Quality of life

Gizmo83036

So think long and hard and tell me, is it ok to sacrifice your pet's quality of life in order to keep them? Should your dog be forced to live in a car or other quarter too small for them - keeping in mind that it is summer - with minimal exercise and possible irregular meals or can you accept that some situations may require rehoming an animal for their own quality of life?

I guess if the option were to give them to someone who would love them as I do and had a better, more stable situation, then maybe rehoming them would be the right thing to do. However, I don't believe that rehoming a dog is all that easy, so many of these dogs might end up in a shelter and that might mean the end of their life entirely. In that case, I'd think staying with me and whatever my circumstances were would be a better option.

I think it would depend on the dog. I think Casey would be fine living in a car with me - but I would never ask him to. That's just too much. In FL, if you leave your car in the parking lot for just 5 minutes, is gets so unbelievably hot in there you have to open the windows before you can get in again. I don't think I could even do it if it was winter! So I guess, the answer is no. I would not sacafice his quality of life for my happiness. I have a few people that I have gotten to say that they will take my dog from me for a while, if need be. He would not make it in a shelter (that's why I have him) - he just would not.

I see so many pets being surrendered because of financial situations - things are getting really hard. There are so many coming in, we are having a  hard time finding space for them. Now, animals are still getting adopted, probably at the same rate as before - just so many more are coming in.

Most people agree that there is a minimum standard of care required for pet ownership. It includes regular balanced meals, water, physical exercise, mental stimulation, basic physical (grooming) and vet care, and some type of living quarters.

well now think from the dog's perspective. Certainly starving to death isn't optimal, but most dogs would cheerfully give up regular meals for more time and attention from their social group; most dogs would happily trade in their "balanced" kibbles for table scraps; I suspect most dogs would rather sleep in a car or leaky tent with their family than be kept isolated 23/7 in a lovely backyard or spend 10 hours a day alone in a plush mansion; most dogs would definitely opt for less vet care and probably opt for less grooming if asked.

Gizmo83036

So think long and hard and tell me, is it ok to sacrifice your pet's quality of life in order to keep them?

Sacrifice would be in the eye of the beholder. And being in another home, or in a shelter, is not going to be a better quality of life for a large number of dogs. My two dogs would definitely not be in a better quality of life to go to a shelter, or with a stranger at this point, because they have special needs. I am their rock, their person, and I know Gaci would have a very hard time adapting to live with a new stranger or strangers. For her, it would be easier on her to be with me, where I am, regardless of living quarters. I know that is where she would be happiest. I would be sacrificing a huge quality of life for her in giving her up at this point in her life. I'm not saying I would force my dogs to live in a car, although I have told people many times that I would if I had to. Until that day comes though, nobody can really say what they would or would not do.

But as for minimal exercise and irregular meals, how many dogs get that now? And they live in a *home*. With lots of toys. Being in a kennel for 8 hours per day. Or maybe with a fenced backyard (heck, the dog may live in the backyard, alone...is that better than being in a car with their human who loves them?). And all of these things are considered perfectly fine. If the person works normal hours, the dogs may get perfectly normal meals, and may get as much or more exercise than before the car. It's not for any of us to begin making judgements like that. And being older dogs, if they are indeed older, it's VERY hard to find homes for older dogs in some places, and some dogs over a certain age if given to a shelter almost automatically receive the death sentence, because everyone wants puppies or young dogs, not dogs who only have a couple years left and maybe soem health issues. And unfortunately not all places have homes just lined up waiting for new dogs. It can be very, very hard to find new home for a dog, it's a heck of a lot easier said than done.

Gizmo83036

can you accept that some situations may require rehoming an animal for their own quality of life?

I can accept that, yes. But I can also accept that there is no *right answer*, and that what's right for one dog may not be right for another in this case. Not all dogs will have a better quality of life in a shelter or with strangers. And I can accept that I would never judge somebody for the decision that they made for their family, and that it's not my place to say whether or not somebody should have done what they did.

