Grapefruit seed Extract

Hi, yeah, anyone have any help??

Would this help ;  [linkhttp://forum.dog.com/asp/tm.asp?m=198701&mpage=1&key=grapefruit%2Cseed𰧃]http://forum.dog.com/asp/tm.asp?m=198701&mpage=1&key=grapefruit%2Cseed𰧃[/link];
 
   It's from one of Callie's posts; 
 Jennie's right in everything she says.  You can use grapefruit seed extract (NOT grapeseed ... notice I said grapeFRUIT seed extract) orally and oil of oregano capsules both for dogs.  Use half the adult dose usually on a dog unless it's a big dog and then use the full adult dose.

ORIGINAL: jessies_mom

Would this help ; [linkhttp://forum.dog.com/asp/tm.asp?m=198701&mpage=1&key=grapefruit%2Cseed𰧃]http://forum.dog.com/asp/tm.asp?m=198701&mpage=1&key=grapefruit%2Cseed𰧃[/link];

It's from one of Callie's posts;
Jennie's right in everything she says. You can use grapefruit seed extract (NOT grapeseed ... notice I said grapeFRUIT seed extract) orally and oil of oregano capsules both for dogs. Use half the adult dose usually on a dog unless it's a big dog and then use the full adult dose.

Thank you!

I gave her one pill last night!

You're welcome; []  How is Ella doing now; is the sore on her leg getting better?

ORIGINAL: jessies_mom

You're welcome; [] How is Ella doing now; is the sore on her leg getting better?

Yes, the sore on her leg IS getting better and she's stopped licking it and her skin is looking a bit better.
Not completely healed though but it was a HORRIBLE breakout all over her sides.
I'll be heading to the holistic vet if this crap comes back.


How exactly does one go about an elimination diet when they feed raw?
If I choose to say...eliminate chicken from her diet to see if that's something that she is allergic to, how long do I have to eliminate it for?

Or do I have the wrong idea about elimination diets?

How exactly does one go about an elimination diet when they feed raw?
If I choose to say...eliminate chicken from her diet to see if that's something that she is allergic to, how long do I have to eliminate it for?

Or do I have the wrong idea about elimination diets?

 
   An elimination diet only consists of one meat, one carb, vitamins and minerals. [] Jessie's on a RX elimination diet now; it only has 2 basic ingredients; potato and rabbit. We're working on the phase where I introduce different foods back into her diet to see if she reacts to them; right now we're trying beef. For an elimination diet the meat and carb sources have to be something the dog has never eaten before, which is going to be tough to find for Ella since she's been fed a large variety of foods. That's why I suggested the Royan Canin Rx diets to you before; they make rabbit, venison, duck, and fish, all with potatos as the carb. I know it would be difficult and expensive to feed these proteins in raw form even if you could readily find them. The Rx diets are only 19% protein but I've been adding EVO rabbit to Jessie's food.  If you do a raw elimination diet you can start with a 50-50 mix of one meat and one carb; if this causes loose stools you can adjust the ratio to get better stool consistency. Then you need to add a calcium supplement (and it can't be eggshell or bone meal because they're protein sources); after that you add a multi-vitamin supplement. Later you can add salmon oil, but only a few drops at a time in case Ella's allergic to it.
   
    Anyway, you feed  only the diet for 12 weeks and nothing else; if you give treats, they must have the same ingredients as the diet. If your dog's allergies improve during that time, then it's likely that your dog was allergic to something it was eating before; if not, then the allergies are probably environmental. After 12 weeks, if you think your dog has a food allergy, you reintroduce foods that were in her old diet, one at a time. You need to try each food for 2 weeks, then allow 2 more weeks before trying another food. If your dog has a strong reaction to a food then you don't need to feed it for 2 weeks. Obviously, it's a slow and methodical process and takes patience and determination but when you're through you'll know what foods your dog's allergic to.
 
  In Jessie's case it's very hard to tell if the elimination diet has helped or not because I started it in October when the pollen counts had dropped significantly due to some early cold weather, so I don't know if she's been doing better because of the diet. If she reacts to a food as they're reintroduced then I'll know she has another food allergy. I hope this explained it well enough; feel free to ask more questions. []

So...there's no grains in the Royal Canin Rx diets?
I ask because what if she ends up with having a grain allergy?

I cannot seem to find the link to the different Royal Canin diets. I think I can find it.

I'm assuming I'll need to get a prescription to get this food for Ella?


If I choose to do the raw route (which will be difficult because I cannot find rabbit available around me and the other meats you listed, she's had before), I can still give her her supplements and vitamins, right? Like, I wouldn't have to stop the vitamin E, and b-complex?
What would I give her for a source of vitamin A? I'd also have to get the new meat source's liver as well, then. Crap.
If I do an elimination diet, I might have to go the kibble route.


Can you suggest (and link, if you will, please) a good multi-vitamin and calcium supplement?


Thanks!

If I choose to do the raw route (which will be difficult because I cannot find rabbit available around me and the other meats you listed, she's had before), I can still give her her supplements and vitamins, right? Like, I wouldn't have to stop the vitamin E, and b-complex?

