For anyone who may ever look for a job or who has hired someone - (Callie [:^)] )

Ok...here is my pet peeve!   People that apply for a position no matter what kind of position in wrinkled clothes....flip flops....shorts...dirty or un combed hair.... holes in the jeans.....   It doesnt matter if you have fancy clothes or not...come in looking clean and respectful.  I find that so many people...mostly younger people have forgotten or never knew the meaning of good impressions.

I was on the search committee that hired the Executive Director for a fairly large organization in our community.  As we expected in this current job market, we were flooded with applications.  The easiest part of the entire search process was eliminating dozens of applicants right from the start.  We were amazed at how many people applied when they clearly did not have most (or any) of the qualifications we said were required for the job.  Others failed to include one or more of the documents we said must be submitted.  Those applicants were tossed aside immediately.  Why do those people think they can waste your time (and theirs)?

There were a couple applicants who had minor errors (spelling/grammar) in their application package, and for some committee members, that was a deal-breaker, but others cut them some slack.  One person was exactly what we were looking for, so we interviewed her anyway.  She was equally impressive in person, and she ended up being a finalist.  So, for us, the result of their poor proofreading depended on how desirable they looked on paper otherwise.

It is true that the eye will read words correctly, even if they are misspelled.  Eons ago when I was in public accounting and we proofread annual reports for clients, we had proofreading teams of two people, and we read documents aloud to each other.  We also read them a second time backwards.  That didn't help with grammar or sentence structure errors, but this was in the days before spell-check, so it did help your eye spot a misspelled word.

I'm reminded of a co-worker whose name was Sean.  His last name began with an R, followed by a difficult-to-pronounce batch of vowels, more R's and an S.  Before he added both his names to the Word dictionary, the spell check replaced his name at the end of his business letters with "Sea Restorer."  He didn't notice it until he went to sign the letter; luckily he never mailed one out like that! 

P.S. - I didn't proofread this long post -- but I'm not applying for a job here, right?! 

Jackie, your reply must've been posting as I was composing mine, so I just now read it. 

I do agree with you that there are very good employees to be found out there, despite their lack of a particular skill or qualification.  I'm sure most of us have had jobs where we had to learn how to do something AFTER we were hired since we lacked previous experience in that area.  I, too, would rather hire an enthusiastic employee who I can train as needed, instead of a perfectly qualified one who has a bad attitude.

Having said that, I do think it's different for certain types of jobs.  In the case of our search for an Executive Director -- this was the top professional leader of the organization, ultimately responsible and accountable for all operations, visible in the community, etc.  The time and expense it took to do the search process meant that we couldn't risk bringing in someone without the experience we needed and find ourselves having to search again if they didn't work out.  We couldn't wait for someone to learn new skills as they worked for a few months; we needed someone who could "hit the ground running."  So, our general feeling was that an applicant who couldn't meet the minimum requirements or follow the basic directions for submitting documentation was not the best choice.

I have to say that interviewing (on either side of the table) can be so incredibly stressful and difficult!  I can't imagine being an HR professional who does it all the time! 

Unfortunately, many job applications and resume's don't get to the hiring authority.  A clerk or assistant receives them first, with the task of eliminating most of the applications.  Any flaw is a reason for elimination, when you have one position to fill and hundreds of applications to review.

tacran

I do think it's different for certain types of jobs. 

Yes, I agree completely.  Some jobs just don't allow time to train someone no matter what their level of enthusiasm and desire to learn might be.

Interviewing is stressful for either side of the table.  It's very hard to tell someone that they aren't what we're looking for after they've told you how desperately they need to work to support their family. 

JackieG

It's very hard to tell someone that they aren't what we're looking for after they've told you how desperately they need to work to support their family. 

Maybe this is why some bring their families with them - so you can see how badly they need the job. 

***note to self: leave DS home when going to interview.  He does not appear malnourished.

sharismom

JackieG

It's very hard to tell someone that they aren't what we're looking for after they've told you how desperately they need to work to support their family. 

Maybe this is why some bring their families with them - so you can see how badly they need the job. 

***note to self: leave DS home when going to interview.  He does not appear malnourished.

LMBO!  Maybe that was the reason but somehow I don't think so in this case. 

Jackie you are honestly 'getting' exactly my point.  This isn't a situation where we're getting hundreds of applications - it's all by word of mouth, and frankly the boss really *wants* to hire someone who really needs the job. 

I've always liked to work temp to perm because I want you to hire *me* not just paper.  I'm not gorgeous and I don't always interview well (cos I talk too much -- can you imagine??? *lightning bolt*) but I'm a hard worker.

What started me on this is the fact that I honestly feel frustrated that ... well, I think some folks are SO desperate for work that they try to "sell" themselves everywhere.  That's not anyone's lack of brains -- that's simply a byproduct of the heinous financial situation so many folks are in so they feel forced to do everything fast and rushed because they feel pressed to the max.

