Male v.s. Female

Samshine is right.  Bitch/bitch fights don't start immediately.....it's not until after the hormones kick in and the new girl tries to find her place in the pecking order.  And once they fight ONE time, it seems that they just gold a grudge and look for reasons to go after one another.

I don't know how to say this nicely, but, from what you've said about Kayla, she's not likely to enjoy having ANY other dog in her house, male, female, pup, whatever.  She sounds like a very bossy little girl who doesn't know that she's a dog and subject to any rules.  This is just my impression from what you've posted, but I find her attitudes very concerning when you are considering another pup.

JMHO

I actually don't have any major concerns about Kayla adapting overall, but I would stick to boys for your next dog. I think Kayla would like a minion to boss around- a slightly submissive boy would probably be the best bet. 

erica1989

The rule of thumb our behaviorist had was

1 - male/female

2 - male/male

3 - female/female

I agree.  I've had multiple females before. Not really by choice, they were strays who stayed.  I would never intentionally choose to have two females, and especially not when one is already known to have a somewhat dominant personality (which IME most females do).  IMO assuming that you can train the second dog so that there's not a conflict isn't wise at all.

glenmar

I don't know how to say this nicely, but, from what you've said about Kayla, she's not likely to enjoy having ANY other dog in her house, male, female, pup, whatever.  She sounds like a very bossy little girl who doesn't know that she's a dog and subject to any rules.  This is just my impression from what you've posted, but I find her attitudes very concerning when you are considering another pup.

No way... Kayla is awesome. When it's me and her she knows she can act up because typically "mommy lets her get away with it" but I've been harder on her and we do an hour of clicker training a day and she's just been amazing. The agility has also been helping to let out all this pent up energy she has from being inside so much (during the winter).

I posted it in the other thread but we went to the breeders house last night.

OMG Kayla looked like an ANGEL compared to these dogs. Her dogs were HORRIBLE. They barked the whole entire time and CHARGED at Kayla... like wtf?! Kayla was looking at me like "mom what the heck are these dogs problems..."

Kayla never barks.... and I mean never... she will only bark at our neighbors dogs during play and NOW I know why! They are more than TWICE her size and very rough with her! She's probably like HEY CUT IT OUT!

When the breeder put all the adult dogs outside and it was just the tiny little puppies Kayla loved it! Her ears were back up and was hoping around playing with them! She would get in the down position with the butt up in the air like "hey come play with me!" omg she looked so0o0o0o happy!! There was one little boy she really liked in particular. He was very bold and good high energy omg personality was great he'd like your nose with his little tounge LOVED HIM. I pointed at him and told the breeder THAT is the type of personality I'm looking for. Kayla and him and were like BFF by the end of the night. They layed next to each other; she would get on her back and snuggle with him it was so cute!

Then they let the adult dogs back in.... ugh those dogs are a NIGHTMARE! SO MEAN!!! The breeder was in total shock about Kayla "omg she never barks? omg she's so good? omg did you socialize her or something when she was little she's just so calm!" I wanted to be like yes lady I trained my dog you obvioiusly DON'T....

I don't like her, I don't like her dogs, but I loved the puppies and I loved how Kayla reacted to the puppies. I seriously think Kayla just needs a friend! Psh I can't believe I thought Kayla was a dominate dog... no Kayla is a FRUSTRAITED dog because all of our neighbors dogs are RETARDS... compared to the dogs I saw last night Kayla is a submissive lovie-dovie...

I'm kind of thinking to pick a long distance breeder or something b/c this lady is just clueless... can you believe this is the only recommended breeder in my state? I've talked to the NE Pom Club and they all love her!! so0o0o odd...

I might get a dog from MI or WA like I orginially wanted. But I enjoyed seeing the dogs interact first... that's the problem...

Any advice on that???????????

Some of the barking may be a numbers game. All of Mal's breeders' dogs are GREAT 1-on-1- but as a group, they are all LOUDMOUTHS. 

