Arthritis in young dog's knees

 For my 10 year old my vet recommends glucosamine/chondroitin supplementation (we do 700mg glucosamine, 600mg chondroitin I think), fish oil (1000mg for a 33lb dog), and we are trying some different supplements (one with turmeric in it helped but not a whole ton so we're trying a chinese herbal one next).  We may also look into acupuncture and I;ve heard some good reviews of DGP (there was an article on arthritis mgmt in Whole Dog Journal a while back that mentioned it).

Don't feed Hills, it will just give your dog different problems. Gross! Canidae is a great food. Stick with it.

My dog has arthritis in one leg due to a previous bad injury. Before it became severe, he was sustained pretty well on Glyco-Flex III, a supplement. They have Glyco-Flex I-III, each one offers a little more relief as you go up. You can get it decently priced on Amazon.com. Acupuncture has seemed to help my dog as well. My vet is also a fan of Pain Plus, which is supposed to have some natural anti-inflammatories.

I would definitely get x-rays if there is a possibility of a tor ligament. You don't want to let that get worse or go untreated.

 How is the pups weight.  Every extra pound is extra stress on the joint.

RKimball

but a cyst that has been bothering her.   So they had to take a sample from it (needles!).   That wasn't fun (for me or Bailey).   Getting that sample tested is costing me a pretty penny!

Hmm - it shouldn't.  My vet would have stained a slide and LOOKED at it then and there.  If your vet is automatically sending stuff like that out?  Hmmmmm ....

RKimball

The vet examined her and said she has bad arthritis in both knees and possibly a ruptured cruciate ligament on the left side.   Bad news.   Especially since she is only 4 years old.
She recommends putting her out for xrays, starting her on glucosamine and switching her to Hills J/D food.

I've got a pretty lengthy article on Arthritis that I've done -- EMAIL me *don't PM* because it's a file -- if you'd like it I'll be happy to send it to you.

X-rays?  might be something you want to do, but frankly I'd tell you to spend your money on acupuncture rather than x-rays.  Something that will treat and help reduce it. 

I use Knox Nutra Joint -- FIRST (rather than g/c) because it actually can help rebuild joint/cartilage rather than just trying to hydrate what is there (which is what glucosamine/chondroitin do) -- it's a more permanent thing and it's WAY cheaper.  it takes about 3 months to really see a difference (because it isn't a pain med -- it literally puts the stuff at the body's disposal to **rebuild** that joint)

Getting the dog more lean can really help long term.  But you can add to your own diet choices far better than feeding the dog something preserved with BHA, BHT and ethoxyquin.  (oops, I'll shut up about food now).

Thanks everyone.

 To answer the questions...

She may have a couple of extra pounds, that we'll work on getting off, but only 2 or so.
Callie, regarding the cyst sample, she did look at it first and then decided to send it for testing.

We have a vet nearby that combines traditional and holistic methods.   I might check with him for what he would recommend.

Thanks everyone!

Ryan

RKimball

She may have a couple of extra pounds, that we'll work on getting off, but only 2 or so.
Callie, regarding the cyst sample, she did look at it first and then decided to send it for testing.

ahh -- I think I mention stuff like that simply because some people never think to question ANY charge by the vet. 

http://www.tcvm.com -- that's the Chi Institute (a qualifying and certifying agency for acupuncture/Chinese herbals).  There's a locator on the left.  Honestly, I would truly recommend a vet who ONLY does the complimentary therapy (at least that's my experience) -- some vets seem to combine them ok, but often I'm seeing a big practice offer 'acupuncture' as this 'extra' thing -- but it's never a primary focus and often is treated as an afterthought rather than the emphasis that really produces the results.

Here is the vet I am looking into.   Thoughts?

http://www.iahcbolton.com/

I tend to not be hugely impressed by websites or I ***TRY NOT TO BE** -- because you can say anything on a website, and that doesn't make it so. (ooops -- I really don't mean to be a downer here).

Plus -- he does chiropractic.  That could seriously help your dog if he's good. 

He does homeopathy, but it's classical.  That's not bad, it's just not something he does a lot of.