I need someone willing to work and learn.  Like Jackie says -- someone who is willing to learn and willing to work?  Man -- that's the person we want!  Just give me the best few minutes you can in an interview and be sincere.  But just whipping off an email to "keep in contact" doesn't help you if it looks done in haste because you still had to get to 75 others.

Hope that makes sense.

I've never had to hire anyone but have had many interviews. I try and dress decently but explain that I own shedding dogs so yes there is some dog hair. I do like an interviewer to tell me what I did wrong and why I didn't get the position. When I got my current job, I was told that the last two girls were fired because of such and such and only lasted 2 weeks because of it. I have now been there since May and every time a complaint came up, I fixed the issue as soon as possible. Infact my boss isn't one to hand out compliments but I've earned 3 so far.

And yes.. I have been requested that I leave my dogs at home when coming to work. LOL. It's a small town and I'm well known for always having a dog at my side.

We did an interview last round of this woman who was really good and qualified but at the end, she basically interviewed us.  She had nine questions typed out, and they were not questions like "what is the starting salary?" they were like essay-type questions.  It took WAY too much time and by the time she left we were all exhausted.  Also it seemed like she was directing a lot of her answers to me since I'm the only female on my team and one of few females in my entire department.  At the end I said she seems very nice and qualified but I honestly can't work with someone like that!

We always have trouble hiring because I work for a HelpDesk (computer support) so we tend to get a majority of applicants that have a lot of technical training and skills but (sorry for the stereotype) are very introverted computer nerds that can't actually work with people.  This last time we stressed looking at people with retail experience.  As long as someone is not afraid of computers, we can get them all the technical training they need, but being able to help people is a skill you have or you don't.

In a nut shell, interviews are a one shot audition to get the foot in the door.  If its not perfection there will be another resume or letter that is.  Its a dog eat dog world right now in the job market.

Even if a person is "Super Worker," the slightest error or omission or mis-spoken word can be enough to move on to the next candidate. 

CoBuHe

Even if a person is "Super Worker," the slightest error or omission or mis-spoken word can be enough to move on to the next candidate. 

absolutely agree - and although I 'get' that typos and IQ aren't related - the fact is at the very least you are beyond careless to send out a letter with your own name mis-typed. (especially when there were many other mistakes in the letter)

I work with people who are changing jobs/careers and looking for work and am stunned at the sort of things I have to work on with them.  From the client that is going to interviews in disheveled attire to the one (mentioned above) that is applying for jobs in which they do not meet the essential criteria to the one who doesn't write cover letters and the one that may be dyslexic or a horribly typist or careless or hasn't heard of spell check or who knows............

In the current job market giving the hiring body ANY reason to eliminate you is writing your own exit from the process.  In my work with employers and HR dept's the goal isn't finding people, it is eliminating people, as even small jobs are getting huge numbers of applicants.

Sadly Jackie I don't think that even 5% of jobs are open to the process you described. Getting an interview is tremendously difficult so no matter how enthusiastic one is not having the necessary skills and not being able to prove it in the application process is going to eliminate you. It is sad but it is what it is (at least around here where there is an overpopulation of educated and unemployed).

Add in that many companies are doing online applications with the initial scanning process being done via software that does key word searches and by golly typo, misspelling or other cause of mangling a word and you won't get through the initial software scan.

When am part of the hiring process at my current job and when I help others prepare applications, IMO the most important thing is the cover letter.  Unfortunately, this seems to be the thing applicants are most likely to do a bad job with or just not submit at all.  Writing a cover letter is like its own form of a mathematical equation and art all in one.  I did choose to interview a few prospects based on their cover letters, in fact one of the people I last helped interview had one of the best cover letters I've ever seen (and I write cover letters for other people).  To be honest I barely looked at the resumes unless I felt it would clarify something.  The cover letter is where you can sell yourself if you haven't had any "face time". 

To anyone out there looking for a job, if you graduated from college or university the least thing you can do is have their career services dept review your resume and cover letter.  I believe most schools do this for free for their alumni (it looks good when their alumni get jobs).

kpwlee

Sadly Jackie I don't think that even 5% of jobs are open to the process you described.

Not in most large companies but many small businesses do things quite differently than the big corporations, etc.  I know so many small business owners who have our same hiring philosophy.  Our biggest challenge is finding people who want to work with their hands.  So many people want to be white collar workers that finding people for the skilled trades is getting harder and harder.  It's something discussed in many venues such as dealer meetings, trade shows and seminars. I'm all for people getting a college education but not everyone is cut out for a white collar job. 

ETA   It saddens me to know that we are moving away from the small business format in this country because that's the work horse that this country was built on. 

JackieG

 I'm all for people getting a college education but not everyone is cut out for a white collar job. 

lots of small businesses here are using hiring companies though - I know of very little face to face opportunities which is what makes things so very, very difficult for people trying to get a job. Especially displaced older employees who only know the previous more personal way of getting a position