Kenya update

    • Gold Top Dog

    Kenya update

    Many of you know that since I've had Kenya (and before that) she has had some various issues with lack of confidence, generalized insecurity around certain types of people, and neurotic behaviors.  Many things have improved over the past few years, but she also continues to pick up new neurotic behaviors, or she will stop doing one and start with another.  I guess if you think of a dogs "nerves" as a combination of how low the threshold is for fight/flight and how quickly the dog recovers, we have made a lot of progress with the threshold (she has a pretty high threshold -  no issues with gun fire, fireworks, thunderstorms, random accidental loud noises, crowds of strange people, the chaotic environment of dog shows/trials) but it's the recovery that is always the issue.  Once she is upset about something she doesn't recover quickly and might even generalize, like she will cower near that person for a few days, or act spooky in that area of the house.

    Anyway, as I've always done, I continue taking her various places.  Like my parent's house to watch the Olympics, Schutzhund club to socialize and play obedience, the pet store, etc.  Everywhere we go she acts so calm and happy and everyone says they cannot believe she has any problems at all.  One time she was at my parents, hopped on the couch, and started kissing my mom.  My mom said, "This dog is so nice, I don't believe she is neurotic," and as she was kissing my mom I said, "Yeah, her new obsession is eating her own poop." Stick out tongue 

    Lately I've been wondering very hard about how many of her neurotic behaviors and obsessions are now environmentally triggered.  I've been brainstorming about a good way to test this when something presented itself: we just got back from a week long vacation and it's the one vacation a year we do where the dogs cannot come.  Usually they all stay on a friend's farm, but I decided to see if my little sister wanted to watch Kenya at her house.  She's in college and lives with a few other girls her age, no men, no other dogs.  She needed some money so she agreed to do it.  When I dropped Kenya off, she jumped on the couch next to my sister's roommate and put her head on her lap.  Last night I went to go pick her up.  She was excited to see me, jumping all over me but she was also excited to see my sister home from work.  My sister kept hinting that they loved her and she was so good.  Then Kenya went on the couch and basically curled up in my sister's lap, as much as a GSD can sit in someone's lap.  I pretended to leave and her ears perked up but she didn't run to follow (often she follows me so closely I'm tripping over her).

    After seeing this, we agreed that Kenya could stay there until the supplies I originally left ran out.  Then I would check again and see how she is doing and go from there.  She has always been very, very much a one-person dog but transfers the distinction of "her person" relatively quickly as long as it's clear.  For example, when I picked her up from the breeder originally, she was following me around and looking to me for everything within 24 hours.  There was also a time where I had to bring her to a pet hotel for a day and wasn't going to be back at their pickup time so my sister agreed to pick her up and take her to my house.  When she picked up Kenya, Kenya ran to her and treated her like it was me picking her up.  It seems that she needs one person to bond with and it has to be a female but as long as she is treated kindly and without too much pressure (not physical pressure, but like if a person is trying too hard to win her over it is stressful for her), she seems to adapt almost instantaneously.

    In just the 12 hours since I picked up Nikon and Coke and came home without Kenya, I've also noticed changes at home.  Nikon seems much more controlled in the house.  He hasn't been barking at anything and has been entertaining himself (sleeping on the couch, chewing a ball, etc) with less pacing around.  It's not all on Kenya; Nikon has been a firecracker since day one and has always needed extra work in the self-control department, but recently I had noticed that the two GSDs were sort of feeding off the nervous energy of each other.  If Nikon started barking, Kenya would be sending out calming signals.  If Kenya was doing something neurotic, Nikon would be pacing around.  Coke is just so incredibly calm and chill all the time, he never factored in.  We went to the store last night, came home, and not a peep from the boys.  Usually Kenya is barking and spinning wildly in her crate as soon as the car pulls in, which gets Nikon barking and chattering his teeth and by the time I get inside and remind them they aren't coming out until they lie down and be quiet, they are already out of control for no reason.  It reminds me of when I've been at people's houses who have rows of kennels.  One dog starts and then they are ALL jumping, spinning, barking, and running laps in their kennels.

