which one??

    • Bronze

    which one??

    hello to all!!! i am new here!!!! and i have been looking around and it seems like a wonderful place.

    well~i am 18 years old, still in high school, and living with my family. we live in the city right now, but hopefully soon we will be moving out to the country!(wohoo)!!! and, my parents dont want me having a dog in the city, but they said i could get one once we move to the country!!!!!!! YAY!!!! i have always had dogs growing up, and have always loved them soo much~ but the past few years my parents have really been strict about not letting us get dogs.
    anyways!!!!!!!!! I AM soooo excited about him letting me get one. i have been thinking a lot about what i will do after high school, and i really want to have a kennel. and my dad knows that, so he told me that he would let me get a type of breed, and let me raise a litter of pups and sell them!!! WOHOO again, lol.

    and i have been looking thru all different types of breeds. oh, and he said that he would really like if i did a small breed~ so i have narrowed it down to two, but i would really like to know what you guys think: ok, so min pins or poms??? which one!!!! ahhh! i had a min pin growing up but had to get rid of him cause he chased cows =//. anyways, which do u suggest? or anything you can tell me about them? thank you so much!!
    • Gold Top Dog
    My suggestion would be that you wait until you are older and wiser to even consider breeding.  It isn't good to breed just any old purebred.  The dogs need to be a couple years old first, health tested for any and all genetic weaknesses known to the breed, (and that's a lot more involved than the vet saying that they are healthy) proven in conformation and WORTHY of being bred....dogs that are top quality and will only improve the breed.  Breeding stock needs to come from extremely reputatble breeders who can tell you the family tree of both parents for many generations back, their titles, and any health issues in the lines.
     
    I'm not a small dog person....I'm afraid I would break a dog that small......so I can't help with "either or", but if you truly want to have a kennel one day, I hope you'll understand that you'll need another job to support that kennel.  Breeding isn't a money making proposition, and can actually put you in the hole if you do it correctly.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Welcome to the forum. You sound like you really love dogs - so you are in the right place to get a lot of great advice, especially if you are planning on breeding. So many people don't understand what a big responsibility breeding is and how if it is not done in a thoughtful and educated way, both the mom and the pups can suffer. There are just so many dogs abandoned in shelters because someone didn't take the time to breed them properly. I hope you stick around and get all the advice from experts so you too can DO IT RIGHT!
    • Gold Top Dog
    Welcome to the forum!

    What qualities do you want from a dog (ie easy to housebreak)? What qualities do you dislike in a dog (ie tends to bark a lot)?  Hopefully, this will help you choose which breed.

    As for breeding, I would wait until you were older, too. Breeding is a lot of work and costs a lot of money -- you can't actually make money breeding if you breed ethically. You will probably just break even or even lose money doing it. It takes up a lot of time and effort as well. A good start would be to begin researching thoroughly on what it takes to breed, and then finding a mentor who can guide you if you still plan on breeding.

    Here are two great websites to help you get started:
    [linkhttp://www.wonderpuppy.net/breeding.htm#breeding]http://www.wonderpuppy.net/breeding.htm#breeding[/link]
    http://www.learntobreed.com
    • Bronze
    well first of all~ i just want to say thanks for the replies. and i guess i forgot to explain about my kennel =//. sorry~ i wont be breeding dogs in mine, i will be rescuing dogs and then searching for good homes for them. and as for breeding, me and my dad are only going to raise 1 litter of pups and then get her spayed, we just thought it would be a neat thing to do.

    i under everything that you guys said. and ya, i wasnt going to just make a living having a kennel, i know i wont make probably any kind of money frm it, but its something that i *really* want to do and rescuing dogs is, i know, what i was put on this earth for, at least i believe so. i have always loved all kinds of animals, but dogs have a special place in my heart =]].

    anyways~ hmmm. i would like a dog that didnt bark a lot, which i have done quite a bit of research and i know that you can train dogs to not bark so much. and ya, a dog that is easy to train would be good, considering i am new to training n such.
    who knows, i may not even breed her, things may change by the time shes old enough and stuff!!!!~
    so.. which small dog breed would you guys consider?
    thanks
    • Gold Top Dog
    Unlees you are prepared for constant motion, I wouldn't recommend a min. pin. Can you please explain further your comment "you got rid of your min. pin. because it chased cows."
    • Gold Top Dog
    I don't think a Pom or a Min Pin are what you're looking for. [;)] Yes, dogs can be trained somewhat to not bark, BUT some breeds are much more likely to bark and are much harder to train not to. Barking comes about as naturally to certain breeds like Shelties and Min Pins as breathing does to most dogs. [:D] A lot of toy breeds are pretty barky I think... Shih Tzus are the quietest one that I know of.

