Sissy's Spleen

Oh my...poor Sissy that had to be painful!  So happy to hear she is better and at home!  Get well soon Sissy!!!

Burl, I'm so glad she came through the surgery.  I'm sure you and Martha aged ten years when you were told the spleen had ruptured. I was almost afraid to read on.  Good job by your vet and you guys for getting her in quickly.  I would have never thought "spleen" from her symptoms so, yes, it is helpful that you posted about this.  I'm glad she's home and eating and pooping. :)

Good vibes for the biopsy results. 

Our good thots and prayers are with you that the biopsy shows nothing horrible.  Believe it or not dogs can live very well without their spleen.  It is great news that she's doing well at home.  Please keep us updated!!

 Thanks all for your encouragement and well wishes.  We will keep you apprised of biopsy results.  She is doing very well now, walking outdoors and lying a while.  My guess is she won't skip a meal going forward. (She has orders for a week moratorium on walks).  She goes back Friday for a quick check of blood.

One lesson to pass along...It is hard to know when your non-talking, pain-camouflageing pet needs to go to the vet, or just let some symptoms play themselves out. Weeks back, the first time when we had to get the car when she couldn't resume walking (as she had done several times before), we monitored her and her fast breathing subsided and  she actually did a normal walk that afternoon.  Had we taken her in then, chances are good the spleen could have been diagnosed and removed thus avoiding her near-fatal emergency Saturday.

To explain her recent exhibitions of tiredness, we had been entertaining theories of arthritis, enlarged heart, lung infection, hurt herself hitting the steps entering the RV, mild age-related dementia...Well, we suck as vet diagnosticians!  But as noted, the spleen was not on our radar.  It is hard to know when the doctor is needed w/ dogs.

 Wow, glad they got to her in time.  I hope all goes well with the biopsy.  For more information, in case anyone else needs, and a gentle reminder thanks to Burl to take an older dog to the vet if something suddenly changes in its behavior:

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_splenic_masses.html

 Spiritdogs

 Thank you for the link. That is a superb link that everyone should read.  Had we known this, I believe we'd have taken her in the first time she could not return home on the walk.

The 4 symptoms they describe are spot on exactly what we were seeing (gums and cold feet all too late)

1. Usually the patient is suddenly weak.
   
2. The patient may be obviously cold.
3. If one looks at the color of the gums, the patient will be pale in color
   
4. If the bleed stops on its own, the patient will be dramatically better the next day or even a few hours later.

Burl -- did the vet give any idea what, aside from a tumor or possible infection, may have caused the problem??  Has he checked her for IMHA or Thrombocytopenia?? or was there any known trauma to the spleen you knew of??  Altho I'd think you could get an abscess in the spleen just like a human might get an infection in the appendix resulting in removal.   Scarey stuff to be sure.

 I'd assume he's done bloodwork to know what her hematacrit and platelets are (that should have been done immediately prior to surgery I'd think).

Just wondering so you'd know

 We are now suspecting that if this was trauma induced, it may have happened 6 weeks back when she stumbled on the steps into the RV.  It was the following day when 1st we had to go get the car because she couldn't walk back. (The 2nd time it was severe enough for the car was this past Saturday).

Our $1900 bill lists lots of radiographs and various bloodwork. Will have to look and see what kinds.  When she came back with her diagnosis after the 5 min of getting Sissy stabilized on oxygen, she pretty well explained the basics of spiritdogs' web link - namely the two types of tumors. 

From following the link to cancerous tumors at the bottom of spiritdogs' link, Martha thinks that it is likely the x-rays are to look at the heart for malignancy in case the spleen biopsy is bad.

I guess this is an appropriate point to ask y'all's opinion of chemotherapy.  A friend with lots of dog contact recently said most that put their pets thru it would not do it had they known what it's like.

  My 11 year old Belgian had her spleen removed in August. Of the two vets who looked at her, one was certain that she probably had cancer. Her spleen had not yet ruptured but she became very sick and was acting arthritic (with this dog - if she's stiff/lame, she's sick) and her spleen was enlarged and had a growth with "suspicious tissue". The biopsy came back as benign and she shows no ill effects of having her spleen removed at all. Within a couple weeks she was totally back to being the crazy, bouncy "is she really 11?" dog :) Always have a biopsy done - the first vet would have encouraged us to have Loki put to sleep during surgery for a very treatable problem! 

  Fingers crossed for good news for Sissy's biopsy!

I disagree wtih that 100%

When Muffin the Intrepid (buffy cocker -- mast cell tumor in the prepuce area) had his cancer surgery we KNEW they didn't get clear margins because there was no more tissue TO take.  But he was a very active therapy dog who already WENT to cancer hospitals so to not give him chemo seemed cruel.

He had NO PROBLEMS AT ALL. 

Now -- I hasten to add, we also did TCVM (Traditional Chinese Veterinary Medicine) along with that -- and there are herbs they use that literally made him have NO diarreha, NO upset stomach, etc .. he really suffered no ill effects at all. 

Now at the same time I will say don't let chemo go on forever -- unfortunately Muffin's oncologist was herself a breast cancer survivor who thot she'd discontinued her own chemo too soon ... so she really wanted him on it LONG LONG term -- and I should have called a halt to it long before we did.  Chemo is hard on the kidneys and after a few treatments I should have trusted the TCVM more and cut it off at the normal time.  But because cockers are SO prone to mast cell we allowed them to talk us into almost a year of chemo and it killed his kidneys.

But I would do it again in a heartbeat on a limited "normal treatment" basis BUT I would definitely use the TCVM because the herbs were SO helpful to completely negate any bad side effects. 

There was a powder I gave him four days before chemo and for 4-5 days after.  He didn't like the taste of it so I mixed it with a little water and rolled it into "pills" and let them dry overnight and he took them FINE. 

http://www.tcvm.com -- that's the Chi Institute and there is a locator on the left.  Feel free to email me if you want help looking for a vet who does TCVM -- this isn't instead of your vet -- this is literally 'complimentary therapy' but I tell you -- it is unbeatable. 

Wow, Burl, thank you for posting this.  I'm so glad that Sissy is okay for now.  Please give her some ear rubbies from me.  I so agree with you about how hard it is to know when to take your dog to the vet.  Thinking back on my past with Aspen, there were signs that I wrote off as other things.  When his gums went grey and some other things showed up, off to the vet we went.  I've been late in taking my dogs to the vet & wasted money taking them for food in their eyebrows.  Yup!  Can you say ding-a-ling? ~L~

Anyway, many good thoughts for you, Sissy & Martha.

Sending positive thoughts for a continued good recovery and good biopsy results.

Burl

 

I guess this is an appropriate point to ask y'all's opinion of chemotherapy. 

For me,it would depend on the dog's overall health, the particular type of cancer and the likelihood of the treatment significantly prolonging the dog's life while providing the quality of life I want for my dog.   I hope you don't face this decision but if you do, you are the best judge and any anecdotal experiences that other's share, may or may not apply to Sissy's situation.

JackieG

For me,it would depend on the dog's overall health, the particular type of cancer and the likelihood of the treatment significantly prolonging the dog's life while providing the quality of life I want for my dog.   I hope you don't face this decision but if you do, you are the best judge and any anecdotal experiences that other's share, may or may not apply to Sissy's situation.

That is wise advice.

Sissy is all normal, now, so she wanted to walk yesterday.  Martha stayed w/ her and I took Peanut and Red.