Urgent--Willow's hurt

Oh Willow!  The good news is that she's going to heal now.  Being on anti anxiety drugs aren't that bad.  She may not have to be on them forever.  They may just give you a chance to work on her anxiety issues without the internal noise in her head.  I hope that makes sense.

Lori, I don't think its a bad idea...who knows...she might just forget about biting herself or chasing her tail after being on the meds for a while...and then you can take her off..little by little.  I can't see them really hurting her to be honest.  And you can control them...give her less if you see she doesnt' seem to need them as much.
I think its an interesting thing though....Bubby never did that..but she does get out of control when people walk in the house sometimes...AND loud noises either SCARE her or make her mad....AND she does chase her tail when she gets really out of control....wondering if its the same kind of thing.  HHHmmm! 

OK, here's the drug and some information about it.  Anyone use it or have any thoughts? 

Also, she's completely clueless about the e-collar.  I had to take it off.  She put the cone down on the floor and just stood there!  How can I leave that on, she'll suffocate!  I'm going to order her a newer, soft one because she definately needs it until we figure out what we are going long term.  DH wants her to have her tail shortened.  I'm not thrilled with the idea of a surgery of any kind.  And, neither of us are thrilled with the medication. 

The vet did a nice job shaving her tail!  She left all the fur except the tip.  So, she's got this rat tail sticking out of all the fluff.  I've got to get a picture. 

Anyway, thanks!


[linkhttp://www.clomicalm.novartis.us/index.shtml]http://www.clomicalm.novartis.us/index.shtml[/link]

 
LOOK WHAT I FOUND ON THE WEBSITE--The effectiveness and clinical safety of CLOMICALM Tablets for long-term use (i.e., for more than 12 weeks) has not been evaluated.

Lori- That is the same drug I mentioned my parents dog was on for about a year or so. It worked absolute WONDERS for their dog!!

If I remember correctly they do have to do liver tests periodically, but he never had any problems. Again, after about a year or so they were able to take him off of it and has never had to have it again.

 I think this might be a good thing for Willow. I am still considering asking my vet about it for a short term thing for Prudence until she gets over her fears and anxiety enough to get through a day! I am going to wait a month so that she has time to adjust to her new home and then evaluate if I need to ask the vet about it.   It might be just the thing Willow needs????  

Really, so he was on it for a year? 

I was going to say that there was a good article on anxiety in the Whole Dog Journal, but someone beat me to it!  I have about 5 years worth of issues, so I'll be glad to find it and snail-mail it to you, Lori.  Just PM me.  I don't have any experience with medications, but I share your concerns, especially when they don't have extended trials and studies for them.  I'd rather try other things like herbals, massage, etc.  The article addresses all the options, traditional and alternative, if I remember correctly.
 
I know you must be in such conflict trying to figure out which option(s) to do.  I wish I had a clear answer for you!  In the meantime, I'll track down that article and have it ready if you'd like it, or I can summarize key points in a post.

Does anyone use any type of anxiety medications and if so how did they work, were there side effects?? 

Gizzy has some anxiety issues (on top of everything else [>:]) and I use a holistic approce to help her calm down when she needs it, no side effect.  First I got the anxiety drops from my vet and they worked alright but for the price and size of the little bottle I thought there had to be something better.  I looked at the ingredence and it was mostly camomill.  So now I make comomill tea for Giz and it works.  I asked the vet and she said there was nothing wrong with that.  Without the tea Gizmo is crazy, barks at anthing that makes a noise, will run around the house and will even growl at the window as if something is out there.  With a little help of the calming tea she is more relaxed and not so hyper all the time.  I still carrie the drop with me just in case I need them and don't have time to make the tea.  I just buy the flower in bulk from an herb store, it's really cheap that way. I  let it seep in hot water then ore it over Gizzys food every morning.
 
Just wanted to add about the tail bleeding, I might be a little late in saying this but it's kinda important.  Often with dogs who have long fur and thick undercoats the blood gets stuck deep in the fur and can burn the skin if left in there.  Kinda like diper rash in a way.  So just make shure all the blood is cleened off, proxide is safe to use to get blood out and works great, just keep away from the eyes.  I really hope Williow is better soon, would hate to see that nice fluffy tail taken away.

Lori,,,Calli talks about Valerian,,,,why dont you give that a try?  But I do remember looking that up a couple of years ago and read where they don't know the long term on that either. They probably don't on a lot of things..but again, maybe Willow won't be on anything for very long.  You can try to wean her off of anything after a while and see how she does...and if needed go back on.