    As far as breeding, in the best case scenario I'm sure it's rewarding. But there are sooooo many things that can go wrong. You have to be absolutely prepared to lose the mom during or after the labor and hand raise all the puppies, feeding them every 2 hours around the clock for weeks. Sometimes you may also lose the entire litter AND the mom. [:(] It's definitely not unheard of and it's absolutely heartwrenching I'm sure, especially when you made the choice to breed the mom. At the very least it's tons of work. And since you are bringing these puppies into the world, you also have a huge responsiblity to make sure both parents aren't carrying any genetic weaknesses. Hip dysplasia, luxating patellas, heart defects, eye disorders, etc. are things that cannot be detected by a routine "vet check". You have to have x-rays sent off to get an OFA certification for hips and patellas, a different certification for hearts, and CERF for eyes. Different breeds are prone to certain health conditions so you have to check into it.

    Another thing is the huge overpopulation problem which I'm sure you know about since you want to rescue dogs. The only reason I think anyone can justify bringing more puppies into this world is to improve and preserve existing breeds. Otherwise there are TONS of dogs/puppies already in the shelters.

    And one more thing to think about would be selling the puppies on a spay/neuter contract. If not, just think about the exponential effect you're having on overpopulation.

    To be honest, my suggestion to you if you want to raise a litter of puppies is to foster a mom and litter for a rescue group or shelter. You'll have the rewarding experiences of caring for them without adding to the overpopulation AND helping the mom and puppies. It seems like a "win win" situation to me!! [:D]
    • Gold Top Dog
    To be honest, my suggestion to you if you want to raise a litter of puppies is to foster a mom and litter for a rescue group or shelter. You'll have the rewarding experiences of caring for them without adding to the overpopulation AND helping the mom and puppies. It seems like a "win win" situation to me!!

     
    I think this is the best suggestion of all if you want to have puppies.  There are many pregnant dogs already in shelters who need homes and if your willing to take on something that large then that would be great!
     
    What I have to ask is why would you rescue dogs only to breed more that may end up in a shelter someday?  Even purebred dogs get destroyed every day in shelters simply because there are already too many dogs in the country.  If you care enough about dogs then you would not purposely bring more into this world unless you are ready to take on the responsibility of making sure they do not go to homes that may abuse them or get rid of them.
     
    This may seem a little harsh but the reason people on this forum tell you all of this is because we all care about dogs.  We care about their health, training and we care to see that they are all in good homes.  Many on here also work to rescue dogs and it#%92s heartbreaking to hear that there are more and more everyday being put down just because someone wants to breed for no reason other than to witness the miracle of birth or make money.  Please be very very VERY careful in the choices you make when it comes to breeding.
     
    As far as breed suggestions, check out [linkhttp://www.petfinder.com/]www.petfinder.com[/link] to see the many dogs that are in need of a home right now in your area.  It will amaze you that so many are out there.  Mixes make wonderful dogs and they need you.  I find that rescued dogs really do have that sense that you are there for them once you bring them into your home and are forever grateful.
     
    • Gold Top Dog
    I have to agree with the others. You might not want a Mini Pin or a Pom because they are quite notoriously yappy. You can train them not to bark, but it's going to be difficult. If you aren't fixated on buying a dog, there are a lot of great dogs you can get through breed rescue or through Petfinder. What about exercise? Grooming? Shedding? Watchdog abilities? Energy level? and so on. If you are getting a puppy, make sure someone in the household will be able to housetrain it while you are away (bring it out every two to three hours to go potty, including in the middle of the night), that you will be able to take the pup to puppy class and that you will be able to socialize it well and so on. If you want a calmer, housetrained and basic obedience-trained dog already, an adult dog from a rescue would be great for you.

    Fostering is a great idea. It'll give you a "feel" for what it's like to raise a litter of puppies if you are really intent on breeding. If i may say so, there is no medical benefit in a dog having "just one litter" -- in fact, you are putting your dog at risk for doing this. For one thing, the smaller breeds can be more prone to C-sections. A responsible breeder (which you will want to be, of course) is always ready, willing and able to take in a puppy that the buyer doesn't want to or cannot take care of anymore. This responsibility extends to even, for example, when the puppy is now a sick or untrained five-year-old dog. Are you ready for this possibility? Is this okay with your parents? Oh, and volunteering at your local shelter will be great, give you experience in handling different types of dogs and will show you the effort, time and money needed in running a rescue.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Your enthusiam for getting a dog is terrific.
     
    There's a lot that goes into breeding a dog and I agree with Glenmar, it is expensive and hard work. Being small dogs it isn't unlikely that they'd need a C-Section which could cost thousands of dollars and that's just one expense. Worst of all is when the mother dies during whelping. Before you take that step and to help you decide which breed is right for you, I'd advise you to visit kennel clubs and find a good breeder that raises puppies in a good environment. They will give you information about their breed and also all the hard work that goes into breeding healthy dogs with a great temperment that are excellent examples of the breed standard.
     
    Until you are ready to that commitment, I'd stay away from breeding. Shelters and rescues have a lot of purebred dogs available (and many are euthanized) because of indiscriminate breeding.
     
