Disciplining Chihuahuas. (for all you Chihuahua owners out there)

Pomeranian <3

Like I said after her being 10months old and being allowed to pee every 4hours (I even wake up in the middle of the night for her sometimes) if that's not fair then what is?

I am not trying to pick a fight, but there is something weird about a dog will pee outside and them come right inside and pee again. That says to me medical issue OR mishandling potty training when young.

There is no 4 hour rule. I take my pup out more frequently than every 4 hours. If it is cold and he doesn't want to go outside, I go with him and suffer too. When you devote yourself from the first days, dogs learn not to go in the house.  

Pomeranian <3

Liesje

If the punishment is not immediately issued, the dogs will not understand... 

I'm no "training expert" but I know what the heck I'm doing.

If she would pee inside right after we went outside I put put her nose next to the pee and say "NO! OUTSIDE!" then I would ignore her for an hour. After doing that twice she NEVER peed inside again.

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Do you really?  I mean so you think your dog knows what outside means?  Does she speak english?  Does she know what the significance of ignoring her for an hour means?  I think that training in that way is evidence of the human's frustration, not really the best way of accomplishing things.  They used to amputate people's legs for peripheral vascular disease, but now we can bypass them and they keep the leg.  Things change for the better sometimes.  Maybe since you are not an expert as you have already said, listen to some people who have a lot more experience then you and some that acually are experts in the area.  You could learn a thing or two that will make your dog's life better.  (I am NOT an expert in dog training, but I've gotten good advice from some)

Dog_ma

I am not trying to pick a fight, but there is something weird about a dog will pee outside and them come right inside and pee again. That says to me medical issue OR mishandling potty training when young.

There is no 4 hour rule. I take my pup out more frequently than every 4 hours. If it is cold and he doesn't want to go outside, I go with him and suffer too. When you devote yourself from the first days, dogs learn not to go in the house.  

Yeah I did too which is why she was tested twice for any issues. In the end I realized she was just being stubborn, marking, and wasn't really potty trained.

Yes there is no four hour rule, but if I can't take her out for a period of 4hrs there is absolutely no reason why she can't hold it... When I'm home after work we'll usually go outside more occasionally for play & fun & walking. But holding your pee for 4hrs shouldn't be a problem. AND it's not ne more. She even holds it all night long. She'll pee @ 10pm then pee at 7am. IRONICALLY it all started after I punished her twice...

Now if you have none judgemental advice thats fine; like I've always said I'm always willing and open to new ideas. The original training & hired trainer techniques just weren't enough.

The fact is WHATEVER I did... well it worked. Kayla never has accidents. If you say "outside" or "lesh" she runs to the door and sits and waits... she "knows" what those words mean. When she has to go she'll sit by the door now... I mean to me that shows I did something right.

For FUTURE small dogs I'd love to hear what people did when they had similar issues.

How can you be sure that this form of punishment works when it was only used twice?  I could say the same for my dogs of a totally opposite method that I've used more than twice on more than one dog.  I say nothing after an accident, just take the dog directly outside and praise it for finishing its business out there.  This has happened to both of my dogs, all times soon after I got them and was still figuring out the right schedule (and the right food).  Maybe there was just two times Kayla couldn't hold it so she had an accident?  I just don't think two times with one dog is enough to disprove all of the other studies done on how dogs learn and come to the conclusion that the dog was stubborn and wanted to mark.

Also, I don't like the "old" method because it involves anger.  I don't ever get that angry at my dogs.  If they make mistakes like that, it's because I've done something wrong like not done enough training, not taken them out soon enough, accidentally reinforced the wrong behavior, etc.  I simply don't agree with punishing a young dog out of anger. 

Liesje

How can you be sure that this form of punishment works when it was only used twice?  I could say the same for my dogs of a totally opposite method that I've used more than twice on more than one dog.  I say nothing after an accident, just take the dog directly outside and praise it for finishing its business out there.  This has happened to both of my dogs, all times soon after I got them and was still figuring out the right schedule (and the right food).  Maybe there was just two times Kayla couldn't hold it so she had an accident?  I just don't think two times with one dog is enough to disprove all of the other studies done on how dogs learn and come to the conclusion that the dog was stubborn and wanted to mark.

