Civil "Dog" Wars

spiritdogs

She is also big sis to Fergie the foo foo Yorkie.  

lol yes Kalya doesn't have a crew just yet! I think your family would totally out number my little diva!

I guess "foo-foo" is the one of those terms that some people take offense too. Just like "mutt" for example. All though she likes her sweater she thinks she's a little tough guy! But I see where you are coming from now, thanks!

Well, two of my dogs are mutts, and I don't take offense to them being called that.  It's better than being a "designer dog" bred by someone irresponsible who tries to make money off pet lovers' ignorance..  

Also, anyone can own an animal no matter what. For ex: People down the street live in an absoloute DUMPYARD. No exaggeration and no offese towards them, there just dirty people. Anyways, they had two horses for years and finally they both died. I was relieved for the horses sake because not only were they living on this small lot of land, but at night they went under a tarp. No barn, a tarp. And in the snowy winters they didn't even have a blanket. When the horses died, they got a beagle. They left it outside all the time and fed it macaroni and cheese. I KNOW THIS FOR A FACT. Eventually it died to and the list continues.

A new pet-store opened in our Mall. People think its okay to get a puppy from them because it is "cleaner then the last". I think one of the biggest problems were facing is unknowledgable people going out and buying that "puppy in the window" thinking that they're "saving it" but really, its very sick, has separation anxiety, was weaned too young and so on. I actually cried when I saw this pet-store that was open because it made me sick looking at that cute little Mastiff face, with those big, droopy eyes, staring at me from the other side of the glass. But unfortunately, I don't think all these animal issues will ever change unless everyone puts up a fight.

I also agree with you on the whole stereotypical thing. We adopted my dog, and though we did it because we TRUELY loved this dog, my mom still kind of plays the whole "we adopted him" story everytime someone comes up to us in public to see him. She means no harm though, but it kind of bugs me how she tells everyone the story. Me personally, It makes me feel good that we adopted him, but I know that I wanted this dog cause I liked him. He was funny, sweet and cute. I've had 3 dogs my whole life: 1 from a Ch.Breeder, 1 from a Petstore, and one that was adopted and each one, you can see peoples different reactions. "What a beautiful dog! Such nice features and silky fur" and "No wonder he's so mis-behaved, he probably came from a mill" and "Aww, you adopted him! Thats so sweet, he must love you so much!" But I find it somewhat comical to see all these different reactions.

Yep, making laws is going to change the way folks think.  Not so much.  Prohibition being a prime example...our war on drugs being another.  And lets not forget that it's a whole lot easier for a criminal to buy a gun than it is for a law abiding citizen.

You cannot legislate morality, or ethics.  Make it illegal and it becomes the "forbidden fruit".

I know many of you will disapprove, but my dog happens to be a  "Designer Dog".  I didn't purposely set out to buy a mixed breed, didn't even know that there was jusch a thing as so called Designer Dogs", just knew that I was ready for a small puppy again after losing my (purebred) poodle to old age. When I grew up, mixed breeds were common, & were given away, no one had to buy them, but no one was looked down on for owning one. I had planned on checking out getting a Yorkie, but couldn't find one for a reasonable price.  We did check with all the agencies we kenw of  that took in dogs, but no small dogs available, & we DID look for several months.    I just wanted a pet, not a showdog,  I just don't understand the thinking of not breeding unless the parents are from championship lines.  Many of us just want pets. Both my dogs are altered, & the breeder did have a spay/neuter contract. 

 This puppy was born to a breeder that raised the puppies in the house till they were several weeks old, then were in a grassy pen with a shade tree.  Very well cared for.  I don't think it could be considered a puppy mill, although they did have several females.  They loved them all.

She has been a wonderful dog, very healthy for the most part.  I am just of the thinking that, just like with our human kids, we never know what type person they will be, or how they will look, til they are grown, & we love them no matter what.  We would also have loved this pup if she turned out to be totally different than what we expected.

If anyone would care to enlighten me, without being mean, that would be fine.