 Describe what you mean by 'charged at' and 'mean'. Kayla's a ttenaged puppy and honestly, I'd expect adults to do some shoving and posturing- not over the top, but they don't necessarily have to welcome a strange dog as an instant best friend- especially with pups around. How's everything else? (Health testing and titling?)

ETA: Also, is this breeder JUST a conformation person? Because honestly, as important as I think conformation exhibiting is for toy breeds, i've never met a group so clueless overall about dog training as toy show people. :P It's okay- they don't really NEED to trai their dogs to keep them happy the way most of the herding dog people do, and just MINIMAL manners will suffice for a 4 pound toy- where you can't get away with that in a household of 60 pound retrievers or collies! So... I'd get to know the breeder better and see how it went.


 

Thanks Pwca! I was waiting for you since I knew you'd know what to say! haha :o)

Well the largest of the group was a 9lb pet Pomeranian "Missy" who was a total ***** if you know what I mean. Growing the whole time, barking the whole time, and if not held back or in a cage CHARGED at Kayla (ran full force towards her) and Kayla would stand there looking at her like "wtf is your problem?!" and the dog would back of and Kayla would walk away and come sit next to me. SUCH A GOOD LITTLE GIRL!!! :o) I trained her so well hehe...

But the barking deff made me nervious... but the puppies where great! I mean all puppies are... they are so little and can adapt to anything.

This lady is sole confirmation and was top recommended by Bay Colony... but yeah she was clueless on training (that also made me nervious)

The breeder I know in MI is so nice... I mean we talk, keep in touch, she always has great advice, knows her stuff! So right away she made me feel comfortable. The problem is the BF does not trust long distance purchasing and wants to watch Kayla interact with the dog before we get a dog (which is very smart of him tho! b/c you never know untill the puppies are together)

Pomeranian <3

When the breeder put all the adult dogs outside and it was just the tiny little puppies Kayla loved it! Her ears were back up and was hoping around playing with them!

Just a note. How Kayla acts in a strange house isn't an indication of how she will act when one of these little fluffballs appears inside her territory. Just something to think about.

Pomeranian <3

I might get a dog from MI or WA like I orginially wanted. But I enjoyed seeing the dogs interact first... that's the problem...

Any advice on that???????????

I got Jaia and B'asia sight unseen (except for a picture). They were flown to me. It all depends on the breeder. IF (big if) they have a lot of experience, a great reputation, can pick your dog based on temperament, know what they're doing and do everything right, then it's not a problem, IMO.

FourIsCompany

Just a note. How Kayla acts in a strange house isn't an indication of how she will act when one of these little fluffballs appears inside her territory. Just something to think about.

Yeah I deff know what you mean. Kayla isn't territorial though (I mean our neighbors dogs walk in and out of the apartment all the time... take her toys... drink her water) and usually she's sitting next to me at my side listening to all of us talk. Or sometimes she'll run after them like "hey you come play out in the hallway" because I think she KNOWS that's not their home they don't belong in there.

But if I got a new puppy who LIVED with us... and it was their home too... I mean do you think Kayla would adapt? I've never seen her act that way with other dogs before. Usually you are right and she wants nothing to do with them and seems annoyed or overpowered by them; but she loved the little ones (and they would stay small b/c they only get to be 3-5lbs and kayla is 9lbs) idk....

I would say at first I think Kayla would be like "hey who are u! my name is kayla... why are you in my house? do you know why? no that's my toy, do you have toys? wanna play?" if my dog could talk... that's what she'd be saying. And I've had other puppies sit on my lap and they were more territorial than Kayla! Once I had a 5 month old male Pom sit on my lap and cuddle with me then Kayla came up to say hi to me and the male growled and barked at Kayla!!! weird... I wasn't even the dog's Mom. And Kayla just looks at him like "you've got a bad attitude" and walks away...

Do you think she'd have a problem??? I think maybe at first... not sure, maybe not. I honestly think the puppy would have a harder time then her.

I honestly like the way Kayla acts with other dogs around. She's less momma's girl and less spoiled attitude. When we are one on one she tries to get away with so much the little nut bag...

