Diary of Beginner's Agility - VanMorrison

    • Gold Top Dog

    This week was better!  Yay!

    The floor had been cleaned and Morrison was sniffing a LOT less.  Also, I just had fun with him and after we had been doing something that he doesn't like I would stop, kneel down and just play with him a bit.

    When I made a mistake I made sure just to laugh it off and try again.  I was kinda frustrating the trainer but I explained to him that Morrison didn't seem to be having fun and I wanted to change that.  Next thing I know the trainer is down on his knees playing with him!  This guy is much, much better with dogs than with people!

    Morrison was paying constant attention to me so that he wasn't even on his leash for most of the class.  Good boy!

    • Gold Top Dog

    VanMorrison
    Morrison was paying constant attention to me so that he wasn't even on his leash for most of the class.  Good boy!

    Yeah for you guys!

    Glad to hear he is having some fun and that the trainer is open to getting down and pwaying with Morrison!

    • Gold Top Dog

    This guy is much, much better with dogs than with people!

    Most dog trainers are better with dogs than people.  We/they get into it because we/they like dogs -- unfortunately people and dogs come as a package deal when teaching classes.  lol  Don't take it personally, I'm sure he's a nice enough guy who just doesn't express himself well to humans.

    I'm glad to hear that it went better for you this week!

    • Gold Top Dog

    This past Saturday was similar to the previous weeks.  Morrison seemed kinda shut down, wouldn't really play or seem excited about anything, even tug toys etc.  I brought DH along to observe us both but every time I looked over at him he was on his Blackberry.  He's an addict.  I asked him for his thoughts afterwards and he said "You were fine, Morrison seemed really tired".  Yeah.  That was helpful.

    So, I'm looking for ideas on how to make it fun and create some drive for him again.  Karrisa?

    • Gold Top Dog

    I have not read the entire thread (sorry) but I do know from my own observances some dogs have a "shut down" phase with agility. I have a friend with a WILD boxer, and when that dog finally started to understand this was not a free for all, it started completely slowing down. However they just stayed with it and the dog is improving everyday. In some dogs it is shorter in some dogs longer. Teddi has her "moments" of shut down, I think hers manifests differently, if I can keep her engaged in class, she does better. 

    Belle started agility shut down. My current trainer was the person to pull her out of her shell. One of the big things for Belle was to make the training place a "fun" place. We started with privates, and the beginning and end of each session was chasing her toys around the ring. Now she does not need that and she loves it. 

    My biggest suggestion is not to worry about it because if you do it could make him more shut down. Just ignore it and try to have fun, it should pass. 

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    It's hard to make any meaningful or helpful suggestions without seeing the situation and how the dog is reacting.

    Do you still have a bazillion dogs in this group?  Do you have long waits between your turns?  Are the classes still lasting 1 1/2 - 2 hours?  These are all issues that will cause a dog to shut down.

    Dogs do MUCH better with intensive (focused) work done in short periods.  When I work at home, each dog gets only about 10-15 minutes of "drilling" on equipment and then we're done for the day.  Even Kaiser is having a difficult time with the way that group classes run -- there were seven dogs in our group last week and there was a LOT of down time as we waited for the other dogs to make it through the exercises.  He was bored out of his mind after the first 30 minutes and started to shut down in the last half of the class (ours never run past an hour).  We were doing some course run-throughs afterwards, though, and after I ran Luke through it a few times, I pulled Kaiser out of his crate to give him a shot.  He did great because A) there were fewer dogs there at that time, B) he got to run/focus on a full course opposed to a short obstacle sequence and C) it was a short/concentrated training time with no sitting and waiting inbetween turns.

    Morrison sounds like the type of dog who would benefit greatly from some private time.  There are MANY bonuses to taking private lessons.  Luke, for instance, goes absolutely ape-sh*t over his black rubber ball and this is what I use for drive at home.  I *cannot* use the rubber ball in a class setting because there is generally not enough room to throw it without disturbing someone else and it's not fair to the other dogs who are also highly arroused by balls.

    Taking a few private lessons would also clue you in to whether or not Morrison is stressed by the large number of dogs in your class.  There are so many different vibes being thrown out by the various dogs in your group.  In my current class, Kaiser is completely stressed by a dog-aggressive Doberman and being anywhere near that dog will cause him to shut down.  If I stay well away from that particular dog, things go much better.

    Depending on the level of your class and how fast things are going, Morrison could be one of two things -- He could either be incredibly bored because things are moving too slowly for him OR he could be stressing because things are moving too fast and the level of difficulty is above what he is currently comfortable with.  Again, this is were privates help because they are tailored to the skill level of the dog.  I took many private lessons with Luke in the beginning (in addition to the group classes) because I didn't feel that the group classes were moving fast enough to keep Luke's interest.  The weekly privates pushed his skill level a bit and kept him enthusiastic about agility because he was having so much fun.  For some dogs, the low level weekly agility classes are just boring as all get-out.

