I need some guidance on what to do with my chow

    • Gold Top Dog
    The first thing people swtich to is lamb and rice kibble.  If that doesn't work, go to Duck or Fish formulas.  I had good luck with Solid Gold Fish and Oatmeal.
     
    Nutro does have BHT or used to have, a bad ingrident.  It was about the 3rd food I swtiched to to cure my dogs yeast.  It helped, but not enough like you. 
     
    MAke sure the food has NO CORN, WHEAT or SOY or BYPRODUCTS or BHT or EXTHOYXLIN (sp)
     
    Give fish oil or cod liver oil helps the coat and joints,,,,its cheap. Give a can of salmon or mackeral every week,,,,add some eggs at least a couple a week 
     
    [linkhttp://www.nzymes.com]www.nzymes.com[/link]   sells a suppplement and alos gives a list of "accepted" foods,,,Nutro is not on the list.  Keep in mind, feeding better food = less poop= more nutrients going in the dog,,and you feed less of it, so it costs about the same
     
    Prednisone??? - that is bad bad for the immune system.   A good multivitiam will help.
     
    Don't quote me,,,but I think chows can be shaved,,,,however, some dogs cant' grow the hair back,,,so double check on that.. 
     
    • Gold Top Dog
    Nutro does have BHT or used to have, a bad ingrident

     
    No, it doesn't.
     
    There is so much confusion here, I didn't see if he was OK with your other dog and your fiance.  If he's not, this is going to be that much more difficult. 

    I do know of a great chow rescue and another board that deals only with chows.  So, PM me if you want the names.  I might be able to help with the other issues too.  I just shaved Willow in June and she's almost in full coat again, for one. 
    • Gold Top Dog
    Mickeyboo, first let me say I am so glad you have come here looking for help for Boo. Willowchow will be a wonderful resource for you as she has been through a lot with her dog and has done a great job! It does sound as if Boo has some physical/medical problems which are definately going to icontribute to his aggression. I would start there immediately.

    I know you will be able to make progress with Boo. Put your plans on hold for the time being. With the advice and support of this forum you will definately find you have more options for both yours and Boos future.

    Good Luck and keep posting!
    • Gold Top Dog
    There isn't much I can tell you aside from either you need to stay put and keep up with this committment to your dog and have your fiance move, or seriously reconsider what kind of man asks his girlfriend to give up her dog so he doesn't have to drive a few extra miles to work.
     
    Also, what your dog is doing is shedding not shredding.  Nutro Max is the lowest end of the Nutro product line IMO, and I'd get him on something a bit better if possible.  Don't shave your Chow unless it would help his skin allergies.  Dogs use their coats to keep cool.
    • Gold Top Dog
    As others have said, the shedding, odor, and skin problems of your Chow all point to allergies. You can do a lot better than Nutro for sure. If you are interested in raw feeding, raw is cheaper than kibble according to sources I've read. But there are plenty of healthy, allergy-friendly kibbles out there that won't kill your wallet.
     
    The aggression could be caused by a number of totally resolveable issues - his health problems, the fact that he's a guarding breed kept tied outside, possibly even unknown health issues like a thyroid imbalance. I would urge to you to take the time to try to help Boo. If he's worth it your boyfriend will still be there and still want you to move in after Boo is sorted out.
     
    I'm not dating this guy but I really have to agree with mudpuppy - any dude that would ask me to kill my dog would be out on his ear before he got the words out.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Boo definitely isn't healthy. Prednisone is a steroid that's basically a "band aid", it helps somewhat, but only masks the symptoms and doesn't cure anything. The FIRST thing I would do is switch his food! Here are the ingredients for Nutro Max Natural:

    Ingredients:
    Chicken Meal, Wheat Flour, Ground Whole Wheat, Rice Bran, Poultry Fat(Preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of natural vitamin E), Corn Gluten Meal, Ground Rice, Lamb Meal, Natural Flavors, Yeast Culture, Calcium Carbonate, Monosodium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Dried Buttermilk, Dried Kelp, Dried Egg Product, Lecithin, Zinc Sulfate, Iron Sulfate, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Oxide, Garlic, Ascorbic Acid (source of vitamin C), Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin A Supplement, Manganous Oxide, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Riboflavin (source of vitamin B2), Calcium Iodate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (source of vitamin K activity), Folic Acid, Copper Sulfate. 
     
