Dachshound breeding question.

kimlauren

BEVOLASVEGAS--Apparently another spelling critic with a false sense of importance.

Actually, I'm not one of the normal "spelling critics."  I was just a bit concerned for the potential pups.  If a breeder isn't intelligent enough to spell "their" breed.  I become very concerned that they are not intelligent enough to care for pups.  OBVIOUSLY, in your case, I am wrong.

My concern is, & will always be, the dogs.  I help with rescue, so I see a large number of pups who are produced for stupid reasons.  ie..my dog is old & I wanted a replacement that would be just like him/her.  i wanted my kids to experience the joys of birth.  i only wanted one puppy, but she had 4, & i don't want these other 3.  I could on & on, but I doubt that it would make any difference.

 

 

BEVOLASVEGAS

kimlauren

BEVOLASVEGAS--Apparently another spelling critic with a false sense of importance.

Actually, I'm not one of the normal "spelling critics."  I was just a bit concerned for the potential pups.  If a breeder isn't intelligent enough to spell "their" breed.  I become very concerned that they are not intelligent enough to care for pups.  OBVIOUSLY, in your case, I am wrong.

My concern is, & will always be, the dogs.  I help with rescue, so I see a large number of pups who are produced for stupid reasons.  ie..my dog is old & I wanted a replacement that would be just like him/her.  i wanted my kids to experience the joys of birth.  i only wanted one puppy, but she had 4, & i don't want these other 3.  I could on & on, but I doubt that it would make any difference.

The same here.  I can over look typos- we all make them.  But spelling Dachshund Dachshound is not a typo- it's mis-spelling from lack of knowledge.  Sorry you didn't get the answers you were looking for.

kimlauren

The male the I have is growing old and I'd like to have one of his puppies before it's too late.;

I lost my heart dog two years ago. He was a beautiful purebred Border Collie with papers, with some really outstanding breeding behind him. He was a decent, though not great, sheepdog for me. I'll never know HOW good he could have been because he was my first sheepdog and I made a lot of mistakes. I won a few prizes but they were in small competitions. What I should have done is breed him and keep a pup and start over, and had a "second chance" with fifteen years more experience under my belt, right? ***** NO.***** Ben had two different genetic problems that only were discovered through testing (an eye disorder that 25% of his pups would have inherited and a hearing disorder that they have not figured out how it's passed on, but they know it's pretty high). But I knew when he was not even a year old that I'd never breed him, and he was neutered anyway.******* He was a rescue, the product of a back yard breeder who got in over his head - had too many puppies, and Ben's litter sat around in the backyard until Ben was five months old, eating and getting more and more shy and more unsaleable.******* Instead, two months after I lost him to cancer, I found out about a breeder who had a litter coming that had many of the same lines as Ben. My "new" pup is like Ben had been recast in a higher quality mold, bless his heart - his good parts were really good and very unpredictable, while Sam is always there, and solid as a rock even at his very young age. Both of them eagerly work[ed] any kind of stock without hesitation, but while Ben had to hammer away until he figured out something that worked, Sam can size up any type of livestock quickly and treat them with respect and firmness. I would NOT have gotten Ben "Plus" from Ben, even bred to the best female in the country (which I wouldn't have access to). ********Consider, if you really like your male this much, going back to his breeder and requesting a pup from a similar breeding. This would produce a puppy much closer to him than breeding HIM, and you wouldn't risk your own female's life, rack up medical bills, and have a bunch of pups on your hands (if you'd like a moment of enlightenment, go to petfinder.com, enter your zip code, enter "daschund" for breed there on the side, and look at how many unwanted daschies there are). Best of luck!

AgileGSD

 This is actually not true - birth size of puppies is determined by the mother, regardless of what their adult size will be.

 

This is really not true in my experience. And if enough of a size difference were present I believe the bitch would be in trouble. Just my own experience and opinion tho.

I won't be adding to the original question aside from agreeing with the others that a reason that is selfish in it's beginning is putting a dogs life potentially at risk for nothing greater than one's own inability to deal with reality.

