The least I've ever spent on really awesome dog food! (Ratsicles) *More stuff added!*

    • Gold Top Dog

    Your pups are lucky! I wish I could raise my own food, but I'm not sure the city would like that Wink  lol

    However, I do share your excitement! Sierra gets to eat this in about 2 weeks:

    It's a Mule Deer (and this photo isn't mine). My bf is going hunting today, and will hopefully bring back one. If not, he's trying again tomorrow. They apparently don't taste as good as the Whitetail, so the Muley is all Sierra's Smile 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Ratsicles
    By Ken Midkiff.

    Isn't he a long time anti large scale farming activist and former director of the Sierra club.  Sounds like the book could be a little bias to me.

    Here is one of his quotes:

    I am an environmentalist. I care about clean air, clean water, and land stewardship. Industrial agribusiness corporations threaten all of these, and for this reason environmental and conservation organizations are supportive of diversified family farms. 

    http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=200411436&var_Year=2004&var_Month=12&var_Day=15

     

    • Gold Top Dog

    I've been in a commercial egg-factory and was totally nauseated and now only buy eggs from a local free-range egg farmer, for three times the grocery store price. Also been in a commercial pig factory farm and couldn't believe it was legal to keep animals that way. The kill pigs have it good compared to the breeding sows. It's disgusting beyond belief. Raising meat animals used to be very environmentally sound and economical-- the cows turned grass into meat and milk; the pigs turned garbage and woods- forage into meat; the chickens turned bugs into eggs and meat; the dogs ate the animal parts we didn't want to eat; and the manure was used to fertilize the crops. The real problem is there are too many humans around for anything we do to be environmentally sound. spay and neuter, anyone?

    • Gold Top Dog

    Liesje
    some venison (uncle's kill from last season).  I was stunned that Kenya will not eat it!! 

     

     

    Liesje my dogs wont eat venison either.I ordered a whole heap from the butcher,rmb's and all, for them thinking they would love it,and they refused to touch it raw or cooked,i tried every which way! I ended up throwing it all away,an expensive waste! I'm afraid i couldnt bring myself to eat Bambi Tongue Tied Indifferent

     

    Ratsicles i would end up with a yard full of grown chickens ,they are so cute i couldnt kill them,or any animal Sad 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Thanks for the really cool thread, Brittany!

     

    And I'll agree that it seems to be innate. I am a vegetarian, and have been for years (in fact, I've become vegan, over time). I have no moral obligation to people and animals eating meat, as long as it's done properly. I do my best to buy wild caught, grass fed, or free range meat for my dogs (though my major source recently got booted from my bubble). I would really like to raise meat for them, and I've truly, seriously contemplated it, but I don't think I could kill the animals, when the time came. I do constantly scavenge my family and friends' kills, though, when they go hunting. My dogs think venison is the *best*! They like fish scraps a lot, too. Somebody gave me a bucket of quail, last year, and Teenie ate them for weeks. She looked dang good, too. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Isn't he a long time anti large scale farming activist and former director of the Sierra club.  Sounds like the book could be a little bias to me.

    I think most things you read on an issue like this (and most other issues) are going to be at least a little biased one way or the other. For me, I've been to commercial farms, I've been to commercial slaughterhouses (my dad was a truck driver for several years and often hauled cattle, pigs, and chickens to slaughter. I went with him a few times.) and I've seen how incredibly hellish the conditions are for the animals, and the insane amount of waste these places produce and the impact it has on the environment. When you have 100,000+ animals all crapping on the same spot, it's GOING to negatively affect the environment- that's just a given and I don't see much room for debate there.

    I've read up on both sides of the issue, and I've seen these places with my own eyes. Nothing in that book deviated from what I have seen myself.

    Here is one of his quotes:


    I am an environmentalist. I care about clean air, clean water, and land stewardship. Industrial agribusiness corporations threaten all of these, and for this reason environmental and conservation organizations are supportive of diversified family farms.

    I see nothing wrong with this quote. I agree with it.

