The "doodle" craze

Eek. After adopting two doodlish dogs who were rescued from a quick-turn (kill) animal control shelter, all I can say to these breeders and potential owners is Good Luck and keep a big (and I mean BIG) money account going for these babies. They're going to need it. Almost guaranteed to have expensive orthopedic health issues.

PS--No, I didn't know that mine were 1) doodlish dogs and 2) full of health issues due to poor breeding.

I won't them go and I'll do what I can for them, but goodness.

  I'm sure I'm in the minority here, but honestly, if people want to pay a bazillion dolars for a mixed breed dog with a cutsie name, I have no issue with it.  My biggest issue is the health and temperment of these dogs.  As long as the breeder does the necessary health screenings for *both* breeds they are mixing, are paying close attention to stable temperments, are keeping their dogs in good conditions/caring for them properly, and screening puppy buyers I really don't see a problem......

 Ho ho ho!

For a start I don't KNOW of any like that.  Do you?

Chuffy

 Ho ho ho!

For a start I don't KNOW of any like that.  Do you?

Actually, this one, for example:  http://www.arborgatelabradoodles.com/index.html

I've met a few nice 'doodles', actually - most of the doodles I've met have been super friendly and social. I think people get a false sense of secutiry with a doodle about shedding, and such. The ones I've met have been super active and *gasp* I've met a few that SHED!

I wouldn't discourage anyone from ADOPTING one from a shelter, because they DO seem to be nice dogs for the most part.

Sorry, I looked at that web site, and it looked like a slick backyard breeder to me. The original group that tried Labradoodles was in New Zealand I believe, and they suspended the program because they couldn't get a reliably hype-allergenic dog. More happy hype to make you think their dogs are special, and believe me, I do hope that they do indeed do all that genetic testing. I just doubt it.

I'm sitting here nervously waiting for my sister to show up (we're in the middle of a nasty snowstorm) and I can't concentrate so here I am . . .

Yes, SillySally, I generally agree. I guess doodles, in general, aren't the problem, but then they are because they tend to have a lot of problems. Not every single one (I see them on the various doodle rescue pages), but many do, and those are the ones that are 1) being given away on Craigslist or 2) trying to find homes via petfinder and still unable to find them. Who wants to adopt a dog with bad hips that will equal a lifetime of big money?

These doodles certainly pay the price for bad breeding. It's so frustrating!

if the breeder is testing, that's great. I couldn't find any of the dogs listed as being OFA certified on the OFA database, though.  I looked, as they listed one dog as "hips: good/excellent", which didn't make much sense.  Maybe they listed their dogs' names wrong, though.

 Standard Poodles are amazing dogs. They're super smart, high drive, ridiculously trainable HUNTING DOGS. Everybody I meet that has a big Doodle says they didn't want a "girly dog". So get a St Poodle and clip it down. They're awesome! I've been in love with some Doodles, too, but... they're big, shedding dogs, a lot of the time, and have all the issues of a super active dog.

For the record, it took me over a year to house train Emma, and Ena isn't there, yet. LOL I think I'm housetraining retarded, though. I swear.... Ena B demos for obedience classes, but pee in the yard? Please. She'll get it, eventually. 

grab01

if the breeder is testing, that's great. I couldn't find any of the dogs listed as being OFA certified on the OFA database, though.  I looked, as they listed one dog as "hips: good/excellent", which didn't make much sense.  Maybe they listed their dogs' names wrong, though.

I also didn't see any titles or even a CGC on any of the parent dogs.  Granted, they can't title in the breed ring, but what about agility, or rally? 

nfowler

I'm sitting here nervously waiting for my sister to show up (we're in the middle of a nasty snowstorm) and I can't concentrate so here I am . . .

 

Yes, SillySally, I generally agree. I guess doodles, in general, aren't the problem, but then they are because they tend to have a lot of problems. Not every single one (I see them on the various doodle rescue pages), but many do, and those are the ones that are 1) being given away on Craigslist or 2) trying to find homes via petfinder and still unable to find them. Who wants to adopt a dog with bad hips that will equal a lifetime of big money?

These doodles certainly pay the price for bad breeding. It's so frustrating!