We all die, and so do our pets. And none of us is "replaceable" because we are all unique. When life ends...you find a way to find joy and love and beauty in what remains...and you can even find it in a totally unrelated animal, person or situation. If you are selfless enough to open yourself to love again.

Are either of your Dachshunds dapple?  This has a serious impact on your options for breeding Dachshunds....

Meanwhile, to further your education - check out this link: http://www.eridox.com/disorders/index.php

Take a look at the potential breed health problem - this link notes those that have been identified as genetic. If you don't know if either of your dogs carry specific genes (if you're not testing them, because you don't care about betterment of your breed), then you won't know what they're passing on.  I know it's somewhat rare, but anopthalmia - missing one or both eyes - isn't the sort of thing you're looking to create when you breed your male, I'm sure.

I would never deliberately provide false information, and in my experience, the size of the dad can make a difference in the size of the pups.

It doesn't matter whether I am correct or not.  I would not risk my female to a much larger male.  This is a choice you'll have to make.  I wish your dogs luck.

kimlauren

 JackieG --When I said safe I mean-safe (sf)
adj. saf·er, saf·est
1. Secure from danger, harm, or evil.
2. Free from danger or injury; unhurt: safe and sound.
3. Free from risk; sure: a safe bet.
4. Affording protection: a safe place.
PLEASE EXPLAIN WHAT EXACTLY IS WRONG WITH A QUESTION "such as" THE ONE I ASKED?

 

Nothing is wrong with asking a question, it's how we all learn.  However, people here are interested in the welfare of dogs and have answered your question.  What's wrong now is that you have become very defensive, because I think what you wanted, and what they didn't give you, was a form of permission to breed this dog.   It is irresponsible to breed ANY dog without, at the very least, checking for any genetic disorders that the dog could pass on to puppies.  It is irresponsible not to prove your dog in trials, or shows, before breeding.  That isn't snobbery.  It's so that potential buyers, should you have more than a singleton puppy, can be reasonably certain of having a structurally sound and healthy puppy.  It is irresponsible to breed the two varieties together.  You are letting sentimentality override good sense - something reputable breeders try very hard not to do.  It is irresponsible for a backyard breeder to put even more puppies on the market that may not find good homes, or that might be turned in to shelters. The people who buy backyard breeders' dogs are uneducated, too, and might not be the best home for your puppies, or your particular breed.  So, people here are trying to discourage you from doing this, and if I were you and didn't want a whole lot of expense for an uncertain result, I would listen to them. These are experienced dog people and they are not trying to tick you off, they're really trying to protect you, potential puppies and potential puppy buyers.

The people who buy backyard breeders' dogs are uneducated, too, and might not be the best home for your puppies, or your particular breed.

Now that's is kind of a snobby statement....  not everyone who buys from a BYB is uneducated and unable to provide a good home for a puppy.....   I've bought from local breeders, in fact all of my dogs have either come from local "BYB's" .... who did not show, dogs were registetered, but not champions, did not have the whole gammet of tests performed before breeding, or rescues. In either situation you have to be prepared for what you're getting and what you're getting into, because what are you getting when you adopt from a rescue? Most likely a dog bred by a BYB. Do I recommend it? Not for everyone. Do I think there is the potential for a great dog to come from a BYB? Absolutely.   I understand the risks, but I don't think it's fair to call everyone who buys from BYB's uneducated folks who can't provide and do what's best for the puppy.

kimlauren

AgileGSD-- I want to thank you the great information that you provided and also for your time. It was a pleasant change from the other answers which were incorrect and/or full of trivial criticism. Once again, THANKS

Whoa, whoa, whoa!!!!!! If you came to this forum asking a QUESTION, that means you didn't already know the answer. So how can you say that other answers were "incorrect"? Please please please don't only take the information you want to hear. If you're really concerned about the health and safety of your dog, find a vet that specializes in reproductive medicine, set up an appointment, and talk to your vet. Ask your vet what could go wrong. Don't go to an internet forum and only cherry-pick the answers that agree with what you want to do. Nobody on this board is a vet. What they are giving is not medical advice. If you're really serious about this, please do your homework - for your dog's sake.

mehpenn, I have bought from a BYB....why? because I was uneducated. That does not equate to stupid, as you seem to have taken it.