    I miss Kenya already, she's always been my little side-kick, but I'm willing to give this a shot and see how she does in her new environment.  When I dropped her off, all I told my sister was to not smother her with attention and never make her feel as if she's backed into a corner (literally or figuratively).  I didn't tell them about any of her neurotic behaviors because I was curious to see if my sister would describe any when I got back.  The only thing she mentioned is Kenya's tendency to basically FLY in/out of her crate or any door.  She has a scab on the side of her face right now b/c at my house she tries to push her way through the sliding door as I open it and apparently ripped her face on the metal door frame, or maybe got scraped on her wire crate doing the same thing.  You can ask her to sit and wait while you open a door but as soon as you release her she will bolt through as if her life depended on getting through the door as fast as possible.  I've tried leashing her and heeling her back and forth slowly with treats but she gets all nerved up (ears down, head twitching side to side, mouth tight).  Some of these behaviors are just impossible to block with treats or trying to change the behavior.  It's like it's not a matter of her wanting to slowly follow a treat more than bolt through a door, but she just can't control herself.  Other than the door thing, they said she eats good, seems comfortable pottying (she's a performance anxiety pooper!), likes to walk with my sister, sleeps in bed with her, loves the roommate, and does not seem wary when the boyfriend is over.  The food I left should last another week and I need to get her flea/tick and heartworm meds so I'll check on her soon.  She seemed quite relaxed being the only dog and being pampered by the girls.  She likes dogs and is dog friendly but doesn't seem to miss having dogs around.

    This is getting long so I'll leave it at that.  Just wanted to give an update since many of you have been very helpful with things to try or just sharing experiences with similar dogs.  I love this dog and just want the best for her, even if that means a temporary or maybe permanent change of environment.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Lies -- you are awesome, Lady ... I know only too well you've described her as your 'heart dog' -- and I also know how much you've put in to trying to make a difference for her.  When someone is willing to step aside just to let the dog 'be all she can be' -- that's incredible love. 

    Will keep this in my good thots and prayers. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Thanks Callie.  I miss all my dogs when I am on vacation, but I noticed how less stressed I was without her, without constantly worrying whether she was happy or what she was going to start doing next.  I'm a pretty Type A, worry-wart so she probably feeds off of that as much as it stresses me out to see her when she's anxious.  My sister looks like me, kind of acts like me, but is NOT a worry-wart, much more of a free spirit.  Maybe that would have always been a better match, I don't know.

    Also, DH and I are going to start more seriously looking at buying a house, and we will have the dogs in mind (we are looking at a specific neighborhood which has a very quiet street with one side against a cemetery so those yards have no one behind them but a small patch of woods).  Maybe if there is not always three dogs, three cats, and two adults basically living in one room it will be a better home for her, with me.  Coke and Nikon are just different, they don't mind close quarters - dog or human - and love being affectionate but Kenya has always needed more personal space and is not as motivated by physical interaction.

    • Gold Top Dog

    It's always such a hard thing to think about. But kudos to you for trying something out to see if it's the right thing for her, as that's the most important thing anybody can do when they are responsible for the life of another. I really look forward to hearing what comes of this test, to see how things pan out.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Liesje, believe it or not, living with your sister might be the best thing for Kenya. There, she's number one dog in the house. As much as it may hurt, you are not "abondoning" her but maybe releasing her to her full potential. Our friend, B, had a Great Pyrenees that she raised from a pup in a fisherman's cabin with just a small, fenced in area. But she felt bad and sent her to live with friends that own a sheep ranch. Lilli, the GP, is now totally content and in her element, being a livestock guardian dog. And did something none of the other dogs on the ranch could do. She made friends with the donkey and they trade kisses. For those of you who don't know, ranchers often keep a donkey with the flock or herd because donkeys will run off and stomp to bits coyotes or small wolves that think they have a chance. Same reason for an LGD, especially a Great Pyrenees.

    If Kenya is much more happy this way, and so is everyone else, then this is what should be. After about an hour of visiting with Shadow, he was "mine." He howled like he was "deserted" when I went to get my truck, which was parked some distance away. He never looked back, even though he's happy when he gets to see his former owners, now and then.

    You definitely have my support if you guys decide to have Kenya live with your sister. And blessings to all of you guys and hooraw for the courage you show to bring this topic here.

     

    • Gold Top Dog
    I know you will do what is best for Kenya, even if it does hurt you to do it.  I will miss her if this turns out to be a permanent change....  Also, I think how she is dealt with when she is pushed past her trigger is important.... Your lifestyle might be a little more.... chaotic....? than is perfectly ideal for her, but knowledge and commitment equal to yours are surely also important to her well being. 
    • Gold Top Dog

     I think it is awesome you are willing to put aside some of your own desires to check this out. 

    Kirby verges on neurotic and has had some nervy issues I've had to deal with that all relate to his insecurities.  I think the big difference that has helped me, especially since I'm such a novice, is that he tends to recover quickly and isn't quick to generalize at all.  It makes it much easier to back pedal and get over handler mistakes or uncontrollable environmental triggers.  Like Kenya however he is a dog that needs and likes his space and I know there will be a lot of thinking that will need to go into adding a dog to our family because I could see him easily feeding off of or causing extra tension with the wrong match.