But at the same time, so do plenty of purebreds.  You should see all the dogs on my lab board that have ortho issues at a young age.  Elbow surgery, hip surgery, etc on tragically young dogs.....  

dstull

Sorry, I looked at that web site, and it looked like a slick backyard breeder to me. The original group that tried Labradoodles was in New Zealand I believe, and they suspended the program because they couldn't get a reliably hype-allergenic dog. More happy hype to make you think their dogs are special, and believe me, I do hope that they do indeed do all that genetic testing. I just doubt it.

 

Well, the breeder claims she can provide proof and if she's lying, shame on her.  However, just for the sake of argument, lets say she doesn't health test.  How does that make her different than any of the bazillion backyard purebred dog breeders?

spiritdogs

grab01

if the breeder is testing, that's great. I couldn't find any of the dogs listed as being OFA certified on the OFA database, though.  I looked, as they listed one dog as "hips: good/excellent", which didn't make much sense.  Maybe they listed their dogs' names wrong, though.

 

I also didn't see any titles or even a CGC on any of the parent dogs.  Granted, they can't title in the breed ring, but what about agility, or rally? 

Honestly, titles don't tell a puppy buyer much other than what the breeder is into.  If you are looking for a dog for a specific sport, then yes, this is important.  However, I fail to see how they say anything about, say, temperament (which is far more concerning to me than agility titles).

I have heard of and observed dogs with iffy temperaments competing successfully in different venues.  Even CGC, while it is a nice title to have, is really more about training than temperament.  All you can really get about temperment from a CGC is that the dog is not so timid that it cannot be touched by strangers in a resonable amount of time, and that it is well trined and managed.  Dogs with aggressive temperments can be well trained and managed.

On the other hand, Jack is pretty much everything a lab should be as far as temperament goes, yet we are having a hard time training him to sit and not move while a stranger pets him (strangers are just sooooo exciting, don't ya know).  We will get it, it's just a rough spot for us.  However, this does not say anything about his temperment itself. 

I'm not saying that everyone should go out and buy a doodle, or even that I particularly like them.  What I am saying is that the issues facing "hybrids" and their breeders are the same issues facing purebred dogs and their breeders.  A craigslist ad for labs that are not health tested should be just as offensive as an ad for labradoodles that are not health tested.

I've noticed that we really don't have many "hybrid" dog owners on here and I think the reason why is obvious.  A poster could come on here and say that they have a lab and not be given a second look, but another could come on here and say that they have a labradoodle and get the thrid degree about why they bought an expensive mutt when the fact is that there are TONS of labs from BYBs.  It seems that there is an "us and them" attitude in the dog world when it comes to "hybrid" dogs, and I'm not sure that this is a positive thing.

I suppose my point is that to me at least, it is not *what* a breeder is breeding, but rather *how* they are doing it.......

I agree.  When I met a labradoodle for the first time at a seminar, I fell in love.  Head over heels.  I wanted one.  I started doing some research and calling breeders, etc.  Bottom line for me personally was that I won't spend $1,500.00 for a puppy with no clearances.  I'm sure I could find a pup but I got turned off by the obvious ignorance (real or feigned?) I found with most of the  breeders I called.  They are looking for uneducated buyers.  It's a market niche they are filling and I can get a really nice standard poodle or Lab for the same price or less.  I just find that it's easier for ME to find a breeder of Labs or Poodles who has dogs with health clearances and titles that I consider representative of a reputable breeder. I happen to know what to ask a breeder and it quickly became apparent that most of the labradoodle and goldendoodle breeders didn't want to waste their time talking to me since they could easily sell their pups to an uneducated buyer.  I don't have anything against someone who spends that kind of money on a doodle or any other type of hybrid, just don't come crying to me when your dog has health issues or it sheds when you were told it wouldn't.  I feel the same about people who buy any dog from a breeder without doing their homework on the breed and the breeder, PUREBRED OR HYBRID.  Doesn't mean I won't help someone with a dog they bought without doing their homework but I won't feel sorry for them.

I hope I don't have a "us or them" attitude when it comes to hybrids, I just think it's much, much harder to find a good breeder when you get into the hybrids. Many of our purebred dogs were created many years ago by "mixing" different breeds to achieve a specific look or function.  But I don't think they were created just to get top dollar from a uneducated buyer.