  Has she had pork; Cathy used pork and buckwheat ( despite the name, buckwheat isn't a type of wheat). The information I gave you in my other post is from Monica Segal's booklet on elimination diets called "The Allergy Problem."  After adding a calcium supplement, she suggests adding Thorne Basic Nutrients IV with copper and iron because pet vitamins have flavorings your dog may react to. If the vitamins you use don't have flavorings, they should be okay.

Here's a link to show you the vitamins she suggests;  [linkhttp://www.totaldiscountvitamins.com/default.asp?CatalogID=72093&SubfolderID=76&AssocID=froogle]http://www.totaldiscountvitamins.com/default.asp?CatalogID=72093&SubfolderID=76&AssocID=froogle[/link]

This link is for calcium carbonate;  [linkhttp://www.veganessentials.com/catalog/calcium-carbonate-powder-by-now-foods.htm]http://www.veganessentials.com/catalog/calcium-carbonate-powder-by-now-foods.htm[/link]   Calcium citrate is also fine to use; you can find them in a health food store. You may be able to find the Thorne Basic Nutrients there too.*

The diets I mentioned do not have grains; neither does Natural Balance. However, Natural Balance is now adding flaxseed to their formulas and since it was in the Eagle Pack I fed Jessie it can't be in the elimination diet; 
[linkhttp://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/dogformulas/PandD.html]http://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/dogformulas/PandD.html[/link];
   Potatoes, Duck Meal, Duck, Canola Oil (preserved with natural mixed tocopherols), Potato Fiber, Natural Flavor, Salmon Oil, Flaxseed, Lecithin, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Inulin, Taurine, Lysine, L-Carnitine, Yucca, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Proteinate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B-1), Manganese Proteinate, Manganous Oxide, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Biotin, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B-6), Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Riboflavin (Vitamin B-2), Vitamin D Supplement, Folic Acid (Vitamin B
 
  Here's a link to the Royal Canin diets;   [linkhttp://www.royalcanin.us/vetdiet/vetdietcanineind.html]http://www.royalcanin.us/vetdiet/vetdietcanineind.html[/link]; scroll down to Food elimination trial and you'll see the diets listed to the right. I know the protein isn't what you'd like; me neither, so with the vet's approval I'm adding canned EVO rabbit. I miss rotating Eagle Pack's formulas and adding NV raw medallions or cooked meat but I really need to know if it was really just a bad summer for allergies or if she's developed an allergy to another food besides chicken. She's doing well on this food but she's had more anal sac problems than normal; her stools are okay but not as firm as when she had the raw medallions added to her food. The ground bone in them made her stools almost hard and helped her anal sacs.

* If you do this with a raw diet and can use bones from the same animal as the meat came from, you won't need to worry about calcium. If you're going to supplement the calcium, an adult dog requires about 50mg of calcium per kilogram of body weight every day; I apologize if you already knew that.[]

I'm glad the emphasis came thru on the difference between grapeFRUIT seed extract (which is essentially an anti-fungal folks -- some anti-viral properties too) and grapeseed.
 
It is the *seeds* by the way, in grapes, that are the problem.  Grapeseed extract will put a dog on the fast track to renal failure in a big big hurry.  DON'T use it on dogs.
 
Grapefruit seed extract is a darned good oral anti-fungal.  So is oregano oil (and the capsules are a whole lot easier to take than the liquid oil which can burn like heck going down).  Don't take either longer than 2-3 weeks.  (for human OR dog)
 
I'm going to stick in a sentence in here also about 'multi-vitamins'.  PLEASE be careful.
 
That is going to change with what you feed and what you do.
 
DON'T use a human multi-vitamin on a dog.  Most of them contain totally the wrong balance of stuff like zinc, etc.  And don't assume just because it says it has "vit E" that it has enough -- or that it's balanced with the Vit A because E is often used as simply a preservative.
 
Frankly?  I don't use multi's -- nope, not at all really.  Why?  Lots of reasons.
 
1.  they are formulated for the 'normal' dog.  What's normal?  A kibble fed dog?  A dog who gets home cooking?  A raw fed dog?  An old dog?  A young pup?  A dog fed Ole Roy?  A dog fed Innova Evo?  A dog fed something in between??
 
Tell me what the heck is 'normal' -- in my "opinion" you oughta talk to your vet about vitamins.  And hopefully your vet is beyond the normal vet who got 20 minutes of nutrition in some lecture in college and relies on selling Hills or Waltham products for all the nutrition advice they need.
 
2.  What other health issues does your dog have?  What other meds/stuff does your dog take?  It all needs to balance.
 
3.  Is it just vitamins or minerals?  BEWARE -- minerals don't just rinse out of the body like most vitamins do.  You don't want to supplement something like zinc every single day ... when they need it, or when they are sick or their immune system is flagging -- yes, then zinc.  But day after day?  Probably not. 
 
how about iron -- is there a NEED for it? 
 
Before you just give a vitamin, I'd love to see a complete blood panel done to see what the dog needs -- maybe the dog DOES need some minerals. 
 
Ok, I'll shut up now.  Sorry I was so late gettng to this but it's been a busy week.