did you know......

i agree inne.
a lot of my friends are from different parts of the world, and i've found many of them to be deathly afraid of dogs...even of my 10lb shih tzu! but when it comes down to it, i found that it often has to do with the fact that in other countries there are usually huge populations of street dogs, and often times they'll attack people.
one of my friends was attacked by street dogs in india, and it took him several months before he would even get near my dog, but now he absolutely loves her!
i would really imagine this conflict is probably mostly fear based...

It would probably behoove EVERYONE in the situation to find some more compassion for each other.

If enlisting moderation by the landlord doesn't help (which I think would be a helpful avenue), can you all just agree to ignore each other? Smile and nod, smile and nod. That's what I used to do when my Mom yelled at me. Smile and nod, and then proceed to just do whatever I wanted to.

 
i think i have shown compassion toward them by being condsiderate enough, in spite of the way they are treating me, to do everything i can to keep my dog out of their site.  i have never raised my voice back at them or said one nasty word back.  however there is nothing i can do about the fact they choose to continue to be nasty.
 
in answer to the question of how long they have been in the us, 9 years.

 
Ever notice how fear in dogs looks a lot like aggression to the "untrained eye"?  Yelling at that dog doesn't help a bit.  Respect and distance for a dog you don't know, while protecting yourself, sounds like a safe response. 
 
I'm with Inne on this.  "Go back to where you came from" is hugely inflammatory.  None of us know what their reasons are for shouting at jaye. Distance and respect... with maybe a little more distance if compromise doesn't work. 
 
 

Just smile and wave. Then ignore the unpleasent and negative energy that is coming from them. Don't give them ANY legitimate reason to complain about you. That way if they do have a word with the manager, or someone witnesses a confrontation, what are they going to say?

In the end they will have to get over it, be perpetually pissed off, or just move.

i heard from another neighbor that they re moving so i might not have to deal with them much longer.

Though I echo Mary's patriotism, Inne was right in that involving management, if necessary, is the best move, as arguing with neighbors doesn't solve things very well.
 
We have been invaded and bombed in our own country. But it is a country where we are still free to own the pets of our choosing, dress the way we want to, and express our views, good or bad. That is, the neighbors can say what they want to, you can say what you want to.
 
And personally, I would probably ignore them. Some people hate being ignored worse than being argued with. If you are within your rights to own a pet there, there is not a lot any one else can do. And true, it's a bit of a culture clash. America is not like Iraq, yet. In many ways, America has problems that I don't think Iraq has encountered, yet, though they will if they truly adopt democracy.

These are very difficult times my friends. I would imagine that lately the stresses of being an Iraqi family in the United States likely has been great, and quite frankly I can see where it would be difficult to embrace Americans these days.

To be honest, if the woman of the house stated that her husband hates Americans, I would be less inclined to worry about their attitudes toward dogs, and more inclined to notify the FBI of their whereabouts.  Not everyone who is here, even legally, is a friend of the US (and, like it or not, in this case, US means *us*).  Whether you agree with the current administration or its foreign policy, we have an enemy that will not forsake its fanaticism for the next 6,000 years.  I really believe that, to the people who are terrorists, this is a religious and cultural war.  Take that down to the neighborhood level, and you have dog lovers versus dog haters, to put it very simplistically.  Sorry, but I think jaye should simply ignore these people, walk her dog, and continue to report any harrassment, not only to the apartment manager, but to the police.  No one has to put up with this disturbance of the peace if they have done nothing wrong. 
Tecumseh once said, "trouble no man about his religion", and if everyone would stick to that little idea, there'd be a whole lot less trouble in the world.  If you're a Muslim, don't keep a dog, but don't tell anyone else not to.  If you aren't a Muslim, keep a dog, but don't tell a Muslim he should.  You would think it would be simple...  

I think that not responding in any way is the best thing to do.. report anything you think may escalate to the management, continue what you are doing as far as being courteous and pray the rumors are right that they are moving.
 
I am a minority in my neighborhood. I live in a predominantly Hispanic neighborhood. As much as some of the things the people in my neighborhood do irritate me, I have just learned to take some of it with a grain of salt. Cultures are different, belief systems are different, as well as values and ethics.
 