It means EXACTLY what it means. I had no education as to WHY it was not a good idea to just buy a dog from some Tom or Harry that had bred their animals. I had no education on what sort of behavior that perpetuates and I paid for it...in the form of temperament issues in some and health issues in others. I was uneducated...but no longer. Now...if I actually made the choice to buy from a BYB I would KNOW...without any doubt that I was doing it to a) avoid the expense associated with a reputably bred, dog b)am not very concerned about the genetics about my dog c)am not interested in a shelter or rescue for whatever reason d)find it convenient and easy, or any of the myriad reasons people do it.

BUT I would know...100% KNOW...that I could do better, and IMO...SHOULD do better, Because I have seen what bitches go thru when they are in season, are bred, carry puppies, whelp them, raise them, and then do it all over again. I KNOW...it is not some innocuous process that comes from "love" but a wilful act of either planning...or neglect.

It is not snobbery to know better and do better based on information you have NOW...that you did not have...THEN. It is what should result from education on any subject really. Nothing to do with snobbery...and everything to do with making informed decisions and understanding fully what you are supporting and feeding into when you choose to purchase your dog from someone breeding "just 'cause". MANY here have done just that...many do it each time they get a dog. That is THEIR choice. But very often people ARE uneducated as to actual effects and ramifications of that choice...and education can help them, if they wish it. If they do not? well...you have to pick your battles in this life...but like Frank Zappa said "Information doesn't kill you".

 

eta: and Anne said "might" not be the best home for the puppy...and that is a true statement in every way. Not just anyone answering a newspaper ad...is a good home...no more than every show person is a good home. MIGHT...is exactly the correct word to use.

RW, you make a valid point that not all show kennels or breeders of champions are good homes. How many times have we seen "champion" kennels turn into high priced puppy mills? It happens... we all know it does. And we all know of the "reputable breeder" who breeds for money and no other reason... who put ads on the internet and ship puppies to timbuktu not fully knowing where or who there puppy is going to. And you all know it's true. And let's all keep in mind that your idea of a reputable breeder may not be the same as someone elses.  What you classify as a BYB may not be the same as my classification.

I'm not here to argue. I really am not; I've been down that road before and don't care to go back. All I'm saying is that people have reasons for doing what they do... and regardless of why, it's their own personal decision to make.  Just because someone buys from a BYB or a local breeder or someone who produces puppies with no intention of showing, does not mean they are uneducated or stupid or ignorant or that they can't care for their puppy and won't do what's best for it..... it means that is a choice they made, for whatever reason.

Now, do I agree with Susie next door breeding her yorkies because they're super cute and she loves them to bits and she can make a crap load of money off them, when Princess is deaf and Prince has one eye? Of course not.   But if Susie's dogs are both healthy and vet checked and she's researched the right way to do things and she checks references of potential owners and makes them sign contacts agreeing to terms of purchase, such as having pups spayed or neutered, etc... and she asks potential owners to come and spend time with them to make sure it's really what they want and know what they're getting.... then I'm more likely to accept her breeding them, and yes, I'd buy a puppy from her if I were in the market for it.

mehpenn

Now, do I agree with Susie next door breeding her yorkies because they're super cute and she loves them to bits and she can make a crap load of money off them, when Princess is deaf and Prince has one eye? Of course not.   But if Susie's dogs are both healthy and vet checked and she's researched the right way to do things and she checks references of potential owners and makes them sign contacts agreeing to terms of purchase, such as having pups spayed or neutered, etc... and she asks potential owners to come and spend time with them to make sure it's really what they want and know what they're getting.... then I'm more likely to accept her breeding them, and yes, I'd buy a puppy from her if I were in the market for it.

