Failed basic obedience class:(

I agree, Karissa.  I think the CGC is something that most companion dogs should be able to achieve.  I'm not saying it's easy, but it's attainable and quitting after one try undermines the dog.  Unless the dog has a severe mental or physical problem, there's no reason any dog cannot be trained to a CGC level.

There's no harm in "failing" a few times.  My trainer's own dog failed twice before he passed and now he has his RE title.  Our Coke failed it last week, got a 9/10, but it's not a big deal we just need to work a little harder.  I could blame it on the fact that a bitch in heat peed all over the area where the other dogs had to demonstrate the sit, down, stay, and recall, but it's not his fault at all.  The weather has been SO bad this winter we the humans have not been working with him outdoors as much as we wanted, so we will try again in the spring.  A dog in heat is just another distraction, and to pass the CGC you must be able to control the dog in the presence of distractions.  Failing doesn't mean the dog is a bad dog, it just means the dog didn't complete the requirements for that course/test.  The nice thing with dogs as opposed to school/work is you can have as many re-takes as you want.

Pomeranian <3

At PETCO before you enroll in the CGC Class you must have at least completed our Beginner/Basic Obedience class (or paid one hour session with trainer to analyze dog).

Check the P&P...I think that is wrong.  I believe it says they must have completed the Basic Class OR an equivalent.  I take that to mean they must have a basic level of obedience training, but it does NOT say they have to pay for a one hour session to analyze the dog.  I'll check the P&P tomorrow for sure.  

I tend not to take a break in the middle of class because I find that the dogs get more distracted.  I also don't expect every dog to be perfect at the end of the class.  Some dogs learn more quickly than others.  The main purpose of a training class is to give you the knowledge to train your dog.  There will always be things that you can work on.  Now you know how, and you can keep improving. 

ColleenC

Pomeranian <3

At PETCO before you enroll in the CGC Class you must have at least completed our Beginner/Basic Obedience class (or paid one hour session with trainer to analyze dog).

 

Check the P&P...I think that is wrong.  I believe it says they must have completed the Basic Class OR an equivalent.  I take that to mean they must have a basic level of obedience training, but it does NOT say they have to pay for a one hour session to analyze the dog.  I'll check the P&P tomorrow for sure.  

So I asked about the AKC CGC Class last night (we typically don't get many inquiries about it) but... EQUIVALENT is right. They said to be sure they can show proof or dog must attend basic class OR one hour session (so they have the choice)

Is that how they do it at your store?

I don't require proof that they have taken another class or that they buy a one hour session for me to meet their dog.  All I ask (if I don't know the dog) is that they bring the dog up for me to meet.  If the dog seems to have a level of obedience equivalent to Basic class, I will let them in the class.  The P&P doesn't say that they have to show proof, so I don't require it. 

Now, you can give the AKC CLASS, but unless you are certified by AKC, you CANNOT test.  You must get an evaluator number.  PETCO is trying to renew their contract right now with AKC to have them waive the application fee for CEIs. 

That's really cool to know! Thanks :o)

OP, why should your dog get to be promoted to the next class when she's not ready for it? That's not fair to anyone! Certainly not fair to your dog- who won't be able to do the exercises, to you, who will end up frustrated, or to the instructor or other students, because the instructor will end up spending the time to catch you up rather than working with everyone.

I think three things need to happen here.

1. More practice. Your dog can be the most wiggly, exuberant dog in the world. She still can, given sufficient practice and effort on your part, learn to sit and stay. Her attitude is NOT the problem- and in fact, how much she loves people is a GREAT way to fix it (just have the person back up when she moves towards them- doggy zen with a person as the reward!)- but your low expectations *are*. Don't let your low expectations get in the way of your dog achieving her potential!

2. Find a different placeto train. If you're just interest in basic manners? A competition club probably isn't the place for you.

3. PRACTICE. PRACTICE. PRACTICE. I work with each of my guys between 30 minutes and an hour a day, in little 2-5 minute chunks here and there. It works GREAT. The only times I practice longer than that are when running full rally courses in the yard, at class, and at matches and show and goes. I have BRATTY dogs. If I can get Mal through an RN practicing like that (and okay, he's only got one leg, but it's been a timing issue), you can get you rdog to polite manners with it.  

it sounds like your dog is a totally normal puppy.  I personally don't take a puppy to a group obedience class until the dog has mastered all the basics in a less-distracting environment. The class, to me, is just where you practice what you already know in a distracting environment and you and the dog learn to ignore the distractions. It's very difficult for your dog to learn new stuff under such conditions. If you don't know how to train your dog, a few private sessions might be better. Any class where the instructor has you yanking a distracted puppy around by the leash is probably a class you don't need to attend anyway.

Thanks for all the responses.  I was just feeling a little upset since it had just happened.  I had a feeling we wouldn't pass with the walking part in class.  Outside of class she walks good on a leash & if she starts pulling I do give her a quick yank, which of course happens a lot when people pass or she sees a squirrel.

I know I should've trained more. I trained only fro 5-10min a day, but what boggled my minds was the training at home in a quiet enviorment of course was easier & she always did well.

I still have the handouts from this class & remember every thing that we learned so I'm going to work her longer until the fall when the class starts again at this facility.  I don't want to hold my negative feelings about not passing on the facility not being the right one, cuz as one poster said it's me who has the power to make her pass/fail.