Sugarsmom

Sugarsmom

I know many of you will disapprove, but my dog happens to be a  "Designer Dog".  I didn't purposely set out to buy a mixed breed, didn't even know that there was jusch a thing as so called Designer Dogs", just knew that I was ready for a small puppy again after losing my (purebred) poodle to old age. When I grew up, mixed breeds were common, & were given away, no one had to buy them, but no one was looked down on for owning one. I had planned on checking out getting a Yorkie, but couldn't find one for a reasonable price.  We did check with all the agencies we kenw of  that took in dogs, but no small dogs available, & we DID look for several months.    I just wanted a pet, not a showdog,  I just don't understand the thinking of not breeding unless the parents are from championship lines.  Many of us just want pets. Both my dogs are altered, & the breeder did have a spay/neuter contract. 

I was in the same position you were in Sugarsmom hense me having Kayla. She is purebred, but just from some FAMILY, and not regulation size, not a show dog... I just wanted a Pet!

But then after helping out at rescues and personally rescuing other Poms made me notice how OVER POPULATED we are with dogs!! I feel if we regulate it, then it could help. Owning a dog is expensive & takes a lot of money. In my opinion if you can't buy a pure bred then save up and wait.

My owners have a "designer dog" and we call it "Kayla's bf" I don't HATE the thing. And its not like I walk over there like omg you own a designer dog! lol no I don't do that!! I'm just saying I won't support it meaning I won't buy one and I hope ONE DAY others wont either. There are sooooo many homeless dogs right now that need a home, we don't need to MAKE more... :o(

Pomeranian <3

Owning a dog is expensive & takes a lot of money.

Sorry don't buy that.  I have not had to spend tons of money on my dogs.  Of course I got good healthy puppies from a source I trusted.  I didn't go to some pet store or Internet breeder that the dog came to me healthy and having to spend thousands of dollars to make well.

Pomeranian <3

In my opinion if you can't buy a pure bred then save up and wait.

Kind of an elitist attitude isn't it.  What would the owners of "mutts" have to say about that.

Pomeranian <3

There are sooooo many homeless dogs right now that need a home, we don't need to MAKE more.

Really can you quote some numbers.  Gee if we stopped breeding it would only take 3 to 4 years before the current generation of dogs were too old to breed and we wouldn't be able to breed any more dogs.  Do you know how many dogs need to be born each year to keep up with just replacing the ones that die each year.  If breeding was cut back more than 20% it would cause a shortage situation of new puppies. 

Hi Sugarsmom - welcome to the forum. First off, no one here disapproves of your dog. We love dogs! Purebred dogs, mutts, mixes and designer dogs! The problem people have is with their breeders. Most often (but not always) designer dogs are being bred for purely monetary reasons. They  are charging large sums of money for what in essence is a mix. They tend to produce way too many litters, have poor quality breeding stock and are happy to place their pups with whoever has the money. In other words they are disreputable BYB at best and puppymillers at worst. The problem is the JQP get sucked into the hype about these dogs and how they are 'the best of both world' when in fact genetically there is no guarantee. I'm sure others can add more comments but that is what I understand.

Now personally, if done responsibly I have NO problem with a person breeding what we label 'designer' dogs. If the dogs have the necessary health and temperament checks. If the pups are quaranteed good homes with a S/N contract. If the breeder insists that the dog is returned to them if the owner no long wants or can care for the dog.  etc, etc, etc.... In other words - everything a responsible purebred breeder would do. I know these designer breeders are few and far between, but if someone really wants a goldendoddle or yorkiepoo these people do exist- but like any other well bred, healthy puppy you will have to spend time researching, pay the extra money and wait!
 

denise m

Now personally, if done responsibly I have NO problem with a person breeding what we label 'designer' dogs. If the dogs have the necessary health and temperament checks.

Southeast Guide Dogs is located here in my local area.  They purposely produce a golden/lab cross for use in their program.  They have found that this mix works very well for the intended work a guide dog is required to do.  I would like to see anyone say what they are doing is wrong!!!

timsdat:

I'm sorry but I forgot where I asked for your opinion on that... can you quote that part?????? I don't appreciate being picked apart or attacked for my opinion statement. If you are going to quote me use it in the appropriate content

I said if one day we can REGULATE and get rid of this designer non-sense, and accident litters which lead to poor puppy "mutt" dogs (as you refered to them) stuck in a shelter... IF! we get rid of this... I think it is perfectly fair to say if you can't afford to BUY a dog you don't deserve one. Dogs are a LOT of money!! I have ONE and the thought of two right now blows my mind... it cost a lot of money to upkeep & pamper my dog.