As far as telling someone to go back to the country they came from.. I think the same can be said to most of our families here.. we didn't start out here either. Tolerance goes a long way in that regard. As Americans we often say that if people are going to come to this country they should learn the language and our customs.. but did our ancestors do that?? Do we all speak Native American? Did we take on the culture? No we didn't. While it's true I would never move to another country without first learning the language and some of the customs.. one never knows the real circumstances behind the decision for someone to come to this country. If you were from Iraq.. would you want to go back there???

Let me preface this reply by saying that I am a teacher of English to speakers of other languages in Brooklyn New York.  It is on a daily basis that I teach, interact with, and care for children that have immigrated to this country from various places around the world.  I am an advocate for this community.
 
I think that it is  legitimate for both parties to agree to disagree.  In no way can we ask for them to be acceptant and understanding of a culture different from their own (a dog loving american culture) if we are not willing to accept their culture, that of which is different from our own. 
 
Yes, they have moved here from another country, and yes, they are in America now, but that is no reason for them to abandon their beliefs and immediately accept ours.  Yes, they will, in time, acclimate themselves to our way of living, but these are grown adults who have been living this way for all of their lives. Living in what truly is a global world, we should all see this as the truth and accept it.
 
They are probably (if they are new immigrants) experiencing some sort of culture shock, and this feeling is not going to dissipate very quickly.  They need to have time to adjust, and this could just be a shocking situation for them.
 
And to answer the question as to why they came here if they "hate Americans" (and they probably don't hate Americans, but who could blame them if they did??) they most definitely came here because their country is being DEMOLISHED.
 
As a dog lover myself, and a hater of negative energy, I think that it is best if, at the very least, positivity is sent through the air, and civility is found. 
 
**It is important to know that I am NOT trying to be nasty, or belittle anyone.  I just feel very passionately about issues of this nature, as I have devoted my life to being an advocate for the immigrant population.  Forgive me, but I just cannot help myself. (I LOVE dogs myself and would feel very sad if I was facing any sort of opposition, believe me.  I have a pit bull and have to face this daily with people from my own culture....)
 
If  need be, ignore them.  Even better, try to communicate with them.
 
I wish everyone involved the very best.

alieliza, have you read all the posts?  i agree that they shouldnt abandon their customs and no one ever suggested that, but yes they do have to accept our customs,  they dont have to practice or agree with them but they do have to respect them the same way we respect theirs.  they have no right to treat me the way they are.  if you read all the posts you would know that i have tried to communicate with them and how impossible it is and that they have been here for 9 years.

ORIGINAL: alieliza

And to answer the question as to why they came here if they "hate Americans" (and they probably don't hate Americans, but who could blame them if they did??) they most definitely came here because their country is being DEMOLISHED.

 
i can.  thats like saying who could blame americans if we hate all iraqis.  or who could blame black people if they hate all white white people.  no one should hate everyone of another culture, race, whatever.  you need to judge people as individuals.  i dont see any reason iraqi people should be excused of this.

ORIGINAL: alieliza

Let me preface this reply by saying that I am a teacher of English to speakers of other languages in Brooklyn New York.  It is on a daily basis that I teach, interact with, and care for children that have immigrated to this country from various places around the world.  I am an advocate for this community.

I think that it is  legitimate for both parties to agree to disagree.  In no way can we ask for them to be acceptant and understanding of a culture different from their own (a dog loving american culture) if we are not willing to accept their culture, that of which is different from our own. 

Yes, they have moved here from another country, and yes, they are in America now, but that is no reason for them to abandon their beliefs and immediately accept ours.  Yes, they will, in time, acclimate themselves to our way of living, but these are grown adults who have been living this way for all of their lives. Living in what truly is a global world, we should all see this as the truth and accept it.

They are probably (if they are new immigrants) experiencing some sort of culture shock, and this feeling is not going to dissipate very quickly.  They need to have time to adjust, and this could just be a shocking situation for them.