     

    Ratsicles i would end up with a yard full of grown chickens ,they are so cute i couldnt kill them,or any animal

    Haha, it was really hard the first time I did it. I raised my very first batch of laying hens in my suburban backyard, and culled all of the roosters and poor layers for meat. The first few times I had to really psych myself up for it, and I admit that I cried a good bit. I also didn't know what I was doing and botched it a couple of times which made me feel even worse. Once I got the hang of it though, and learned how to do it quickly and efficiently, it wasn't so bad.

    When I just have one or two chickens to cull, I still get a little emotional- but a big batch of meat chickens is a little different. CornishX's are specifically bred to eat alot and grow fast. They are gluttonous, eating, pooping, machines. They're filthy, smelly, fat, and lazy- they are DUMB and they really don't act like other chickens. They're lazy to the point where they will die of heat stroke in the summer time rather than get up and walk 10 feet to get a drink of water- yup, that's really happened. You have to start restricting their food at 5 days of age because they will literally eat themselves to the point of heart attack. I love pretty much all animals, heck, I have trouble killing cockroaches- but it's HARD to love meat chickens.

    They produce so much waste they they are probably the smelliest animals possible. And unless you have a heated shed for them, they have to be raised inside while they're in the brooder- these just got here yesterday, and when I woke up this morning, I could smell chickens. My house smells like chickens. It's going to smell like chickens for the next two weeks until they're big enough to move outside. I have all of the doors and windows open right now and candles burning trying to cover it up. It's not really working. I raise all of my other chicks inside too, and they NEVER smell like this- they don't have an odor, unless you get up really close, and then they actually smell kind of pleasant. These guys have permeated my house with wet chicken fart smell in less than 24 hours. It REALLY sucks.

    They produce so much waste that once they're outside their area has to be mucked out twice a day.  They get so lazy and fat that I have to take all of their food away and turn them out on some grass to force them to get up and look for food- and usually they just sit there and squack for several hours before grudgingly getting up and pecking at things. Most chickens are fit, healthy, and active. They run around and chase bugs and play. These guys don't. They crap and eat and complain when they have to walk 5 feet to find food, and then they crap some more. They also have zero personality and are kinda mean.

    SO, when it comes time to butcher a batch of meat chickens, it is SUCH a relief. By the time the 8 weeks are up, you just want them GONE. There's no "Oh this one is so sweet and such a nice guy I hate to see him go" like there is with other chickens, it's more like "Oh I remember you, you were too lazy to walk to your water and almost died of thirst, then you pecked one of the other chickens to death and ate at them because they were closer than your food dish (and they were too fat and dumb to walk away), and then you pecked me and crapped on my shirt. Yeah, you're going to be really tasty." It isn't their fault, they've been bred to be that way....but still.

    It's fun to invite a bunch of people over to help and set an entire weekend aside to do the butchering and then have a cookout when it's all over with. It's never a sad thing, with meat chickens- it's relief that the little monsters are sitting quietly in your freezer and no longer stinking things up and being problems. Stick out tongue

    I have no moral obligation to people and animals eating meat, as long as it's done properly. I do my best to buy wild caught, grass fed, or free range meat for my dogs (though my major source recently got booted from my bubble). I would really like to raise meat for them, and I've truly, seriously contemplated it, but I don't think I could kill the animals, when the time came. I do constantly scavenge my family and friends' kills, though, when they go hunting. My dogs think venison is the *best*! They like fish scraps a lot, too. Somebody gave me a bucket of quail, last year, and Teenie ate them for weeks. She looked dang good, too.

    Hey, you're only a few hours away from me- if you ever want me to raise/butcher a batch of chickens or quail or even a goat or something something for you, let me know. I've got the space and the time to do it, and I wouldn't charge you, if you just bought the animals themselves. If you're ever in need of some free range/grassfed stuff, just let me know, I'll be gladt to help any way that I can. Smile

    • Gold Top Dog

    houndlove
    I'd make a lousy farmer! 

