Iditarod 2007

ORIGINAL: jeano

G33, tying out sled dogs so that they can't get tangled or fight is not just for sled dogs. They aren't aggressive animals. You may not realize it but ANY dog tied out should not be able to touch another dog that is also tied out. They will eventually fight. ANY dog will do that.

You aren't going to keep 20 sled dogs IN THE HOUSE! They are happy outside. Most mushers take their dogs out training several days a week if not nearly every day in the winter. Summer the dogs are trained with 4-wheelers. They get lots of exercise and attention.

Often the dogs get steaks at the end of a race. []

edited to correct typos

 
I get that by why are they tied out at all? 
My understanding was that they have to be tied when they are off the sled, otherwise they will fight (hence my question, that just didn't make sense from a temperament standpoint given what sled dogs do, which is HAVE to be able to work with other dogs).  I didn't think that tying was the method of containment and that spacing was the issue with the fighting.  I get the space issue
 
I assume that breeders or mushers who have dogs at their homes on the off-season would prefer kennels as a containment method (I'm thinking of keeping the dogs safe from predators and people who might want to steal them)  Will they run off if you have to camp during the race, is that the reason for the tying them?

Keeping a dog that is going to have to sleep...tied out...on the trail during a race....in a kennel would only get it used to comforts it would not have on the trail. I assume by kennel you mean covered with access to an indoor area?
 
If you mean a free standing kennel with no cover and a dog house inside, say 10' x 4' x 6'....then I fail to see how that is different than being tied out with that radius and access to a lean to?
 
The dog is still confined...the dog is still exposed...the dog will still be cared for in the same way as to food, water, exercise.
 
Most pet dogs will run off if not tied or on a lead...lol so I don't know what that's about. These are not obedience trained dogs...they are racing dogs bred to race. Predators would be less of an issue with about 20 sets of eyes and ears watching...don't you agree? And also considering most people who live in Alaska are quite familiar with dangerous wildlife as relates to their safety and the safety of their animals. These dogs are valuable and if there were some serious danger then I would assume fort knox type kennels would be the norm. The fact that they aren't really speaks to the fact that they are not necessary.

I was thinking option #2 on the kennel in your quote above.  I have no problem with iditarod dogs, dogs doing what they were bred to do.  I just had a question on breed temperament because the information I had was that the dogs do not get along and must be tied down when they are off the sled harnesses (which makes no sense given that the dogs have to be able to work with other dogs).  I was thinking of kenneling more for a safety issue, say if folks wanted to swipe a sled dog or a bear, or wolf, or other type of alaskan wildlife were to find a sled dog a tasty snack. 

 I just had a question on breed temperament because the information I had was that the dogs do not get along and must be tied down when they are off the sled harnesses

 
 
Perhaps someone with experience in say, schutzhund ro mushing can explain better, my understanding is this:
 
Working dog temperament is generally drivey in some manner, and confident as well. While they are totally focused on their work...they do not always appreciate being approached by/interacting with other dogs while they carry it out.
 
If you have a team of dogs...there will be a pack order...I believe mushers encourage that...but they do not allow the dogs to maim one another...it helps sort the wheat from chaff when it comes to forming a team.
 
Basically even the lowest dog on the sled dog totem pole...is waaaay more alpha, drivey and interested in pack order than the average say, Cocker Spaniel would be...do you see?
 
To an outsider all these mouthy lunging dogs might seem aggressive...but in truth they are simply EXTREMELY keen to receive their "reward", which is work...and they see all other dogs as potential competition for that work/reward.
 
The Husky's bred to race...want to run FASTER, harder, and longer, than any other dog...and if you have a bunch of these dogs...then you probably have a good team...but they probably would not like each other overmuch when NOT racing...because they would be ultra competitive...which is what makes them such good working dogs to begin with.
 
In this instance I can see real harm coming from breeding softer temperaments into a line of racing dogs. If someone on the team is CONTENT with second, or fifth place....what good are they for racing?

In order for the dogs to remain in safe condition for the trail, and for racing, they have to live outside. Otherwise they would not be able to do what they are bred to do.

Sofia is a "sled dog" technically. But she's not *really* a sled dog because I don't race her, and she sleeps inside every night, goes with me in a heated car everywhere, hangs out with me while I teach students in a heated house. If she were to have to race she would die. She's not in condition.

They are extreme athletes. They must stay in top shape.

They are not aggressive. That can't be tolerated in a team. A dog that is dog aggressive is not a good dog and will be dropped from the team. Once again, it's counter-productive.

Sled dogs in a dog yard each have their own special run, it's like a cable run but it's circular. They each have their own doghouse filled with straw. I mean filled, not just some straw on the bottom. This insulates but provides ventilation, too. If you insulate it, the dogs freeze because their breath condenses and makes them wet. Notice that each dog house is on legs, off the ground. Much warmer that way.

People have been using dogs for hundreds of years and there are things that work and things that don't.

Here is a site with a picture of a dog yard:
http://www.muktuk.com/Summer/summertours.php

Here is another, and remember, these dogs are run several times a week or daily:
http://www.sleddogcentral.com/interviews/ramsay/main.htm

Wolves can be a problem every once in a while, and mushers I know have lit fires around their dog yards to keep wolves away. Wolves will kill dogs as they see them as competition. Bears generally leave dog yards alone. I say generally, because I'm sure somewhere there is someone who has had a problem with a bear, but it's not common.

MOOSE are the most dangerous thing on the trail. Moose see dogs as "wolf" and will try to stomp them to death. They also aren't known for yielding to a running team! [:@] In fact, moose hurt more people every year than any other animal in Alaska. The races are run in winter, and all the bears are asleep in the winter.