Another question: I contacted a diff. obedience center & explained how we didn't pass basic obed. & she suggested I do rally obedience because it's not so structred & more fun for some dogs.  Do you think in the meantime I should do this??

brandy76

Another question: I contacted a diff. obedience center & explained how we didn't pass basic obed. & she suggested I do rally obedience because it's not so structred & more fun for some dogs.  Do you think in the meantime I should do this??

Do you plan to do competitive formal obedience?  I ask because in rally, you can use any hand and verbal signals you want, and you can talk and signal the dog all the way through the course.  It's difficult to switch back to formal obedience, where you would say "heel!" and then do the entire heeling exercise in silence.  I did switch to rally and I do not regret it.  It helped me bond with my dog.  Since she is my first dog and first training experience, rally helped me learn how to communicate and how to instinctively build different commands and hand signals in a positive way.  Now we are looking to start formal obedience competition and will have to polish up our act, get rid of a lot of the extra signals and verbal "chatter", but I'm still glad I started with rally.  It really helped build my confidence and her confidence as well. I've also found that the way we go through rally training is more similar to real life than formal obedience.  For example, I don't know about you guys but when we go to the pet store I don't give one "heel!" command at the door and then march around the store in silence; no, I'm always using my voice and my hand signals to keep the dog in line and tell her when she is behaving correctly.  I have nothing against formal obedience and can't wait to start that class and that competition, but I don't know where I'd be if I hadn't been persuaded into trying rally first!

I don't think I'm up to doing the competitive formal obedience.  It takes a lot of effort, time & travel & with my schedule I would just be miserable.  So I might try a rally class which does seem like fun.

 Thanks!!

I agree, Rally training seems more applicable to daily life than competition obedience training. Plus it's more fun.

Liesje, I have to totally disagree that it's harder to switch from rally to competition obedience. That's sort of the entire POINT of Rally- to provide a bridge between the CGC program (any commands, multiple signals, etc) to competitive obedience (single commands (although you can, in many cases, give a second command, you'll just take a deduction for it -but it's not alawys an automatic NQ for everything).

 Get the CGC basics out of the way first and a bit more focus. Then try rally. :) You'll need to the focus to get through a rally course (especially beyond Novice/L1 anyawy.)

Cait
 

So I need to do a CGC before I try rally? or are you saying I need to pass a basic obedience class bf I go to rally.  I was about to sign  up in a few weeks for rally

Not necessarily- my guys don't have CGCs (mostly because I never remember in time to sign up in advance, although Lizzie's only 6 months- she could PROBABLY pass, but why bother?) BUT if your dog hasn't got sit, down, and a rudimentary heel for at least 10-12 steps, including turns and stopping and going when you do? (Most classes will teach you the 'obedience' things that you don't normally cover in pet classes - fronts, left and right finishes, and the about turns). Depending on where exactly your dog had problems in basic obedience, it might work out well, or it might not. If your dog is good on everything except LLW, it's probably worth a shot. A lot of the doodles that make up rally stations (about turns, 270s, pivots) are things that obedience compeitors use to teach and then sharpen a dog's awareness of what heel position is. But if your dog has trouble with focus to an excessive degree (some distractability is fine and normal- that's why you train!- but if the dog can't focus at ALL, the class is too much and you need to bump down a few steps to something easier, like working behind a barrier or at a distance from other dogs- or if your dog is not yet reliable on sits and downs without a very obvious lure? I'd do another round of basic first, or sit out a month and practice a whole lot at home.)

 I took Mal through half my very first rally class (and he already had the basics down, but not perfectly, and he didn't have a whol elot of focus yet) and changed partway through to Indy (who was 5 at the time, and has quite good heeling on leash as long as there's some verbal reinforcement in there). There's enough for the handler to be learning, as far as footwork and rules go, that it can be REALLY frustrating to be a green handler and green dog in the same session.
 

I've done stuff a little differently with Lizzie. She's 6 months old and her heeling isn't where Mal's was at the same age, but her focus is 300% better. I used a lot of stuff from Morgan Spector's "Clicker Training For Obedience" and played a lot of games from "Control Unleashed" and I really think it has helped bring her along faster, overall, and decreased my frustration/anxiety level immensely.  She's much further along in some areas than Mal was, but I'm going to let her sit out this next round of rally class (I'm going to take her and her crate along, but may just pull her out before/after class and practice in the nice distracting environment)- she's got good focus and great sits and downs, but sitting IN heel position is tough right now, and her LLW isn't where it needs to be to really benefit from class. So I'm taking Mal instead and he can get extra experience and play demo dog (I'm assisting this time so he'll be crated for part of each class, which is also good for him. :P)

My pup is good with sit even w/o a treat, i've only done downs with her when there is a treat & she does them good, but I need to start phasing out the treats.  She can sit/stay for 30 seconds, along with down stay.  Stand/stay she can only do for the length of time it takes for me to walk around her (while she's standing in place) and back in front of her (with a treat).

She walks fine until she sees something or gets scarred & wants to run back to the house or when we are just beginning our walk & she's excited.  I need to work on that but I feel so bad having to yank her all over the place on walks that are supposed to be nice.