I think that, if you asked my dogs, if they wanted to live in the car with me or go to a shelter they would both choose the car.  However, I think that Monroe would be very sad as he likes to have his space to himself.  Morrison would be delighted with the situation.

As long as the situation is temporary and a solution is being worked on, I don't see a problem with "extreme" living for a little while.  In a long term situation, well, if there is a better place with people that want to look after them, I would tear out my heart and give the dogs to them.

Gizmo83036

So think long and hard and tell me, is it ok to sacrifice your pet's quality of life in order to keep them?

I believe it IS ok to sacrifice my pet's quality of life in order to stay with me. Because that's what I think they'd choose. I think they'd rather be with me and not eat regularly or have regular exercise than be put in a strange place without me and each other. I can barely think if it! But I have lived on the streets. I know what it's like to eat in a soup kitchen and sleep in a park. And if I possibly could have my dogs with me, I would. But I won't judge someone who thinks their pet would have a better chance at happiness with another family.

I have been thinking of your question and condsidering your statement about the "quality of life" for a dog or any pet for that matter who is living in less than ideal conditions because of the owner's financial circumstance. 

Think long and hard about the quality of life of the person involved.  I volunteer for a non-profit organization that provides supplemental pet food, basic vet care, flea control, etc. to low income, disabled or terminally ill people.  This is meant to allow the person to keep their pet.  The program is fairly strict about who qualifies.  These pets are not living in "ideal" homes in terms of creature comforts but the benefits they provide the owner is beyond my ability to put into words. These animals are very dearly loved and they might live longer lives in a more prosperous home and they may not get to go on as many fun outings as my dogs and your dogs but the love shared is touching and I could never tell someone they should re-home their pet because the pet might have a better life, unless the pet was actually suffering in some way.

Thank you for the opportunity for all of us to think about what we consider important to our pets "quality of life"  and our own.

FourIsCompany

Gizmo83036

So think long and hard and tell me, is it ok to sacrifice your pet's quality of life in order to keep them?

I would have to say that it depends on the situation. I would keep my dogs with me as long as I could make sure they had something to eat and a place to sleep. If I lived in the city, in a car or in a place that didn't allow pets, I would probably try my best to have them go with a family member or friend temporarily.

I believe it IS ok to sacrifice my pet's quality of life in order to stay with me. Because that's what I think they'd choose. I think they'd rather be with me and not eat regularly or have regular exercise than be put in a strange place without me and each other. I can barely think if it! But I have lived on the streets. I know what it's like to eat in a soup kitchen and sleep in a park. And if I possibly could have my dogs with me, I would. But I won't judge someone who thinks their pet would have a better chance at happiness with another family.

Exactly how I feel and what I would do.

If I had to live in a car and decide what was best for my dogs it varies on the dog. Cheyanne would be willing to live in a car with me and go without the high quality dog food. She would be happy with whatever I had to offer her. I could never rehome her. When I moved out of my parents home she went and stayed at my friends till I got settled in at another friend's house. She had to stay in a dog run and she was so unhappy she never came out of the dog house except to eat or potty. She isnt happy unless she is with me.

I could rehome Kujo easily because she loves everyone and is comfortable anywhere she is. I would rehome her because I would want her to have the comforts of having a stable home.

I would want to keep Lillie with me for my own personal happiness but I know that she could never live in a car. She loves me to death but she requires alot more than my love. And she needs to be kept on good quality food to keep her in decent health. I would want to temporarily place her in a home but if my situation of living in a car was gonna be a while then I would place her into a home. But no way would I put her into a shelter unless it depended on life or death.

If I had to place my dogs into a shelter it would only be because I couldnt find them homes and because I couldnt afford to feed anyone even myself. At least I tried to give them a chance by putting them a shelter. At least they wouldnt have had to starve to death. 

I hope I am never on a situation like that and I feel badly for people that are in that situation. 