I sure hope she heals up quickly, poor little girl!
I was wondering, did the vet prescribe any pain medication?

Thank you everyone.  I get the Whole Dog Journal so I have that issue.  I think maybe I'll try her on it temporarily.  I thought long and hard about holistic last night.  She's got so much aggression and anxiety I really don't think it's going to be enough to help her. 
 
The tail is all cleaned up and very nicely shaved just at the area.  I'll try to get a picture, there's no blood in her undercoat.  No, she didn't give any pain medication just antibiotic.  I don't think she wants her to feel like it's fine, then she'll re-bite it. 
 
Anyway, thanks. 
 
 

I'm really glad Willow is doing better. That was kind of scary.

I have a friend whose dog has been on anxiety meds for ages - must be four years now. She uses a combination of Prozac and something else, I forget. The something else was a short term thing, which he only goes on now for acute episodes. This dog was a real mess, and she's come a huge long way with him.

The use of mood modification meds with dogs has advanced mightily in the last few years. If the clomicalm doesn't work, I highly recommend a visit to a behaviorist who is accredited and reputable in the use of prescriptions. If you cringe at the expense, just consider what you've spent and also consider that veterinary behaviorists are looking for a cure if possible, rather than just treating symptoms. I can get a reference for a vet. behaviorist in your area if you are interested in persuing that option.

Really, so he was on it for a year?

ORIGINAL: willowchow

Yes, maybe a little over a year. The dog is now 15 and didn't actually go on this drug until 12 or so (they found him running the streets around age 10).  My mom's health is very poor and my dad cares for her and he started to have a few health problems. Dad felt that something had to be done about Zippy (named appropriately!) or else they wouldn't be able to keep him and they knew he would be put down. The vet suggested clomicalm and it worked miracles for them. He also could adjust it a little each day until so that if he had a vet visit, grooming or something else, they could give bit more. His liver results were fine the whole time he was on it. Finally they just kept reducing the amount until he was off of it and he didn't need it anymore. He still has some anxious days, but he is in much better shape. They all are much happier now!
 
 I honestly think it might be worth a try. Especially if you have a good relationship with your vet and you can voice your concerns throughout this process.

Has anyone heard of the DAP difusser? It is apparently effective in calming anxiety in dogs.  In addition to the therapy there are trainers that can work with you and the dog to reduce the anxiety.

I am glad to hear Willow is on the mend.  I don't have any experience with anxiety meds for dogs.  I do know that dogs don't like the Elizabethian (sp?) collars.  They sure do act like it is the end of the world if they have to wear them but I don't think they could suffocate themselves.
barbara

I tried the Comfort Zone DAP thingy, and I didn't notice a difference in my dog.  However, I did some research on it, and I guess it either WORKS, as in a complete turnaround, or it doesn't.  Guess it didn't work for our dog for separation anxiety.  It's also a wee bit expensive - about $30 for the diffuser and first bottle and about $20/bottle thereafter; ours ran out in 3 weeks even though I guess it can last 4 weeks. 
 
However, I will say that Sammy's been on clomipramine (clomicalm) for 3 or 4 weeks now and the change is amazing!  He went from barking and howling anytime he was alone, and trying to get out of his crate so badly that he injured himself  to actually laying down in his crate and not doing more than a few minutes of whining here and there.  This medication REALLY made a difference in him with anxiety.  I do understand that the risk of complications/side effects goes up the longer it is in use; but, it is used in humans as well and I would guess longer than 12 weeks, so that makes me believe that as long as you do routine blood checks.  Our vet wouldn't prescribe the medication without first doing the blood work.  And usually the dog can be weaned off anywhere from 1 month to a year or so - someone at our training class used it for one month then weaned over one month and was fine, others take a bit longer.  And with some training to overcome the anxiety - desensitizing - it usually can be dnoe fairly quickly (under 6 months I would say).
 
Our vets meds were about $80/month (25 mg, 2x day) but my parent's dog is on it too and she pays $15/month (75 mg, 1x day).  Eckerd, CVS and other pharmacies also carry it and much cheaper than my vet was.  Also 1800petmeds is FDA approved and certifies all their meds and they have it cheaper. 
 
I have the package insert with all the info on clomipramine if you want to know more about the side effects and the trials that were done.  It was on the effects of humans, though since I didn't get it from the vet.  But I'm sure you can find that online for dogs as well. 
 
good luck and hoping to Willow feeling better! []