    Wheat is a VERY common allergen in dogs, corn is also a frequent allergen, yeast culture is not something I would feed to an allergic dog. [&:] It really sounds to me like Boo has a systemic yeast infection. Has your veterinarian done any type of bacteria or yeast culture? Shaving Boo might actually be beneficial for giving him medicated bathes to really get down to his skin and let it "breathe" between baths. You do have to be careful because if he spends any time in the sun, he will actually be hotter because the sun will beat down directly on his skin. Also in the wintertime he wouldn't have any protection against the cold...
     
    The food I would personally recommend you switch Boo over to is Chicken Soup for the Dog Lover's Soul. It's the same price as Nutro and the ingredients are much, much better. I think it's the best food in the price range. [:)] Here are the ingredients for that food:
     
    [color=black]Chicken, turkey, chicken meal, turkey meal, whole grain brown rice, whole grain white rice, oatmeal, potatoes, cracked pearled barley, millet, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), duck, salmon, egg product, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, kelp, potassium chloride, salt, choline chloride, chicory root extract, carrots, peas, apples, dried skim milk, cranberry powder, rosemary extract, parsley flake. Vitamins and minerals. 
     
    And the website:
     
    [linkhttp://www.chickensoupforthepetloverssoul.com/]http://www.chickensoupforthepetloverssoul.com/[/link]
     
    You may also want to add a fish oil supplement. It has omega 3's which are VERY helpful in reducing inflammatory reactions due to allergies and also reducing shedding. It's basically one of the healthiest supplements you could add to your dog's diet. I use Grizzly Salmon Oil and I think they have it at Petco.
     
    [linkhttp://www.grizzlypetproducts.com/salmon_oil/salmon_oil.html]http://www.grizzlypetproducts.com/salmon_oil/salmon_oil.html[/link]
     
    I really think that helping him to get healthier will help a lot. He won't shed and smell and will no doubt feel a lot better.
     
    You definitely need professional help for his aggression also. It isn't always that expensive. You could probably find a good behaviorist to come to your house and work one on one with you for less than $100....
     [/color]
    Wanted to add that I agree with Jones about having Boo's thyroid checked. Hypothyroidism can cause health problems AND aggression.

    • Gold Top Dog
    I just wanted to add that if Willow didn't have the issues with her health that she does and could eat anything it would be Eagle Pack fish.  I understand chows do really well with fish based diets and I've seen nothing but shining examples of coats and skin on dogs that get it. 
     
    You definitely need professional help for his aggression also. It isn't always that expensive. You could probably find a good behaviorist to come to your house and work one on one with you for less than $100....  

     
    I doubt that very much, a trainer maybe or a self proclaimed behaviorist, but not a DVM behaviorist (which is IMHO what she would need with the breed of dog and the level of aggression)
    • Gold Top Dog
    Unfortunately, if your dog is really dangerous, you have two options, as I see it.  You keep your house, and your dog, andperhaps lose your boyfriend.  Or, you euthanize your dog. You cannot, in good conscience, transfer those aggression problems to a new and possibly unsuspecting owner.  Reputable rescues generally do not take dogs that have caused puncture wounds on humans, especially if they've done so more than once.  Looks like you have a tough choice to make.  And, you might as well make it, because this guy who doesn't want your dog to start with *really* won't want him around if you ever have kids...

    • Gold Top Dog
    I'm with Mudpuppy and Jones.  Roxie and Trixie are going to be with me until they cross the bridge.  If I had to choose between my girls and a romantic interest, the choice would be quite easy.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Unfortunately, if your dog is really dangerous, you have two options, as I see it.  You keep your house, and your dog, andperhaps lose your boyfriend.  Or, you euthanize your dog. You cannot, in good conscience, transfer those aggression problems to a new and possibly unsuspecting owner.  Reputable rescues generally do not take dogs that have caused puncture wounds on humans, especially if they've done so more than once.  Looks like you have a tough choice to make.  And, you might as well make it, because this guy who doesn't want your dog to start with *really* won't want him around if you ever have kids...


