and originally in South America. The amount recommended for large dogs - over 50 lbs - is two capsules per day. It is very diffuicult to overdose on Moducare since the body will use what it needs and harmlessly excrete the rest via the intestines.
Research in humans as shown that Moducare balances the cortisol/DHEA ratio. You can read about this on our website [linkhttp://www.moducare.com]www.moducare.com[/link] under the heading "Research" and the Marathon Runner study. Moducare was shown to decrease cortisol.
,,,,,,and it goes on.
Last thing sent to me by the fellow that used it and felt it saved his dog was:
The immune system is made up of a wide variety of cells and each has a specific function. One class of cells called the t-lymphocyhtes have a subset called helpers 1 and 2 (Th1 and Th2) The ration of the Th1 has to remain in balance over the period of a day or the immune system goes out of balance. When cortisol production is low, Th2 cells dominate the immune system and when cortisol is high, Th1 cell dominate the immune system. When an immune system is dominant in one direction for a length of time, one becomes subceptable to certain illnesses. Allergies and eczema are examples of Th2 dominated immune diseases while automimmune diseases and rheumatoid arthritis are examples of Th1 dominated immune diseases.
Okay, thats it, the last of any explainations I have of Moducare. It is sold in Health Food Stores and mainly given by Holistic Vets, and while I don't believe that everything recommended by holistic or sold in health food stores is good or not dangerous, I had thought at the time that it was well worth trying.
I sure wish that the fellow that used to use it for his dog was still around. I would love to know how is dog is now and if he still uses it and believes in it. He said he read every book about allergies, took his dog to many vets both holistic and regular before coming across this. He felt sure that with all he read, the most common thing found about allergies is that they really don't know much about them.

Jennifer Adams

Posted : 6/20/2006 2:01:08 PM

[

] Thank you everyone!
Callie - I did get your email, and I appreciate your help. I have decided to nix the Moducare idea - I was feeling a bit skeptical about it since no one I have talked to or even really anyone on these forums seems to know much about it.

Thanks again to everyone who has responded. As I mentioned to Callie, I was starting to feel very alone treating this problem, but now I feel that there is a community who not only shares my dog-values, but can help! Thanks a million!!

Jen