Also, I don't like the "old" method because it involves anger.  I don't ever get that angry at my dogs.  If they make mistakes like that, it's because I've done something wrong like not done enough training, not taken them out soon enough, accidentally reinforced the wrong behavior, etc.  I simply don't agree with punishing a young dog out of anger. 

Well I would say 98% of the time she would pee almost "purposely" after coming inside and being fully done. Or peeing again an hour later. Or just marking an area with this tiny little pee mark. [which is why I thought it was medical because I was like there is no way she could be having this many "accidents"]

When I showed her how angry it made me; IRONICALLY it stopped... of course I didn't like doing it! For 10months my boyfriend was calling me a whimp and I was protecting her too much (but I was like you and said no its wrong, books say it, trainers say it, it doesn't feel right...) Maybe I did lose all ideas and reverted back to methods we used on my Sheltie... did it work? It SEEMS it did... she never has accidents anymore..

Maybe she is afraid of being punished?  I'm not saying it doesn't work, but that's just not a nice way to train a dog, IMO.  Sure, you can get dogs to do or not do a lot of things by getting angry and making them scared of your reactions.  She doesn't understand WHAT made you mad, only that you got mad and it's scary for her. She won't understand peeing in the house as a bad thing, only that peeing in the house makes mom get mad and scary and punish me.  It's your choice.  I just chose to have my dogs do things because it's fun and rewarding, not because they are scared of the consequences.

Pomeranian <3

If you think "going by the book" for 9months, hiring a trainer when it doesn't work for once a week for another month, taking her to the Vet to see if it had to do with medical issues, and still realizing my dog pees whenever the heck she feels like it ISN'T brains then do explain what is....

 

I'm not sure what "book" you were going by.  Most folks that I know use common sense.  If you are consistent at taking the puppy out, & you pay attention to it while it's loose in the house, house training is relatively simple.  It sounds to me, as if you just weren't consistent with your dog.

Pomeranian <3

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Pomeranian <3

For FUTURE small dogs I'd love to hear what people did when they had similar issues.

Same as big dogs, or any dogs:  Pups generally need to go one hour for each age in months, probably sooner so that's like the max they can hold it (and obviously there is a cut-off, my dogs are full grown adults and the longest I make them hold it is 8 hours, more like 1-2 if they've eaten a large meal).  Take pup outside and ignore pup.  If pup pees/poos, PRAISE, treats, LOTS of attention.  Play with pup OUTSIDE for a few minutes so pup doesn't associate pottying with immediately having to go back in (unless the pup hates being outside). If pup does no pee/poo after a few minutes, take pup back in without a lot of praise or attention.  If it's about that time when you know the pup should have to be going, repeat every 10-15 minutes or so until pup goes and wins the praise and treat.  If there's an accident, immediately take pup out in case there is more she needs to go and do the same as above.  Otherwise, clean up accident.  If pup is not yet reliable and must be left alone for periods of time, put the pup on a surface that can be peed on without humans getting mad (ex-pen on linoleum, newspapers/puppy pads, crate with plastic bottom).  If you know you have to leave pup for longer than the pup can hold it, you must provide and train for an alternative (ex-pen with area for potty like puppy pads or newspapers).  Accidents will happen.  If there are accidents, take a step back and decrease the time the pup has to hold it.  Also increase the rewards for going outside.

Pomeranian <3

When I showed her how angry it made me; IRONICALLY it stopped.

I don't think dogs really understand "angry."  Anger just scares them.  Sticking a dog's nose in their mess and popping them on the butt with a rolled up newspaper certainly does work.  It is the way we used to house train dogs.  It just isn't the best way.

Stick around, tone down the attitude a bit, and just maybe you will learn something here.