I didn't say to stop breeding! geeez! I said to stop breeding MUTTS AND DESIGNER DOGS! I'm sick of pet stores, the internet, and BYBs breeding pure breds even! There are way to many so called trust worthy breeders.

20% shortage situation of new puppies? GOOD... or atleast for now. ADOPT A DOG! CHECK OUT YOUR SHELTER! STOP BREEDING YOUR OWN DOGS! That's what I'm saying. I'm allowed to have that opinion since millions do.

Pomeranian <3

didn't say to stop breeding! geeez! I said to stop breeding MUTTS AND DESIGNER DOGS! I'm sick of pet stores, the internet, and BYBs breeding pure breds even! There are way to many so called trust worthy breeders.

I can't agree that there are way too many trust worthy breeders.  I would estimate there are less than 500,000 dogs born each year that I would consider getting a puppy from.  Considering there are probably over 7 million puppies born each year that sure isn't too many good breeders.

Now if I take that down to my breed of choice I would estimate that there are 200 or so that I would consider worthy breeders and probably 50 or so that I would consider getting a dog from firuring what I am looking for in my dog.  Again what I consider to be really good breeders isn't that high when you look at how many litters were born to this breed in the country.

Just wanted to clarify about the not being able to afford to buy a dog.  I could afford it, but hubby was reluctant to spend that much money on it.  We are retired, so watch the finances, but can definitely give our pets good care.

Moderator poking a head in for a sec,

Let's not forget the "civil" part of this thread okay? Thank you all.

Hi sugarsmom.  As has been said, it isn't the DOG we have an issue with, it's the people who breed mixes for money and to keep up with the latest "fashion" trend.

It sounds like the folks you got your pup from are in fact very loving and well meaning folks, but ignorant of animal husbandry.  I personally believe that only the best of the best should be breed, and that means genetic testing for any and all conditions common to the breed, and proving the dog in some way, typically the show ring. 

I personally am involved with TWO humane societies, on fundraising committees with each.  When I can, I help out with the spay/nueter and vaccine "fairs" and any and all events that help to raise money and awareness.  I also help out with a couple local rescues as well as fostering for two gsd rescues.  I do my best to avoid the shelter dogs.....cute little pups who grew up and got thrown away because the owners didn't bother to train them, hadn't made a lifetime commitment to them, etc. because it just breaks my heart and I'd have even more dogs than I do now if I let myself.  Many folks here have made the same commitment to bettering the lives of the animals that are thrown away.  That being the case, yes, we are pretty opinionated about backyard breeders, puppy mills and pet store pups who COME from those folks.  When I place a FOSTER I want to know about his/her life, and I fully expect to hear from the new family through the years.

All that said, our society "wants what they want when they want it" and if it doesn't work out, they just "get a new one".  So until PEOPLE change how they think, what they want and acquire a willingness to WAIT for what they want and to make a lifetime commitment to a living breathing creature, its my opinion that all the laws in the world are not going to make one bit of a difference.

glenmar: i want to hug you for that post! teach me to type like that... :o) i love your inputs on threads!!

sugarsmom: yeah that's what i figured for your "money" situation (wasn't directly saying that in reference to you)

I just hope we can get to a point where dogs aren't an impulse buy. I value a dogs life so much that I guess I don't have a "problem" with a dog being expensive??? I don't exactly know how to say it... I just feel all people should really say okay wow i'm getting a dog, this a huge responsibilitys, it is another being that is totally dependent on me... I know so maybe people (i.e. my best friend even!) who are like oh yay I want a puppy. Pick up this pup from who knows where's house, and the dog's just a nut case, they never even train it... ahhh drives me nuts....

Question for all of you.... Do you think it is "fair" to be stricter about "releasing/selling/giving" a dog away? (i.e. home checks, etc)??

I say yes... I look at dogs like family/children/true companion.