    And finally, the last piece of the puzzle is you.  Since I'm not there at your classes, I have no idea what sort of a vibe you are throwing off.  There's a very good possibility that you are stressing him out simply by worrying so much about him shutting down.  There is such a thing as trying too hard.  Also, if you are at all nervous (which, believe me, the beginner classes are generally FILLED with people who are nervous about working their dog in front of other people), your dog will feed off that.  You really need to project a fun & confident vibe in order for your dog to do well.  Again -- this is where privates often come in handy because YOU no longer have the stress of performing in front of a group of people.

    Some dogs/people do fine in weekly group classes.  Others don't.  I would suggest that you look into the option of privates for a while to see if you can't get things turned around a bit.  Learning to perform well in group classes is important if you plan on attending trials in the future (hence why I have Kaiser enrolled!), but I think Morrison might be better off in a private or semi-private setting until he is more confident on the equipment.

    It's a shame you aren't closer, as I'd gladly have you over to play on my equipment once I put it back outside!  Big Smile

    • Gold Top Dog

     I agree with Karissa. Maze has shut down over the winter because all I own is a set of weaves so that's what we were working on.  She's bored with just that one piece. Her class starts up next week so we'll see what happens. I also started Maze with private lessons since I had no idea how she'd do in a class setting.

    In Sandy's class there's 6 or 7 dogs BUT there's also two trainers so we split the group in to groups of 3 or 4 dogs each and take them to opposite sides of the barn. After 15 minutes we switch sides and work on something different.  If we notice a dog is shutting down, we let the owners take the dog aside and do something fun for him before trying again. 

    • Gold Top Dog

     I will second the thought that he is shutting down.  If he is still new to agility and you are doing sequences with weaves but he doesnt' know how to weave then yeah, he's going to feel like he can't get it right and he's going to shut down. 

    He needs to be *taught* how to weave and find entrances without putting them into a sequence.  The dog should be able to do each obstacle individually from all safe angles, without handler help, before doing them in sequences.  Even if they're straight line sequences. 

    My suggestion would be to not do any obstacles in a sequence that he doesn't know how to do at competition regulation.  That means tires and jumps at his jump height and weaves completely closed and chutes flat on the ground.  If the dogs can't do these things with the handler not helping, then they shouldn't be put into sequences.  But that's my opinion as a trainer of agility. 

    So if weaves cause him problems (ie stress) then skip them.  Work on them by themselves without the stress of other obstacles.

    • Gold Top Dog

    This morning we encountered....success!

    At Morrison's birthday party he got this stretchy gecko squeeky toy.  All week I have been pulling it out for short bouts of tug play and fetch with it.  I surgically removed the squeekers this morning and it came to agility with us.  Morrison was so focused on the toy that he forgot to worry about making a mistake, so he didn't.  He was so focused on getting that toy that he actually drew blood at one point...from my hand, oops.

    This morning we were introduced to the chute and he was a rock star, driving straight through it with no fear at all.  He also nailed all his jumps, it was great to watch.

    He still has a little trouble with his back feet through the weaves and entering the tunnel.  I'll keep working with him on that.

    My goal for the last few weeks has been to have fun, myself as well as Morrison.  I do believe that is starting to pay off.

    LOL - you should have seen him going over his last jump today.  It was high and long and totally spazzy with long legs going in every direction, too funny.

    • Gold Top Dog

    VanMorrison
    LOL - you should have seen him going over his last jump today.  It was high and long and totally spazzy with long legs going in every direction, too funny.

     

    It's funny how graceful they can be one minute and total klutzes the next!  Sounds like you both did great and had fun too!

    • Gold Top Dog

    He was so focused on getting that toy that he actually drew blood at one point...from my hand, oops.

    You should have seen how marked up my hands/arms were when I used a tug rope as Luke's reward.  OMG, I looked like I'd been in a fight every week.  I learned pretty quickly how to stay out of the way...  lol

    Glad to hear that it went better for you this week!

    • Gold Top Dog

     

    VanMorrison

    LOL - you should have seen him going over his last jump today.  It was high and long and totally spazzy with long legs going in every direction, too funny.

     

    Oh that's a "lab thing" in my opinion! You should see Belle! I wish I could post this pic I have of her. It was taken over a triple at a trial last Aug. It was the last jump, she had a clean go, as we approached I said "big jump" and she ROCKETED through the air. I am NOT exaggerating.  I swear she felt like she was over my head (or at least my shoulder). As I was putting the leash on her I heard the photographer exclaim "OMG!" In the pic you barely see the top of the jump, and Belle is absolutely flying!

    We have a young lab in Belle's class now, she is really cute but she over jumps EVERYTHING. Why worry when you can just launch over it? It's a lab thing. 

    LOL
    • Gold Top Dog

    Morrison, and I, did pretty well this past weekend.  More importantly, at this stage, we had fun.

    The A-Frame was up to it's full height and Morrison was right up and right down with full contact.  He was going so fast that he slid right off the table which was next, then hopped back on, looked at me and said (with his face).  Phew!  That was fun!  Let's do it again without that Tire thingy!!!

    At the end of class we were on weaves and he kinda shut down and kept hopping out.  That's ok, for now.  We'll work on that at home.

    Our Beginner's class is no longer the beginner's class so I will end our diary here.  I'll keep you all posted with any breakthroughs or hurdles that we come across.