White German Shepherds?

There's a bit of history there and much of it revolves around myths....that whites are genetically weak, that they are not able to actually herd, that they blend in with the sheep, that they are too easy to see in the dark thus removing the element of surprise for the wolf.....whites can't be shown in AKC, and therefore shouldn't be bred.  One of the other registries however recognizes the whites as a breed of their own.

...One of the other registries however recognizes the whites as a breed of their own.

 
That would be the UKC.  They're registered as The White Shepherd Dog.
[linkhttp://www.ukcdogs.com/RegistrationBreeds.htm]http://www.ukcdogs.com/RegistrationBreeds.htm[/link]
 

The White German Shepherd Dog can be AKC registered but not shown in conformation as the color is considered to be a fault in the breed. The White GSD is recognized as a separate breed with the UKC and can be shown in conformation there. Our first dog was a White GSD named Mona Lisa. She was a great dog. []
 

 

Thanks for the info, everyone.  Those pics of Mona Lisa brought back some memories.  My uncles Shepherds have all passed (It's been a while since I was a teenager), but they were great dogs.  I'll always miss them.  [sm=sad.gif] 
 
So, historically, did they consider the dog valuable only as a companion?
 
Thanks again for the pics and the info.[sm=happy.gif] 

The lady who own the doggie daycare that Jack goes to breeds White German Shepards.  From what I can tell she is very repuatable and the dogs of hers that I have met are great.  She competes with them--I'm guessing in the UKC.  It has actually helped Jack a lot being around them as he used to be a bit afraid of shepard looking dogs.

ORIGINAL: sillysally

The lady who own the doggie daycare that Jack goes to breeds White German Shepperd's.  From what I can tell she is very reputable and the dogs of hers that I have met are great.  She competes with them--I'm guessing in the UKC.  It has actually helped Jack a lot being around them as he used to be a bit afraid of shepard looking dogs.

 
If she is breeding for color and outside the breed standard she is not a reputable breeder.

I understand where you are coming from HD, but if she's trying to establish a breed, and there is a pretty strong movement to establish whites as every bit as equal to standards, she is not breeding irresponsibly for sure.  So long as she is doing the proper health and genetic testing, and she does show to rove her dogs, I'd not call her irresponsible.  My hope would be that at some point AKC would drop the silly disqualification against whites.......my Sheba is white and perfect in every way conformation-wise.  Unlike some breeds, in a gsd the color white does not increase chances of deafness nor does it lessen the quality of the dog, except in the eyes of the "snobs"

I think all Roger was trying to say is that a breeder who breeds only for color is not responsible.  If someone is trying to establish a breed that breeds true for color *and* conformation and temperament, I might give them more slack.  If there truly is no difference between whites and others health-wise, I think the AKC should get a grip and let them in.

ORIGINAL: hdkutz

ORIGINAL: sillysally

The lady who own the doggie daycare that Jack goes to breeds White German Shepperd's.  From what I can tell she is very reputable and the dogs of hers that I have met are great.  She competes with them--I'm guessing in the UKC.  It has actually helped Jack a lot being around them as he used to be a bit afraid of shepard looking dogs.

If she is breeding for color and outside the breed standard she is not a reputable breeder.

 
Now this is not always true. The White Shepherd breeders have been trying to get them established as a seperate breed for a long time. This person is competing with her dogs, and I think that says alot.
 
But in all honesty I think its a bit silly to want the White Shpherd to be classified as a seperate breed. They are just German Shepherds with white coats. A litter of GSD's can contain both the tan/black and whites so they are not a seperate breed.
 
I think it wouldve been a better idea to try and get the White GSD to be accepted as an allowable color.
 
Next we will have the owners of solid black GSD's wanting to have them registered as a seperate breed. Dalmatians come with black spots and liver spots, should they be different breeds just because of a color difference??

I know that some breeders of WGSD are trying to get them established seperate from the GSD standard. The white is a masking gene, which means under all that white hair is the dogs true color, but there is no way to tell what it is,  and most breeders will not, or should I say, should not breed the same pair that produces it, just like they should not breed, blue, liver, panda, coated, king, soft ears, and so on. I highly doubt it will get sanctioned in the GSD breed standard, so trying to get it recognised on it's own is the best way to go.

The WGSD has been around since I can remember and I am almost 43, if they have not added it to the standard in the last 30 odd years I doubt they ever will.
 
here is a thread on the GSD board that explains some of this.
[linkhttp://www.germanshepherds.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=UBB50&Number=763813&Searchpage=1&Main=762706&Words=color&topic=&Search=true#Post763813]http://www.germanshepherds.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=UBB50&Number=763813&Searchpage=1&Main=762706&Words=color&topic=&Search=true#Post763813[/link]
 


Dawn

Anne, thank you....as you know my mental clarity has been a bit lacking this week so I do appreciate what you are saying.
 
My old brain cells are pretty depleted right now, but I *think* that it was only around the 30's or 40's that whites became disqualified for showing.  Again, I could be wrong, and it truly wouldn't surprise me if I am.

There is a similar situation in Dobermans, where the white masking gene is present and you can have non-albino dobes....I gather that they have acceptance in Europe-particularly Germany where the tendency was first noted and recorded.  As long as the animals are physically sound in all other ways, and the white gene is not connected to some other medical or physical anomoly, I guess perhaps it is wise to allow them to be shown and compete completely.  What I find schizophrenic is that they can compete in obedience, agility, tracking, etc, but not conformation.  A rose by any other name????
 
I do recall hearing that vision and hearing problems are associated with the white genetic trait.  Anyone know if there is any truth to that?

The difference between white shepherds is that their white isn't linked to health problems- they have normal pigment. (Think of them as one big white spot) and black (or liver or grey, in theroy- I've never seen a liver or blue WGSD) pigment on their noses and eyerims.In dobermans, it *is* a form of albino. (No, their eyes aren't red and they do tend to have some pale cream markings- check [linkhttp://whitedobes.doberinfo.com/]http://whitedobes.doberinfo.com/[/link] for good, well-researched info.)

I think making the WGSDs their own breed makes sense. The UKC WGSD champions I've seen have been very nicely put together dogs- not as extreme in type as the AKC showdogs or as intense drive as the German dogs. (Not that the German dogs are bad, but frankly, I don't want to live with a dog with such high prey drive- I hope that now that they have a herding program to fulfill in German that some of the focus will switch away from the super-intense prey-bitey Schutzhund dogs.) I *so* want a GSD in the future. Color doesn't matter so much as a nice moderate, equitable temperament, desire to WORK with people, trainability, and athleticism- basically the same things I like about a collie, although I'd expect a GSD to be not QUITE so sensitive.

Edited because I was incorrect about what *type* of albinism dobermans have, it's still being researched and I can't find a good source.  

I agree with Cait. There are health issues related to the white color in Dobes which is why the Doberman Pinscher Club of America is very outspoken about [linkhttp://www.dpca.org/albinoinfo1.html]white Dobes[/link].
 
In Boston Terrier, white is also an issue. If there is a lot of white on the dog, particularly on the head, there is a very high chance that the dog is deaf. A lot of this is due to the fact that one of the breeds used to create the Boston Terrier was the now extinct White English Terrier and this breed had a very high preponderance of deafness. While a lot of white on a Boston Terrier is considered a disqualification, a lot of irresponsible breeders sell these dogs as "rare" and charge insane money for them.