What the HECK were they thinking!? (Tresspassing) Ratsicles

Yup.  People are stupid.  I think its Universal.  Sad really.

Up here in NW Ontario, if you break into someone's house or trespass on their property with or without a no trespassing sign and are harmed by their animals, it is your fault.  We like to make you pay for your own stupidity.  My friends house got broken into a couple years ago.  She lived WAY out in the sticks and her doors were even locked.  Whoever it was broke the window.  Echo who was scared to death of people hid in Jen's room I think.  I'm not sure where Jessie was, and Zia was crated.  Too bad really cause Zia probably would have detered them pretty well.  Jen asked the cops when she filed the report whether she would have been held liable if one of her dogs had bitten or even killed the perp.  They said no.  Thats good to hear.

Just wondering.  Is there any sort of Organization that you could get Chief into that would certify him as a guardian dog?  I mean, that's his job.  You would think it could be documented somewhere. 

How about a sign that says

"Farm animals are not pets.  Don't touch."

"Farm animals like fingers.  Want to donate?"

 Wish I could take credit for this one: 

"Be careful!  Goats like to nibble on your clothes and butt."

janet_rose

"Farm animals like fingers.  Want to donate?"

"Be careful!  Goats like to nibble on your clothes and butt."

Both those admit that your animals are dangerous and if someone *did* get hurt on her property it would then be her fault for having dangerous animals.

 I'd check and make sure that is actual fact and not just something someone started a rumor about.  Up here, you don't need one, but they also can't use it against you if your dog bites someone off your property.  Like they can't say,"Well she knew her dog was dangerous, its posted on her door at home."  The signs are just considered a deterrant.  They also don't negate you of responsiblity if your dog bites one of your guests.

Call the cops and ask some questions.  They can give you the jist of it, and what your responsibilities are. 

"Do not enter unless you can run 100 yards in 7 seconds or less---- because the bull can do it in 8"

this sign was on a farm near our old house

I vote for locks and signs that say "Danger: BIO HAZARD" with those scary bio hazard logos in neon orange. No need to say the hazard is Chief

Wow some people have no common sense! That is just so ... I cant even use word to describe the stupidity!

But I am loving the sign suggestions :D I want to use some of them too, even if I am in the city.

Ratsicles

while some stupid teenage girl and teenage boy are opening our gate.

Oh, I just LOVE teenagers.

Gah.  I really wish the law weren't so overzealous about protecting idiots from themselves. It punishes the rest of us.

What about something from here: http://www.worldpetproducts.com/acatalog/719_Pyrenean.html

Or this: http://www.pedigreecharm.co.uk/acatalog/beware-of-the-dog-owners-signs.html

And http://cgi.ebay.com/Dog-Sign-NEVER-MIND-THE-DOG-BEWARE-OF-OWNER_W0QQitemZ140178453198QQihZ004QQcategoryZ46299QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 

 Ooh, one last one:

http://www.iwatchhere.com/GREATPYRENEES.htm 

Just a note on signs.  My friend's parents were sued when some kids trespassed onto their property, dove off of their dock in shallow water, and got injured.  Apparently they were still liable b/c they DIDNT have a "no diving" sign on their dock. 

I don't have a dog sign here b/c in this neighborhood, some people might take that as a good reason to break in and steal the dog.  People around here like the vicious dogs, if you know what I mean.  I don't have a "beware of owner" sign b/c I don't want to do anything to stand out.

 if my guard dog can be stolen then i dont think i would miss him much... however if someone stole my pet dog, hunting dog, etc.. yeah that would make me mad.. but if your protection dog can walk off with anyone... nope. he wasnt a good guard.

anyway back to signs...  i have spent many years walking around in the woods and down old dead end roads... the signs that deterred me most were the $500 Fine for Trespassing or Trespassers will be Prosecuted. let them know that there is a consequence of monetary value and court dates and cops and they will keep their goat petting hands to themselves!!

and my opinion guard dog signs... i SEE a point... but the law is too loose. if a child escaped (and it happens, mine did!!) and wanders off into Brutus's back yard and gets eaten.... erm.... young kids cant read. There was a day and time when such a horrible thing would happen and people would be sorry and feel horrible, but it was just an accident... kinda like when your car tire blows out and you drive up under a semi truck on the interstate... but this day and age people feel like they need compensation over a death. SOMEONE has to be punished. It wouldnt make ME feel much better, personally, to sue the pants off a person if their dog bit my kid while my kid was in their yard with their dog without me or the owners being right there.

 the laws need to be rewritten.... but i am afraid that it will only get worse. people who have guard dogs are looked down upon by a good bit of society.. as if they are hiding something from the law... no, not always!! i have bulldogs but i'm not hiding anything! protecting my family and property yes.. hiding no.

also about booby traps lol i was GOING to suggest setting up trip wires.... THATS a booby trap. not wiring your gate with electricity. i dont know about the rest of the world.. but its pretty common to see hot wires around pasture fences. And those wires can sometimes sag and touch the actual fence. when i worked on the horse ranch we noticed something wrong with the horses.. every time they tried to get a drink they would all spook and run away... found out the wire had fall down and was touching the metal tub.... so every time the horses took a sip they got zapped!
 