Pomeranian <3

Do you think she'd have a problem??? I think maybe at first... not sure, maybe not. I honestly think the puppy would have a harder time then her.

You never know. That's why you have to be ready for whatever happens. You just can't tell up front. Before I got Jaia, I knew Cara had issues with puppies, especially when I gave attention to them! And I took action months ahead of time (good for you for doing that!) to make things the best they could be for when he came. I took Cara to obedience classes and played with and loved on the dogs there. I upped NILIF in the household, making sure everyone knew the rules and who MAKES the rules. Cara is a strong alpha and she had to be reminded that she isn't, in fact, the queen. I am.

I think if you did something similar with Kayla, you could get a puppy she hadn't met. If you introduce them on neutral territory and take them for a walk together and let them play and THEN go back to your house, and do all the other "introduction" things right, then it could work fine. You'll want to keep them separated unless you're RIGHT there for probably a couple weeks. And for a week before you get the puppy, withdraw your attention from Kayla somewhat, so that on the day she meets the puppy, you can LAVISH attention on her (Kayla) and make the association that the new puppy means lots of attention and fun from mom and dad.

It's good to hear that she allows other dogs in her house. But when the new puppy doesn't go home at nighttime, she may change her mind. LOL I wish you good luck!

*hugs* thank you for all the awesome detailed advice!

lol I could see it now "wait... you are sleeping in my house? where is your home? why are you here? mom! this dog is not leaving tell them they need to go home..." I swear Kayla's dialogue would be hillarious if she could talk... my boyfriend does it the best in this cute little "der" "monstery" voice as he calls it lol.

The neutral terriorty idea is great. My father has 2 acres of land so I was thinking about just running around in the back yard with them before I take them home to my apartment. I'm going to make sure I read up on proper introduction, etc.

Pomeranian <3

I might get a dog from MI or WA like I orginially wanted. But I enjoyed seeing the dogs interact first... that's the problem...

Any advice on that???????????

I, personally, would never buy a dog from a breeder that I didn't physically visit beforehand. Anyone can sounds nice on the phone, can take pictures and things may look nice....but you never know...........people are sometimes "closet weirdos".....so, you know, just be careful and you can never do enough research.

The article is completely true for my pack.  I have a neutered male 12 yr old minpin and spayed female bichons 8 and 6.  My minpin never realized he was neutered.  He STILL marks in the house (ugh!!!) including just last night at the corner of the fireplace.  this dog has put such a bad feeling about males in my head that I doubt I'll ever allow a male dog in the house again.  12 years of marking has gotten me a bit wee-weary to say the least! He's constantly pushing for pack leader so we are always on our toes with NILIF.  He's been relegated to the crate when we leave the house and at night because he just cannot help himself and marks things (and we're in a rental house, ugh!)  Add to that maniacal barking!  He has his occasional sweet and funny moments, and he's taught me many doggy lessons, for which I'm grateful, but I really don't wish to repeat the experience again LOL!

My girls were very easy to train, much more affectionate and loving, RARELY do they ever have an accident in the house. NEVER do they ever challenge the humans for dominance.   However, I think we have 2 majorly different breeds where minpins are notoriously naughty (even my vet had not much good to say about minpins and was surprised how well trained my pin-butt is, though it took years of training- he's very smart, has 2 legs to his obedience CD).

I think, for me, I'm sticking with girls and the companion breeds who don't have crazy dominance issues :P

Pomeranian <3

The breeder I know in MI is so nice... I mean we talk, keep in touch, she always has great advice, knows her stuff! So right away she made me feel comfortable. The problem is the BF does not trust long distance purchasing and wants to watch Kayla interact with the dog before we get a dog (which is very smart of him tho! b/c you never know untill the puppies are together)

I'd say a road trip to MI is in order then.  When you consider the significance of the dog and how long they live, what's a 2-3 day trip? There are some dogs in the SE US I would like to see eventually, and that's as far if not farther than you to MI.  For me if it can be accomplished in a day's drive (15-18hrs), then I'd rather drive and meet with the breeder.  If I was buying from the west coast, I'd ship.