    Good luck. I hope you find a terrific dog.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I nicked this link off another thread and I think you should give it a read:
     
    [linkhttp://www.woodhavenlabs.com/breeding/breeder2.html]http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/breeding/breeder2.html[/link]
     
    The sole reason anyone should breed a litter of puppies is because they genuinely believe that the pairing will raise the standard of the breed in general.  Not because they want the bitch to have "just one litter", not because they want to make money, not because they think a litter of puppies would be a cool thing to have.....  There are just far too many dogs already and you need to have a specially darn good reason for making more!!
     
    I would also echo and emphasise points made by other posters; that you should wait until you are older and wiser before  breeding at all  and in the meantime learn everything you can about your chosen breed and genetics as well as the various "lines" within the breed.  Finding yourself a mentor is an exceptionally good idea. 
     
    If and when you do eventually decide to breed a litter DEFINATELY draw up a contract to sell the pups on stipulating that they MUST be spayed/neutered by a given age and they MUST be returned to you if the owner ever needs to rehome the dog in the future - NOT sent to a rescue centre or sold or euth'd.  Make yourslef personally responsible for every pup you bring into the world - that's the ethical thing to do and that's what a good breeder does.
     
    If you are looking for a puppy, you would be wise to look for a breeder who also insists on taking the pups back.  Bear in mind that many good breeders will also insist that you spay/neuter which means finding an animal that is likely to be worthy of being bred in future that doesn't have a speuter contract may be tricky! 
    • Gold Top Dog
    I think your idea of having a rescue kennel is wonderful and exciting. I hope to have enough room to foster dogs one day.
     
    I really hope that you change your mind about breeding your dog, when you get one. Breeding just for the fun of it, unfortunately, adds to the sad overpopulation problem and the puppies you produce will only displace other shelter dogs who need homes. There are so many great breeders out there, and they spend years (decades!) researching their dogs' lines and pedigrees, and they work endlessly to improve the breed through genetic and temperament testing. It's a shame to have people just breed their dog for fun when true breeders are doing all this (very necessary) work.
    • Puppy
    I think the rescue idea would be a great idea if that is what you want to do.  Rather than continue to breed in an over populated world anyway.  If you really feel that you want a small dog, why don't you create a rescue for toy breeds?  Or better yet... obviously you won't be able to do that right away but you can check into fostering for other rescue centers if you really want to help dogs.  We had an older retired lady recently, that lives in a highrise and got our number out of the yellowpages and called us for a 1 year or older 10lbs or less dog.  Personally we deal in large dogs but she was willing to take one from a shelter so we did the research to try to help, but that's another story.  Any rescue is a great asset to animals but you can specify breeds and size and so on.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I'm so glad your parents are going to let you get a dog!  Mine never did cave, their house and yard is too small for the kinds of dogs we appreciate.

    About breeding, I work for a local Humane Society and from that perspective, I'd encourage you to sign up for a fostering program instead of breeding on your own.  Lucky Chuffy said, the purpose of breeding isn't to produce dogs, it's to make the breed better by mixing two dogs with great genes.  If you do breed on your own, I can't give much advice since I know nothing about it accept I would definitely have takers lined up for all of the puppies beforehand.  However, I still think fostering is a better alternative.  I think it's great you want to open a kennel some day (so do I, where do you live?) and getting experience with puppised will be a plus.  If you foster, you don't have to worry about adding even MORE dogs to the population, you'll have help finding them homes, and help with the veterinary care.  Once you've done this for a while, maybe then you'll still be pumped about breeding, but at least you'd have experience and understand the financial commitment involved.  Another option is to become a "puppy petter" for a local shelter.  We have volunteers that help solely with the puppies.  I do exercise and obedience with larger dogs, so I'm not even allowed near the puppies (quarantined until vaccinated), but there are special volunteers who are trained to raise the pups.  Shelters love volunteers, so it's a great way to help raise pups at no cost to you AND see how a shelter is run.

    As for the choice of dogs, I'm not a toy dog person so I'd probably be no help.  I do know that just because they are small does not mean they are less active and require less exercise. 
    • Bronze
    hey everyone!! thanks for the replies again!!!

    ok, well i talked to my dad, and even before the idea of breeding came about I always wanted to get just a mutt from the humane society.
    and i told him that i would rather get a big dog then breed some. and he said, ok, ya just get a big dog!!!!!!!! WOHOO.
    i cant wait.
    and thanks for what you guys said about the kennel idea.
    i live in missouri, by the way.
    after i graduate, here in a few months (YAY), i want to get a good job at the hospital, and then in a few years after i move out and get stable and everything, i will just start from there.
    its just something that i would absolutely *love* to do.
    and i will make my dream come true, because if i dont do it, i would hate myself for not one day, you know?
    thanks again!!!! and i cant wait til we move, but i dont know when that will be, hopefully in the next month or two!!!!!!
    AHH!
    i will keep you all updated!