Interesting topic.  Here is MY point of view.  Dogs are primarily PACK animals....they can, quite literally, go without treats and premium food.  They can eat every other day even.....most dogs in this country are FAT anyway.   What they cannot go without, is their percieved human pack members that dump them at the shelter at the first sign of trouble...new baby, new job, lost a job, gotta get a smaller apartment cause I ran all my credit cards up blah, blah, blah.  And before you think I'm cold hearted....I've been there....traveled half the country with a soon-to-be repo'd car and 200.00 to our name.  AND our dogs.   For me, personally, my dogs woulld be much happier, sleeping in the car with me, than being fostered in a strangers house or worse yet, being put in a cage in a shelter.  Two of my four are from that environmnet, they don't need to go back there.  Again, just my personal opinion, but no dog I've known has chosen to sit alone in a doghouse (waste of a tree), over being with his pack...his person.  I can attest to sleeping very uncomfortably with all four dogs on the bed when we were in between homes while ours had sold early and we had to stay with family for 6 months. 

So, yeah, I'd rather buy a tent at walmart with the last of my money and take the dog and the kids hiking cross country until I could create a new life.  There ARE ways...people just don't want to try hard enough some times.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it. 

Next pet peeve.....people who try and sell their pet "mistakes" for money.....don't even get me going on that one...lol.

Unless I read a different article (I didn't read the above linked article, I read what I believe is likely the same article on CNN) it says nothing about the dogs (or the human) going without meals. It says she cannot afford the high price of rentals in that area.

I do believe my dogs could live in a car (assuming I was not living where I am now, where temps are far too high for such things) with me, as to them, being with me is above all else. And I think they'd be quite happy. For the same reason they choose to curl up on the hard kitchen floor if I'm in the kitchen, or sit on the warm porch when I'm outside, rather than go in to their soft beds.  Because they prefer my company.

Humans put a large value on what are essentially human comforts.  Most of us could not imagine living in a car, being without a shower closeby, etc. But many do just that contentedly. I know on one forum I go to, there's a family (with children) who live in a home, but who have to haul all of their water in and heat it just to do dishes or take a bath. Would most of us be happy that way? Nope. But they're quite content, it seems.

It doesn't seem (or look like, from the pics I'd seen) that the dogs are going without anything but a house..their coats seemed in good order, they looked at a good weight.  The woman is working, so I would imagine she is buying food for all three of them.   

Yes, I agree that it is our responsibility to make choices in the best interests of our pets.  But I guess we are not in agreement as to what is in the best interest of our pets.  I feel like many who have posted to this thread; that I can best meet the needs of my dogs and my cat even if I were living in a car, tent or cardboard box.  What I am  saying is that the needs we are meeting are not material in nature.  This is why your pet doesn't care if you just paid $$$$ for the new whatever, it's just a piece of furniture.   They just want our companionship in a fair, loving home, wherever that may be.  Animals just don't place values on the type of things that we sometimes do, thank goodness!

I think this totally depends on the dog.  I do not think Kenya would do very well being shut in a car all day while I was at work and then only exercised by a short walk in the morning and evening.  However, as part of her adoption, we already made provisions if something were to happen to me - she goes right back to her "grandma".  I'm obligated to return her there, even before I ask my immediate family.

Coke....he doesn't need as much intense exercise or mental stimulation like Kenya.  He just wants to be with people and would probably love snuggling in a car.  He's big and young and I do think he'd go crazy after a while though.  Luckily, he is so social and affectionate that he's not all that attached to us.  When we have dog-sitters, DH always comments on how Coke doesn't even care that we are gone, as long as he has someone to play with.  Sadly, I'd be kidding myself if I were to think that he'd be devastated if we rehomed him. 

grab01

I do believe my dogs could live in a car (assuming I was not living where I am now, where temps are far too high for such things) with me, as to them, being with me is above all else. And I think they'd be quite happy.

If that's true of your dogs, or of dogs in general, than why do we expect certain things of people who come here looking to get a dog? We expect them 1) to know the needs of the dog 2) to have time for the dog 3) to have room for the dog and 4) to have adequate finances for the dog. Those aren't human comforts - those are bare minimums.

Obviously the majority of these crisis situations are going to be short-term, but honestly, the person could probably get back on their feet faster without dependents.