    Thanks, Anne, for cutting through the thicket of emotion here.

    I went through something kind of similar--I had to figure out what to do with a truly dangerous dog. And the bottom line is that attempting to rehome a dangerous dog is irresponsible. Rehoming is stressful for dogs. Dangerous, unpredictable dogs that are rehomed are going to get worse, not better. The chances of someone getting hurt are excellent.

    I would sit down and answer these questions for myself:

    1. Is the dog dangerous?
    2. Have I done everything I can to make the dog not dangerous?

    (IMO, this would mean seeing an allergist, switching his food, and consulting with a behaviorist and doing what they say and seeing what happens. I know that this is expensive and takes time, but dogs are expensive and take time)

    3. Can I continue to keep up this lifestyle that I have, in which I care for a dangerous dog?

    Having a dangerous dog is a serious liability and a real emotional strain. I can see why BF does not want to get involved with this--no one in their right mind takes on a dangerous dog willngly. Having a private yard is essential, even if the allergies get cleared up and the dog smells good. So is learning as much as possible about the dog and his behavior, so that the threat to others is minimized (this means more money on a trainer/behaviorist, sorry). Dilligence about fixing the fence, closing gates, etc. is critical. The stress of making sure the dog is safe is important to consider here. I would ask myself if I can and want to keep that up, because the cost of becoming relaxed about it if the dog is dangerous is high.

    4. Who are all the stakeholders in this problem, and what do they want and need?

    This was very important to us when we were making this decision. We realized that we needed to think about:

    Our dog
    Us
    Our Community Of Other Dogs And People

    And we realized that because we don't have a yard, and because we got a dog because we spend a lot of time in shared dog-friendly spaces, that in order to keep the dog we would have to alter our lives tremendously and that we could not guarantee the complete safety of our community because we had to take her outside at least three times a day to go to the bathroom and did not trust ourselves not to slip up on all the muzzling, double-leashing, etc. that the behaviorist recommended.

    A note to all the folks who are telling the OP that she is discarding her dog and basically being dismissive of her dilemma and her BF:

    If this dog is dangerous, then you are not being helpful. It's a really complicated decision that requires balancing your responsibility as a dog owner with your responsibility to having a life of your own and keeping your community safe.



    • Gold Top Dog
    I agree, and you need to remember that, unlike Pits, the Chow isn't a breed that is normally friendly to humans it doesn't know.  That's a huge liability if you consider that this is a woman of childbearing age, just starting out in life.  She needs to consider the lifestyle she will be leading for the next 10-15 years.
    If the dog were one that simply air snaps, or doesn't puncture when she nips/bites, then my advice would be different.  If the dog is "dangerous", i.e. a confirmed biter that does damage when she bites, the answer is clear - keep and manage strictly, or euthanize her so that she can at least die in a loving pair of arms.  If you try to rehome, and she hurts someone, she probably will meet the same fate, only you won't be the one kissing her and hugging her as she goes...and you must live with the fact that you unleashed a biter on the public.  The larger issue is that this is a breed that is also in danger on some BSL lists, and you are not doing other Chow owners a favor if she gets into trouble.
    • Gold Top Dog
    thank you all for your help, advices and support. All of you have great ideas and are very helpful.
     
    fisher6000 and spiritdogs have it lay out the bad/good for me very clearly and are on the same page with my fiance. Willowchow, you're very supportive and I admire you for the your love of chows.
    I'm going through a great confusion and you all help me sort things out easier.
    Boo is a loving dog--to people he knows well and expose to everyday. BUT, he is in a "dangerous" catagory to people or animals that he doesn't know. And I KNOW for a fact that if he gets loose and see a little child, the possibility that he would attack that child is not small. I've thought about rehoming Boo but as most already said, he'll probably end up in the same fate if he attacks someone.
    I've had him for 6 years and have tried to train him, switched food continuously, washed him often...but nothing really have changed. His aggression is VERY unpreditable. He could be friendly with you for a moment and the next ..it's a different story. When I took him to his vet and he  saw other big dogs he turned crazy and tried to attack them. His vet keep telling me to give him predesoin (sp??) and keep trying to sell me medicated shampoo and dog food but didn't suggest anything else. I've tried their suggested dog food but it didn't help and it got really expensive.
    I truly don't think his health has to do greatly with his aggression because when he bites he truly bites/attacks. We had to use force to pull him away. Like I said, he looks like he's going insane when he already has his teeth on something/someone.
    I had a long talk with my fiance last night and he's VERY worried if Boo is coming to his complex. Since he lives in a small complex and everyone in his complex has at least one dog, and rooms are back to back of each other, there isn't much space to walk Boo away from people/other dogs.
     