    That being said, I have a strong feeling that why Kenya is doing so well right off the bat with your sister is in large part with all the work you put in.  You have done a lot to work with Kenya.  You have helped to renew her confidence, especially around men, and I believe that is why she is now seeming to thrive at her current vacation home even when the boyfriend comes over.  It is the same reason why people often love her in public and never seen any faults because you have taken all the time working with her and make sure not to place her in a situation that would set her up to fail.

    Sometimes being the best match for an animal means working with them, loving them, and then recognizing the best thing you can do is let them go to another family.

    • Gold Top Dog

     Lies, I went through a similar thing with my pet hare. There was a time when I nearly released him into the wild. The thought made me cry, but making a selfless decision for a loved one is always easy to me. I can only ever want what is best for my animals, and no one is more honest about their welfare than I am, because no one cares for them as much as I do. A happy animal is the ultimate reward. It's just sad that sometimes to make them really happy you have to say goodbye to them.

    I'm sure everyone here knows that you will do what is best for Kenya rather than what you want. That's what makes you such a great owner. Smile

    I can relate to personalities clashing a little. I'm very sensitive to the emotional state of everyone around me. I found with Penny that she was prone to getting intense or anxious and that would make me anxious, and then that would make her even more anxious. We would feed off each other. It didn't matter who started it, we were equally sensitive to it and we were no good for each other sometimes. I was worried Erik would be a bit like that as well, but I find that he has a coping style more compatible with my personality. He comes looking for reassurance when he's anxious. That puts me in a caring frame of mind and I can unhitch myself from his emotional state and concentrate on making him feel better.

    • Moderators
    • Gold Top Dog

     just reading this now - Lies I think it is amazing that you even tried this and I am glad that you did for her, for you, and for the boys

    I know that you will make the best decision for all

    • Gold Top Dog

    It's been a few weeks now, things seem to be going good.  My sister came over last week so Kenya got to play with the boys for a while, then we all went to the pet store so I could show her what foods to buy (her boyfriend bought Purina Dog Chow, ack!).  Kenya looked good and acted happy.

    In the past few weeks, three different people who see my dogs once every few months or so have told me that Nikon seems so much calmer.  Still works in drive and with intensity but when he's not working, he is more relaxed and demonstrates self-control, less puppy antics and more "I'm gonna take a nap b/c everything is under control here".  Maybe Kenya's anxiety being out of the picture is helping him, or maybe he's just growing up on his own and when she comes back into the house he will help her by giving off a better vibe.

    I think I'll check on Kenya at my sister's house next weekend.  I need to trim her nails and clean her ears.  I'd rather do it myself since I know how and I know how much I can do before the dog is uncomfortable.

    • Moderators
    • Gold Top Dog

     sounds like things are working out well for all at the moment - really admire what you've done Lies - continued success

    • Gold Top Dog

    I'm glad to hear it's going well for everyone. :)  

    • Gold Top Dog

    Liesje

    It's been a few weeks now, things seem to be going good.  My sister came over last week so Kenya got to play with the boys for a while, then we all went to the pet store so I could show her what foods to buy (her boyfriend bought Purina Dog Chow, ack!).  Kenya looked good and acted happy.

    In the past few weeks, three different people who see my dogs once every few months or so have told me that Nikon seems so much calmer.  Still works in drive and with intensity but when he's not working, he is more relaxed and demonstrates self-control, less puppy antics and more "I'm gonna take a nap b/c everything is under control here".  Maybe Kenya's anxiety being out of the picture is helping him, or maybe he's just growing up on his own and when she comes back into the house he will help her by giving off a better vibe.

    I think I'll check on Kenya at my sister's house next weekend.  I need to trim her nails and clean her ears.  I'd rather do it myself since I know how and I know how much I can do before the dog is uncomfortable.

     

    You described yourself as a Type A.  I'd be curious to know how you would describe your sister.  Also, I have noticed that some GSD's are way happier to be the one and only, and others like company.  Maybe Kenya is the former and Nikon is the latter (at least when it comes to neurotic females...and he certainly wouldn't be the only "man" to feel that way lol).  I think that it's very wise, and very unselfish to think about a dog's needs versus your own, especially since they haven't a choice in the matter unless we let them.  I'm happy that Kenya seems to be happy in her new situation, and it's extra nice that she is with someone you trust, too.

    • Gold Top Dog

    Liesje
      Maybe Kenya's anxiety being out of the picture is helping him,

     I'm sure of it.  So nice to hear that Kenya is doing well with Sis.  Very selfless of you Lies; this is a kind gesture to keep her happy with lessened anxiety.  And, you get to see her frequently which is bonus for everyone.

    • Gold Top Dog

    I'm so glad that Kenya is doing so well with your sister and Nikon seems to be calmer too. I agree with others that this was a very selfless decision you made and I applaud you.