His swimming career is over- Bugsy (rant)

 Thank you again everyone.  I REALLY appreciate the understanding, support and ideas. 

Some of you know me all too well, I hate defeat - I'll be researching all that I can in order to find a way to do this.  LOL I'm as stubborn as the beast.  Becca you know I'll be back.  I know that there have been other training challenges and I know that once I channel him he is incredible.

I feel a bit like I've been run over today.  We had a nice run/trot until 10-12 deer decided to bolt out from some woods and cross in front of us.  ***shaking head*** 

Never a dull moment, huh?

Oh WOW!!!

I really cannot offer much in the way of training advice; I'll leave that to others on this board that have more experience in that area.  I do want to offer hugs and support.  I follow your Bugsy posts and am amazed at your dedication to the big guy.  I know that the experience out at the lake scared the bejesus out of you.  The biggest challenge for me when it seems Oliver has regressed on his recall is getting out of my own anger and frustration.  I know you'll "get back in the ring" with him on swimming.  Don't despair that going back to some baby steps or trying something different means he is too much for you. 

I truly believe that each dog comes into our lives to challenge us on our growth areas.  Maybe Bugsy is pushing you on "success" based on your timetable or his?

Bugsy is quite the trouble maker, lol! Glad you guys are okay!!

 No advice here since I've never had to deal with a crazy prey drive - but BUGSY no scaring your Mom like that!!!!!  Your lucky your a handsome devil *emphasis on the devil part*

kpwlee

 Thank you again everyone.  I REALLY appreciate the understanding, support and ideas. 

Some of you know me all too well, I hate defeat - I'll be researching all that I can in order to find a way to do this.  LOL I'm as stubborn as the beast.  Becca you know I'll be back.  I know that there have been other training challenges and I know that once I channel him he is incredible.

With each new foster that comes here, I learn more and more about dog's behavior in general and a lot of times it does not fit with what everyone is saying.  I have recently changed my dog care philosphy to look at first balancing the dog by the environment I setup and the exposure to stimuli, gradually introducing intense stimuli.  The new dog has a lot of freedom to make whatever adjustments are needed.  I identify the need and then monitor the want by the behavior exhibited.  Changing the want which is the emotional response to the need and determines the urgency is generally done by me by satiating that need and at the same time elevating another need or activating  a dormant need.

Its hard to explain.  I believe there is a natural balance of drive for all the needs within a dog.  I don't think we humans understand how we influence a drive by the allowances/disallowances, food treat/withholding, get the mole/don't get the mole that we place on the dog.  In doing your research, pay close attention to see iff you can inadvertently increase the drive of the dog.  I believe that a lot of the trainiing methods used, misuses or uses the wrong need in order to create or change a behavior. 

I just wanted to pop in and say that I'm so glad that both of you are doing okay!  I can't imagine how scary that must have been!  Perhaps you both can work on the swimming again eventually, hopefully the right swimming situation will come along (less ducks, perhaps).

 Karen

I am so glad both you and Bugsy are ok. Bad dog Bugsy!

Karen, 

I think Bugs is the perfect candadate for an ecollar!  At our weight pull/sledding class our trainer helped someone with a dog like Bugs train with an ecollar and what success!!!

I wouldn't be bring Bugsy anywhere that was any bigger than a puddle.   You have to get control, train a recall somehow.  The most prey driven dogs are bird dogs and Beccas sheep dogs - if they can train there dogs off you can too - its just a lot of hard work and the right method.

 Good luck!

 Thanks and yea I am considering the ecollar and as ever working with him - sigh.  Whatever mix he is there is definitely bird dog in there.

I can assure you that he sees catching the goose (or whatever) as his job which isn't complete until he gets it.  There is nothing that will prevail or deter.  My key may be finding a way to let him know when his job is complete - we've done that with squirrels and songbirds, hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

And he is still for sale 

I just caught up with this post and feel your frustration!  My husband, too, keeps telling me to give it up and keep Grace on a leash. 

Yes you can give it up and keep him tethered but then you see some one, out there, blissfully tossing dummies or a tennis ball into the lake with a dog that is content to only chase what she/he is tossing and actually, calmly, retrieves them, happily wagging tail, looking forward to the next toss.

You go up and ask this person "How did you teach your dog to behave so well in the water?" and they have the gall to say "I didn't have to teach him/her anything, he/she's just so happy to play catch!" - Arrgghhh!