    I know I am in a very tough situation. I need time to digest and have my mind clear. Thank you all for your support and advices. Much appreciated.
    • Gold Top Dog
    You have my sympathy, mickeyboo. Sometimes it's very hard to weigh what we want for our animals against our available options. Anne and fisher have the right of it. You need to sit down and really think about what will be best for you, your fiance and your dog. I suggest writing down your priorities and writing down your options and trying to work out how best to meet your priorities with the options available to you. I always find that writing lists or flow charts is really useful to get things straight in my mind when I'm making very tough decisions with long-reaching consequences. It helps to put your priorities in order and work out what it is that you want most.

    I know that sometimes we end up with animals that we're poorly equipped to deal with. Those of us that love animals have trouble leaving one to suffer, even if we're not in a very good position to help it. My life was turned upside down when I took on a baby wild hare only a week old. Sometimes I cried, sometimes I got hardly any sleep, I was relying heavily on friends and my housemate to feed him when I couldn't be there, to watch him when I couldn't take him with me and all that. I was in over my head and didn't know what I was doing. No one could help me because no one knows anything about wild hares. Looking back, it was a nightmare and I didn't have the time to look after him or the facilities to house him. But, I got through it, somehow. Sometimes I thought I would have to let my hare go because he wasn't happy with me, and that made me pretty upset. In the end, I persisted with him and I'm extremely glad I did. I don't regret taking him in, even though I was not in a good position in the slightest to take good care of him. I made time, though, somehow. If the time and resources aren't there, though, then there's not much else you can do. You have to decide if you can defy the odds and find the time and money and strength to help Boo. I certainly wouldn't hold it against you if you decided you couldn't manage. Only you can tell if you can make it work or not.
    • Gold Top Dog
    thanks corvus...
    I'm actually making a pros/cons list today and it doesnt look good [:(].
    There are more cons than pros. Because I know Boo and how aggressive he can be to strangers...my option to rehome him is crossed out. I dont want anyone to get hurt, especially if his new home has kids.
    I do want to take that big step in living together with my fiance for my future, but chances Boo will bark and try to attack people who walk by the apartment is excellent-if he's in the patio. And I don't blame my fiance for not willing to take him. I know it's a serious liability to have Boo in a small community where ;people are walking outside most of the time. If he wants to get loose from the leash, he can very easily since his strength is greater than mine.
    I dont have many options left. [:(] . Either I keep my house, forget about my future marriage and keep Boo until he gets old/sick and die.. or until he attacks the next victim then I euthanize him??? I don't have much choices.
    • Gold Top Dog
    ORIGINAL: mickeyboo

    Either I keep my house, forget about my future marriage and keep Boo until he gets old/sick and die.. or until he attacks the next victim then I euthanize him??? I don't have much choices.


    Why is there not an option to have a behaviorist help you work on his problems? I understand that it may be expensive, but people do find a way for something that's really important to them.
     
    As far as Boo smelling bad and having health issues, you didn't mention which other foods you've tried.... the food that I recommended, Chicken Soup for the Dog Lover's Soul is LESS expensive than Science Diet and most other foods.
     
    It really sounds like you already know what you want to do... you have your heart set on moving in with your fiancee and Boo doesn't fit into that equation. In that case, ;please don't wait for him to attack another person. Please do EVERYONE a favor (Boo included) and have him euthanized before any other incidents occur. It isn't fair for someone to be traumatized and attacked by your dog, and it's obviously a very stressful thing for him to go through also. If you aren't willing to work with him, then honestly I do think the kindest thing is the put him to sleep.