Since you are someone who recently acquired a Dachshund puppy, is this how you chose Fonzie's breeder?  Is this the standard you think the OP should be living up to?

Dogs having puppies is natural...and sometimes Nature involves death, pain, and suffering. That is not something to do "just cause" that is not something to support...that that is MY opinion. Not when your (general) need for a pet has no special requirements like "genetic screening or proven titled dogs of a certain breed" if is does not...the shelters are FULL of animals JUST as randomly bred and those...are in danger of death!

Again you equate uneducated with stupid and ignorant...it is not the same thing. Where one changes over to the other is when one HAS all the facts in front of them..including the MYRIAD animals sitting in shelters BECAUSE of "BYB" breeders (and they ARE the vast VAST majority of people contributing to this issue. either thru getting rid of puppies or bitches...or by selling to people who are not properly screened and get rid of the dog or by not having a contract in place to get the dog back) and chooses to be just fine with that, anyways. That is when you decide that in spite of the facts in front of you...you will choose to support irresponsibility. IMO then, and only then...does uneducated turn into wilfull ignorance, denial, or heck...just plain stubborness.

mehpenn...I think you are a bit invested in this because of your pets and where you got them, and that is fine. But I refuse to believe you honestly support something that results in the deaths of millions of pets each year. I suggest you head to youtube and look up the video "just one litter" to understand more about why supporting Joe Blow Breeder is convenient for you...but MOST inconvenient for pets, as a whole. Have a good day.

miranadobe

Since you are someone who recently acquired a Dachshund puppy, is this how you chose Fonzie's breeder?  Is this the standard you think the OP should be living up to?

We got Fonzie from a different set of circumstances, his owner, whom owned him and his sister, became ill and was not able to care for them. My husband was contacted about rehoming the pups and was able to find a home for the female quickly.  If you recall, we took Fonzie in as a foster, while his owner was hospitalized and then decided to keep him. 

As for the last dog I actually bought, yes, that is how it was done. He came from a local breeder, who did not show, was not interested in showing, her dogs were not champions, they were both registered, the mom AKC, the dad CKC, healthy and offered vet references but had not had any extensive testing done. She asked that I come and meet the parents and bring my references at that time. She gave me a contract to look over that day and asked that I take a couple days to think about it while she contacted my references and I contacted her vet about her dogs. I did. And I actually visited with the parents, pups and owner several times before I chose a pup and brought it home.  And our contract stated that she had the right to visit the pup and check up on us, with at least three days notice, for the first six months, and that if I chose to have the dog altered, by six months old, she'd refund part of the purchase price of the dog, which was $250 and if for any reason, no matter how long from then, I was not able to keep the dog, she would take the dog back, to foster it until a new home could be found, no questions asked. And in fact, she did just that while I was working with her to chose a pup of my own.

I know this isn't the normal way BYB's do things..... but my point is, you can't judge a dog or it's owner based on where it was bred and who the breeder was.  

And there have also been "found the ad in the paper, went to look and came home with a puppy" instances too..... some ended up being more challenging than others but I was perfectly aware of what I was getting myself into when I brought that puppy home.

 Sadie and Greta are both rescues, Sadie from a neglectful owner who surrendered her to me and Greta was found wondering the streets by a coworker of my husband.

Maybe Gina and I look at it differently being breed enthusiasts.  My dogs are first and foremost my pets and companions, but I do consider myself a breed enthusiast above and beyond being a pet owner.  I do not describe myself as a "dog lover", there are more dogs that you couldn't pay me to own than dogs I'd be interested in owning, even within my breed.  I am a GSD enthusiast and I chose my GSDs not just based on what I personally want, but what breeding programs I want to support and what dogs I believe exemplify the correct temperament of the breed.

When people purchase BYB dogs it tells me that they don't have a problem financially supporting breeding that is detrimental to the breed.  That is not a judgment call but a fact.  For someone that is simply looking for their next pet and has no commitment to the breed, I can see where it wouldn't really be a big deal, but for those that are very involved with a breed as a whole it is extremely frustrating to say the least.