 Probably my biggest "blip" is that he's seriously trying to do it 'all'.  Is it just him?  Does he have other vets working with him?  How does he focus and still offer so many modalities?  There's no "wrong answer" to any of that -- I just tend to like vets who really get into one or two things and become beyond excellent at it.  I don't like to see a vet just "dabble" at a thing. 

People are looking for answers all over now and some vets feel like they have to be able to say "Oh yeah, I can do that!" .... but each modalities has huge things to offer IF the practitioner is really really good at what they do.

Chiro and TCVM work well together.  But you have to really *know* Chinese herbs to really get superb results with them.  

I guess I'd just be cautious -- I tend to like someone who stands their ground (and yeah, I often like vets that other people DON'T like just because I like to see someone SO convinced that what they do is beyond compare that they specialize in it).  Someone who is SO sold on what they do specifically that they become almost wizards at it.

Chiro and TCVM will help your dog in a BIG way.  But the typical TCVM vet I work with will spend like an hour or better ***WITH your dog***.  And the first consult is usually a couple of hours or better. 

I'd ask how much time he spends with his patients.  How long does a typical visit take? 

Then look at the http://www.tcvm.com website -- and check out the locator.  There's nothing super close to his zip code (and I don't know how close HE is to you) -- but I guess I'd caution you away from a slick practice that looks *really impressive*.  Rather, I'd prefer to see you go to the person who is just SUPERB.   

If you can talk to some patients and they say "I'd never go to ANYONE else -- my dog is so much better off because of him".  That's a different story. 

But beware of folks who just gush 'Oh, they're SO nice there -- and it's ... wow, they just do ANYTHING!!' --

Am I making sense?  I'm not pre-disposed to like or not like him.  the *modalities* he uses could be very helpful to your dog.  But only if they are done well. 

Chiro, in particular, likely can help your dog -- simply because he's gotta have himself all bent out of shape trying to cope with that one leg.  So if for no other reason, I'd probably be very inclined to *want* this guy to work for you -- simply because if you combine acupuncture with a GOOD chiro -- man, that's some SERIOUS pain relief.

The Chi Institute is *not* the only good qualifying agency - but they have darned high standards.  They're also gaining entrance into vet schools -- the University of FL vet school TEACHES acupuncture and Chinese herbology. 

wHEN MY OLD GOLDEN RETRIEVER DEVELOPEDAARTHRITIS IN HIS HIPS AND SPINE--HIS SPINE ACTUALLY "BUCKLED" AND TWISTED A LITTLE--HE COULD NOT STRETCH HIS BACK LEGS OUT AT ALL AND WAS VERY SLOW GHETTING UP OR DOWN.  hE DID GOT AT A TROT ONCE UP, WAS JUST THE GETTING UP AND DOWN THAT WAS ROUGH ON HIM.

 wELL, i STARTED HIM ON THE kNOX AT cALLIE'S SUGGESTION.  sHE HAD SAID IT WOULD BE 3 MONTHS BEFORE WE SAW IMPROVMEWNT.  sO i WAS MORE THAN PLEASED WHEN bUCK STRECTHED HIS BACK LEGS A LITTLE AFTER BEING ON IT A LITTLE MORE THAN 2 MONTHS.  hE WAS ALSO FASTER GETTING UP AND DOWN. 

mY HUSBAND, A LONG HAUL TRUCKER COULDN'T BELIEVE IT WHEN HE CAME IN FROM A 3 WEEKS OUTTING AND SAW BUCK STRETCHING HSI REAR LEGS BEHIND HOM A LITTLE DISTANCE.  hE WAS STILL IMPROVING WHEN WE LOST HIM A COUPLE OF MONTHS LATER TO HEART ATTACK AT 12 YEARS 3 MONTHS.  I8 BELIEVE IN THE KNOX.

anotehr of my golden's, KayCee had luxatining patella surgery on one knew at 16 months, the other knee 14 months later.  She was started on the gluco/chondro after her first surger.  I lost her 1 1/2 years ago at age 8 yrs. 9 months ot conascer, and she had no problem with arthritis in her kneew tho we had expected it by the time she was 5.