**content removed, rude** Hopefully that can be resolved by the people who are "in charge." I'm sorry but I am allowed to point out when people offend me. **content removed, offensive**Try not to completely ruin this thread people... ha

THANK YOU to those who gave your insight on the matter in a non-judgemental way. Pretty sure we all know house breaking is historically known to be difficult with my breed. I'm glad Kayla doesn't have any problems anymore, but lets say if she did in the future or if I get my second Pom I'll try some of those techniques :o)

I do think it "may" have WORKED. Just like it "worked" for many many many dogs in the past. My own sheltie being one of them. ALSO people I do consider to be great dog owners have used the "old method" from day one. Hopefully I can "inspire" them to break that mold with some of your ideas! If punishment is necessary I now see other way besides putting their nose next to the pee. Hopefully others will listen. I for one was a disbeliever since that alone never did work for me...

My mother always said "dogs need to learn how to hold their pee just like a child! its a muscle that needs to be trained" but this is also the same woman who used the nose in pee method... idk... I can't be against it b/c I used it and I can't be for it b/c I don't ENJOY doing it...

Xerxes

Pomeranian <3

I'd like to hear what you used for punishment [

 

I used social deprivation for punishment.  That's way more effective than physical abuse.  It's also a direct language that the dog understands, and it's what the sire and dam would do for a serious transgression.   

You will find that many of us on the board never use physical punishment and we have well trained, house trained dogs just the same.  And, to be honest, if you come here and brag about how you stuck your dog's nose in its pee, you should expect that some people will react very negatively to that kind of antiquated "training" technique.  That's less about you than it is about us wanting to insure that the newbies and lurkers here will not think that's the way they should be trying to house train their dogs.

Pomeranian <3

My mother always said "dogs need to learn how to hold their pee just like a child! its a muscle that needs to be trained" but this is also the same woman who used the nose in pee method... idk... I can't be against it b/c I used it and I can't be for it b/c I don't ENJOY doing it...

Right, but I don't see how putting someone's face in pee inspires them to hold it?  That's not how my mom trained me.  I had accidents when I was a kid, but when I was three I was potty trained.  Go on toilet - get a sticker or a gold star.  Pee in pants - oops! better luck next time.  No being spanked or pushing in pee for something I was still learning.

Why use a method you don't enjoy when there are others that work just as well? 

probe1957

Stick around, tone down the attitude a bit, and just maybe you will learn something here.

As for that statement trust me I don't have an attitude... didn't really ask for advice people just started to attack my comment so I responded. I do enjoy hearing non-judgemental other "solutions." I'm not closed minded. I see that most people on the forum value the new methods very much which is understandable. If anything I'm the only one not being closed minded! Yes I punished my dog the "traditional" way a couple of times... gosh am I going to hell for it??? :o( geeeeez everyone makes it seem so! I consider myself a very attentive responsible dog owner. I learn new things every day and tried all possibilities with house breaking. Like I said, "whatever" I did worked... end of my personal life story. So lets not ruin the thread just because someone read that I reverted to nose in pee method after all else didn't work.

Liesje

Right, but I don't see how putting someone's face in pee inspires them to hold it?  That's not how my mom trained me.  I had accidents when I was a kid, but when I was three I was potty trained.  Go on toilet - get a sticker or a gold star.  Pee in pants - oops! better luck next time.  No being spanked or pushing in pee for something I was still learning.

Why use a method you don't enjoy when there are others that work just as well? 

I personally really really agree with this as well... I really did try SO HARD to do that too!!! :o( I mean I even hired a trainer when she got to be 10months old... I really really did try the new way... for that exact reason; I wouldn't want my face in pee either ya know???

I felt bad when I did it those couple times; but I knew somehow I needed to "get tough." Could there have been something else that went wrong??? Or do you agree that maybe some dogs do need a form of punishment???

Pomeranian <3

**content removed, previously edited content** Hopefully that can be resolved by the people who are "in charge." I'm sorry but I am allowed to point out when people offend me. **content removed, previously edited content**

With all due respect, No one here minds everyone having their own opinion, but it is all about how you go about posting your thoughts on things when you disagree with other posters. 

As it has been stated on this forum, countless times, it is best to review what you type and reread to see how it might be perceived by others BEFORE you hit the post button.  

As far as the training.. I grew up like Probe in a home where we swatted dogs with a newspaper and rubbed their noses in it.  It WAS effective, but training has come a LONG way since then and I have learned a lot since my childhood and have been happy to teach my family a different way of potty training and disciplining their dogs over the years that is also effective and far more humane.