And to answer the question as to why they came here if they "hate Americans" (and they probably don't hate Americans, but who could blame them if they did??) they most definitely came here because their country is being DEMOLISHED.

As a dog lover myself, and a hater of negative energy, I think that it is best if, at the very least, positivity is sent through the air, and civility is found. 

**It is important to know that I am NOT trying to be nasty, or belittle anyone.  I just feel very passionately about issues of this nature, as I have devoted my life to being an advocate for the immigrant population.  Forgive me, but I just cannot help myself. (I LOVE dogs myself and would feel very sad if I was facing any sort of opposition, believe me.  I have a pit bull and have to face this daily with people from my own culture....)

If  need be, ignore them.  Even better, try to communicate with them.

I wish everyone involved the very best.

 
After reading this post I tried to think of a situation that would be equally appaling to me if I moved to another country.
 
It would probobly be the practice in Europe and Asia of eating horse meat.  This discusts me to no end.  I love horses, I've grown up with them, I've seen them sold to kill buyers and seen them loaded into trucks.  The idea of eating horse meat or even handling it makes me inwardly recoil (please spare me the "they're no different than cows arguement"-it makes no difference, I'm still incredibly discusted by it).
 
However, if I decided to move to France, I would not yell at people buying horse meat, and shout at my neighbors as they were cooking it.  I would not go to restaurants and disparage people for eating it--after all, I chose to come to their country, therefore there are certain things about their culture that come with the package, and while I might chose to refrain from them, I have no right to expect everyone around me to change for my sake.
 
And if these people do truely hate Americans, I wonder why they would even bother coming here?  There are plenty of other countries that they could have emmigrated to, countries with much higher Muslim populations, rather than chosing to live amongst a culture they dispise.
 
 

they have no right to treat me the way they are.

 
Im sorry that this came off the wrong way.  I guess I have to know when to get off my soapbox.  Im sure that you can relate to feeling passionately about something and getting a little carried away sometimes.
 
Youre right, they have no right to treat you that way.  They have been here for nine years (I didn't catch that the first time reading through).  Nine years is PLENTY of time to get over their initial shock....
 
I think the advice that was given, to get the landlord involved, or something of the like, is a good idea.  Its too bad that they are reacting like this, and I give you credit for not responding in some ways that were suggested, ie: maybe they should go back to their country, or with profanity.
 
I hope things work out well, and I apologize for the misunderstanding.

i can. thats like saying who could blame americans if we hate all iraqis. or who could blame black people if they hate all white white people. no one should hate everyone of another culture, race, whatever. you need to judge people as individuals. i dont see any reason iraqi people should be excused of this.

ORIGINAL: jaye
 
I have a friend from Israel, who has negative feelings towards palestinians.  I can imagine why.  I DO NOT AGREE with discriminating against an entire race, and entire culture, an entire subculture, or anything of the matter.  HOWEVER, I cannot imagine what it must be like to feel attacked by a whole country.  Yes, our country was bombed and people were killed, but we have never seen war and total destruction like the people of Iraq are feeling.  In saying I can't blame them for "hating Americans" if they do, I meant that if I have negative feelings towards my own country because I don't believe in war or violence, then I can imagine that Iraqi people (or anyone else we have mistreated) do too. 
 
I think I was misunderstood in my post.  I wish you could all be flies on the wall in my classroom, because I practically preach nonviolence and cultural acceptance, awareness and understanding in my classroom.
 
Again, I would never condone prejudices, and I would love to right the whole world, but I cannot blame any sort of negative feelings towards us when I feel that we are overstepping our boundaries.  You are 100% correct in saying "you need to judge people as individuals".  I couldn't agree with you more.  These are my morals that run very deep, but I am also very compassionate and my heart breaks for the world.
 
I apologize if I have offended anyone, that is the last thing I want to do.  I love this board and did not mean to anger.

silly sally, you are right.  I did not realize that these people were acting so irrationally.  Your comparison makes perfect sense, and I would never back someone up knowingly that was being irate and beligerant. 
 
In a ideal world, we could accept each others differences, and live amongst each other in harmony.  As an educator, my dream is to work towards this ideal.