Maybe it depends on locale?  I never thought of "beware of dog" signs as referring to guard dogs, just a dog in general. A few houses on our walk route have them.  We live in the city and walk through a nice neighborhood.  These dogs are spaniels and labs, not guard dogs at all.  I've seen the signs on the front gates where people have fences in their front yard, so someone like a delivery man or solicitor would have to enter a gate to get to their door and should know if a dog is hanging out somewhere, guard dog or not.

I say get a lock and electric wire.  WE had to lock our pasture, because people would just open the fence and let the horses go.  It would 1 am and we would be chasing the horses down.  It was scarey because we were near a rather busy road.  We even had someone cut the chain once.  People can be so cruel, stupid, etc..

 true that could be the case. the point of the signs is to warn service guys.. unfortunately everyone else gets to read them too....

lol phone service guy came out a few days ago and he had it written in his paperwork about our bullies. but he is like the mail man and water company... has a route he sticks to. they all know about who owns what dog. but special delivery stuff.. dunno about that.

and yes.. electricity would be great. however it can kill if you arent careful. i know someone living in Australia. he took a pic of a fairly large hog that was killed by his fence...  

Yeah, we're going to do that. It'll be a huge hassle to unlock the gate every time we come and go, but I guess that's what we're going to have to do at this point. We're also probably going to run some barbed wire over the top to deter people from jumping over it.

Actually I do have one suggestion - put a motion sensitive alarm on your gate.

That's a good idea, we might have to try that.

Just wondering. Is there any sort of Organization that you could get Chief into that would certify him as a guardian dog? I mean, that's his job. You would think it could be documented somewhere.

I have no clue, but that would be wonderful. I've never heard of any certifications for LGD's, but I'll contact a breed club and ask.

if my guard dog can be stolen then i dont think i would miss him much... however if someone stole my pet dog, hunting dog, etc.. yeah that would make me mad.. but if your protection dog can walk off with anyone... nope. he wasnt a good guard.

Heh, yeah, we're not worried about Chief being stolen, I'm just worried about being held legally responsible if some idiot ignores my signs and fencing and comes in and gets bitten by him.

Really, Chief is mostly there to guard my livestock...guarding my property from strange humans is just a bonus. For a 5.5 month old puppy, I am VERY pleased with how he handled the situation. He didn't charge the gate snarling and snapping, he stood a few feet away and watched what was going on and looked imposeing. When they tried to come in anyway, he warned them by growling. He didn't act at ALL, because they never made it all the way through the gate, just stood in the entrance. Because they were halfway in and half out, he COULD have bitten them...but he didn't. He decided to wait and see what they were going to do instead. And then, when they left, he didn't rush out of the gate and run them down...he barked a little and then settled down. As soon as they were no longer a threat to his territory and his pack, he was calm. THAT is a perfect guard dog to me- one that actually waits and intelligently assesses the situation and does everything he can NOT to have to bite someone. I have seen "guard dogs" that were just plain mean and would charge/attack any strangers, period. That's NOT a good guard dog, IMO. That's just a reckless and aggressive dog.

I'm really, really proud of Chief. He was smart and handled the situation very well, I think.

On the issue of signs, we're definitely going to get some equine liability signs. We've been meaning to for a while and hadn't gotten around to it, so we're going to do that.

I think I'll get a few "Dogs on Premises" signs so there will be no issues with wording, a few "Trespassers Will Be Prosecuted" signs, and this sign: http://www.iwatchhere.com/GREATPYRENEES.htm because I like it.

I just think it is ridiculous that all of this is necessary. IMO, if you're enough of a jerk to open someone's gate and wander onto their property, despite posted warnings, you are an idiot and deserve whatever you get.

Ratsicles

I just think it is ridiculous that all of this is necessary. IMO, if you're enough of a jerk to open someone's gate and wander onto their property, despite posted warnings, you are an idiot and deserve whatever you get

I agree with you. And when I was a kid, a judge and jury would have agreed with you, too. As a kid, if I had purposefully entered someone else's property (sin #1) and then gave attitude to the owner (sin #2 and possibly more grievous, as it showed total lack of manners) my hide would have been tanned with whatever's handy. I'm not saying someone should whip the kids but allowing this behavior to go unchallenged doesn't help, either.

Here, in Texas, we have the right to defend life, property, and assets with force, up to and including deadly force. Yet, we now have a law that says if your dog bites someone hard enough to require medical attention at a hospital, you can be criminally prosecuted.

So, trespassers shouldn't worry about Shadow biting. They should be more concerned with my bite.