Let me repeat one more time: sled dogs are NOT aggressive.

Hey didn't I hear that a few years back that one guy had a whole team of standered poodles run it? It is amazing how versital some breeds can be! I know that lots of diffrent breeds run it but the main ones are huskies and malmutes. Of course like any other iron man races this can be dangerous but those are the chances you take.

You can watch the movie "Balto" He is the origanil lead dog that ran the first one. It is told as a kids storie but you can see why it is rembered to day. .you can read a short artical on it herehttp://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/sleddogs/balto.html. I think it is an awsome movie! Plus other movies that are good and are about sled dogs are "call of the wild"(of course), "sled dogs", and the new one that just came out eight below.

Sigh.  There is so much misinformation on this topic!
 
As a starting point, I encourage anyone who is interested to start by reading the official Iditarod rules.  You can DL them here:  [linkhttp://www.iditarod.com/learn/iditarodrules.html]http://www.iditarod.com/learn/iditarodrules.html[/link]  Jean also linked to some veterinary information provided by the Iditarod folks.  I think any fair reading of these documents will show that the health and safety of the dogs is a top priority for everyone.  I have never met a musher who is not concerned first with the health of his or her team.
 
Please keep in mind that these dogs are athletes doing what they are bred to do.  Have you ever seen BCs working sheep, or retrievers fetching?  That pure joy you see when the animal is totally focused on excelling at what it was meant to do . . . that is what you see when you watch sled dogs running.  You have never seen so many excited, eager dogs as you'll see right before a race begins.  They know what is coming and they are so excited they can barely control themselves.
 
Yes, it's a long way and it's cold and it's a lot of work.  A human could never run all that way.  So what?  These are sled dogs.  They are built for this.  (Yes, poodles can mush, but they can't be Iditarod dogs.  The race rules require the dogs to be northern sledding breeds.  Again this is for the dogs' protection.  It would be too cold and too long for a poodle to handle safely.)  Dogs are vet-checked before the race and at each check in point and any sick, ill, or tired animal cannot continue and is sent home instead.    Rarely, there is a death. Almost always, it could not have been predicted -- the dogs that are running are in top shape and under continuous vet care.  I've more than once seen tough, grizzled Alaskan men reduced to tears because a dog died on the trail.  Mushers love their dogs, just like we do.  And they generally are devoted to the dogs and lead a dog-centered existence.  The top mushers run kennels and they literally devote their lives to breeding, raising, and training these working dogs.  And on the trail, mushers depend on these dogs, for their lives.  They do not want to run them past their limits, allow them to fight with each other, or give them inadequate care. 
 
As Jean has described, there are some specialized handling practices for cold-weather working dogs -- and these generally don't include include letting 30 huskies-in-training sleep on anybody's living room couch!  But please don't mistake something that seems unusual for indifference to the dogs' welfare. 
 

Actually there WERE standard poodles in the iditarod from 1988 to 1991 run by John Suter . So I guess that the rules changed a bit since than. 

ORIGINAL: politepuppyobedience

Actually there WERE standard poodles in the iditarod from 1988 to 1991 run by John Suter . So I guess that the rules changed a bit since than. 

 
Wow, I didn't know that.  I just checked the rules and it says all dogs must be "suitable for arctic travel"  as determined by the race officials.  I had thought there was language specifically saying northern breeds but I guess that isn't correct, this year at least.  Bring on the mushing poodles! 
 
I stand by the rest of my statements though. 

Okay, did you start this thread just to give out bogus information? Remember, not everything you read on the internet is correct! There are some very twisted anti-sledding sites out there. Before you go any further with this I think you need to visit Alaska so you know what you are talking about.

 
Are you familiar with "Lisa Frederic"?
She was an understudy to "Jeff King", she also ran "Salem"...the "Coolest Sled Dog".......[]
 
I read her book, are you calling her a liar?[8D] Just wondering.......

totaly agree with you on the rest[] 

Ummmmm, back to your corners?
 
I made an innocent comment this morning and felt that the response I got was a bit on the sharp side, now more?
 
Guys, we don't need to start sniping at one another.......

sledding poodle link:
 
[linkhttp://home.gci.net/~poodlesleddog/]http://home.gci.net/~poodlesleddog/[/link]
 
Somewhere there used to be a pic of a team of basenjis pulling a sled.  Of course neither I nor my badsenjis suggest doing that.

Oh to run the Idatarod.  But alas, I doubt Crusher could do it on his own, although he would certainly try. lol

Huskies are very social animals.  They function well as a pack.  And as with any pack, fighting is not well tolerated.  But if you tie two dogs out where they can reach each other, playing will ensue, which leads to tangling, which in turn leads to fighting.  ANY dogs, not just huskies.  Plus when they stop for breaks, the dogs need to rest.  And they won't if they are not seperated.  Heck some won't even drink unless you bait thier water.  They just want to keep going.  Also, like packs of wolves they often do not tolerate other packs well.  This is the reason that you must pull over and let another team pass if they approach you from behind.  It is a rule in the Idatarod.  Because if the teams were allowed to run alongside each other, fights could happen. 

Anyway, as it is, the race will go on, and I will pull for "Lance Mackey"................[8D]
 
A link from the HSUS , read it if you want......
 
 
[linkhttp://www.hsus.org/pets/issues_affecting_our_pets/facts_about_the_iditarod.html]http://www.hsus.org/pets/issues_affecting_our_pets/facts_about_the_iditarod.html[/link]