     

    The same can be said about me....lol

    • Gold Top Dog

    This is an extremely sensitive subject for me, so I'm going to keep this really short. I absolutely applaud anyone who can raise and butcher their own meat animals humanely. I have dreams of doing it myself one day (buying a house and getting out of debt, etc, are first on the list though). I've been halfway between a vegetarian and a vegan since I was 12 and I agree that the way most meat animals are raised is.. well, there is no word for it. I'll never understand how anyone can support that. If all meat in this country was raised humanely and cost a lot more, people WOULD still pay it. And if people ate less meat because of the price, then even better. If no one supported factory farms, then they'd pretty much have to stop. If anyone wants to learn more about the whole anti-meat issue, well beyond (but including) the animal rights issue, you ought to read "The food Revolution" by John Robbins. The guy is brilliant. He said a lot of things that really hit home to me, and I'm already a vegetarian and didn't need any more convincing.... Anyhoo I'll stop now before I go off on a rant. I associate with a LOT of ignorant people so it has only made this issue much much worse for me.

    One last thing, I have actually from time to time added grass fed meat to my diet. I figure, perhaps a little lean buffalo from time to time would be good for variety, and I like getting to support companies who still believe in humanity. I hope they all somehow manage to stay in business while competing with factory farms, and so it makes me feel good buying their product. Though, when you've gone about 15 years without tasting meat, it really kind of looses its appeal. 

    • Gold Top Dog

     ROFl RatsiclesBig Smile Thanks so much for the detailed description,makes me feel much better! I can understand your feelings now as they do sound like real little beastiesTongue Tied I guess they're not so cute after 8 weeks....

    • Gold Top Dog
    Brittany, I had to LOL at your entire chicken description! :D
    • Gold Top Dog

    Ratsicles
    Hey, you're only a few hours away from me- if you ever want me to raise/butcher a batch of chickens or quail or even a goat or something something for you, let me know. I've got the space and the time to do it, and I wouldn't charge you, if you just bought the animals themselves. If you're ever in need of some free range/grassfed stuff, just let me know, I'll be gladt to help any way that I can. Smile

     

     

    I would *love* that. I'll be in Perry, in April. Anything you have around that time that you want to sell, I'll buy. If I'm near you between now and then, I'll let you know.

     

    I have friends who would likely buy meat from you, too. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    People ask how I can bear to eat my "lambs".  Just reread what Tiffany just wrote about the meat chickens, but make them 75 pounds each, with four sharp hooves and teeth, and eating pounds of grass a day.  Except my sheep are smart about finding food.  Too smart - I spend a lot of time trying to keep them in one place, instead of trying to get them to move from one spot! 

    • Gold Top Dog

    I would *love* that. I'll be in Perry, in April. Anything you have around that time that you want to sell, I'll buy. If I'm near you between now and then, I'll let you know.

     

    I have friends who would likely buy meat from you, too.

    Awesome, I'll PM you around the first of the year and we can work something out. I don't know how much freezer space you have, so I guess alot of it will depend on how much meat you want. I could get a meat goat billy for around $15-$40, and it would cost me almost nothing to feed him while he grows out next spring, but I dunno if you have the freezer space for that. I could do chickens or rabbits if that would be easier for you to store.

    But yeah, either way, I'll PM you around then and we'll talk it over. I'd really love to get a small business going raising grassfed meat. Smile 

    • Gold Top Dog

    wow that is cheap but OMG they are so cute i wouldn't be able to feed them to my dogs....i would try then end up having 55 chickens as pets....lol.Stick out tongue  hum reminds me i did always want a chicken as a pet i wonder if my dog would mind???lol

    • Gold Top Dog

    Thats it!  I'm moving to Box Springs!  LOL

    I love your descriptions Brittany.  I would love one day to raise my own meat.  My fear has been 'Chickening' out on the butchering.  If they really are that big of a PITA, meat birds I mean, then I could probably do it.  If not, do ya want a paid vacation up to Canada for a weekend cookout?