Update; Melamine Added to Boost Protein?

How would adding a chemical used to make plastics boost the protein level?

It doesn't sound as though the pet food companies even knew the origin of the wheat gluten they were using until the FDA told them.  That's why the Hills, Alpo and Del Monte recalls happened so many days after the initial Menu Foods recall.  The pet food companies bought the wheat gluten from an American supplier, not directly from China, so it seems unlikely that they would have known they were getting wheat gluten with higher protein levels.  And if the protein levels in this particular wheat gluten were signficantly higher than normal, one would think that would have raised suspicions that it might have been tampered with. 

Sounds fishy to me.  I hope it isn't true.

Melamine is a polymer.  It is insoluble except at very high temperatures.  It makes absolutely no sense that this would be used to increase protein because it simply cannot be digested.  Also, there is no source, it only states "the FDA said".  I think CNN is looking for ratings.

ORIGINAL: littlesaint

Melamine is a polymer.  It is insoluble except at very high temperatures.  It makes absolutely no sense that this would be used to increase protein because it simply cannot be digested.  Also, there is no source, it only states "the FDA said".  I think CNN is looking for ratings.

They interviewed the Vet from the FDA.

ORIGINAL: Bobsk8

ORIGINAL: littlesaint

Melamine is a polymer.  It is insoluble except at very high temperatures.  It makes absolutely no sense that this would be used to increase protein because it simply cannot be digested.  Also, there is no source, it only states "the FDA said".  I think CNN is looking for ratings.

They interviewed the Vet from the FDA.

I think on this subject they should be interviewing a chemist, not a vet.  The only possible explanation for a comment like this, is that using melamine as a fertilizer causes wheat to grow with higher levels of protein which would translate into more gluten after processing.  But that doesn't change the original story that it was used as fertilizer.  Even the fertilizer theory doesn't make much sense because it is a very poor fertilizer due to its insoluble nature, but maybe China believes therwise.

Melamine is a polymer. It is insoluble except at very high temperatures. It makes absolutely no sense that this would be used to increase protein because it simply cannot be digested. Also, there is no source, it only states "the FDA said". I think CNN is looking for ratings

  It's also used as a fertilizer so maybe there is some protein in its composition? The animals who consumed it in pet food digested it; at least it went through their system and was found in their kidneys and urine; they didn't throw it up.  Here's the transcript from CNN;   [linkhttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0704/05/acd.01.html]http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0704/05/acd.01.html[/link];

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The day would end with a provocative question: Was the pet food accidentally contaminated. Or was it deliberate? SUNDLOF: That's -- that's one of the theories that we have. In fact, that's one of the ones that we are pursuing, because, as you indicated, adding something that would increase the protein content of the wheat gluten would make

But it began with another recall, this time, an Alabama company that makes dog biscuits. It received some of the suspect wheat gluten containing a chemical known as melamine, believed toxic to dogs and cats. The FDA said recall of the products manufactured by Sunshine Mills pet food company was delayed, because Sunshine apparently got its Chinese wheat gluten from a middleman distributor that had purchased the wheat gluten from another U.S. supplier, a company called ChemNutra.

DR. STEPHEN F. SUNDLOF, DIRECTOR, FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION CENTER FOR VETERINARY MEDICINE: So, it was a little circuitous route, took us a little longer to trace that all down. But now we believe that we have accounted for all the wheat gluten that came from China, that shipment that is -- that is high in melamine, that we have accounted for all of it that has come into this country. And -- and, by the way, it all went into pet food.

JOHNS: Meaning it did not enter the human food supply chain.

How and where the melamine got into the wheat gluten is still a mystery. But the investigation took a new turn today, when the FDA told CNN it is looking whether there could have been a profit motive for deliberately introducing melamine into the wheat gluten. In other words, it might not have been an accident and may have been about money.

(on camera): That's right. Until now, the assumption has been that this was an accidental contamination, because melamine is used in plastics and pesticides, and has no business in pet food. However, the chemical could potentially be used to raise protein levels in the gluten, which could increase the price or make it easier to sell.

SUNDLOF: That's -- that's one of the theories that we have. In fact, that's one of the ones that we are pursuing, because, as you indicated, adding something that would increase the protein content of the wheat gluten would make it more valuable. So, that's -- that's a distinct possibility. But it's -- it's only one theory at this time.

Urea is commonly used in cattle feeds to increase the protein, so I don't see why some other non-protein chemical couldn't increase the protein in the wheat gluten. It would take a chemist to know if melamine would be used as nitrogen for protein though...

If it was digested, it would no longer be melamine.  It would be broken down into these supposed proteins.  Which is not possible because it is not soluble.

Urea supplies nitrogen, not protein.  Ruminants can utilize the non-protein nitrogen, but the urea itself is not a protein source.  Urea is also a soluble compound, melamine is not.  This is why melamine is a very poor fertilizer.

[linkhttp://www.agnet.org/library/pt/2001019/]http://www.agnet.org/library/pt/2001019/[/link]

ORIGINAL: Misskiwi67

Urea is commonly used in cattle feeds to increase the protein, so I don't see why some other non-protein chemical couldn't increase the protein in the wheat gluten. It would take a chemist to know if melamine would be used as nitrogen for protein though...

And, it is well known by horsemen that you NEVER allow horses to get cattle feed, because the urea makes them very sick.  What is ok for one species may not be ok for another.  The fact is, if this stuff was added for the purpose indicated, it was probably never tested before it went to market.  That tells me right there that the motive is greed.

ORIGINAL: spiritdogs

ORIGINAL: Misskiwi67

Urea is commonly used in cattle feeds to increase the protein, so I don't see why some other non-protein chemical couldn't increase the protein in the wheat gluten. It would take a chemist to know if melamine would be used as nitrogen for protein though...

And, it is well known by horsemen that you NEVER allow horses to get cattle feed, because the urea makes them very sick.  What is ok for one species may not be ok for another.  The fact is, if this stuff was added for the purpose indicated, it was probably never tested before it went to market.  That tells me right there that the motive is greed.

But was the greed from the chinese manufacturers? If so, that takes part of the blame off the US companies who thought they were purchasing a superior product. I still would prefer NOT to purchase ingredients from foreign manufacturers however. Everyone knows china puts out the worst possible quality products.

I'm guessing what they meant to say is that when they sell wheat gluten, the buyer? tests it for its concentration of protein, and melamine, being a nitrogen-containing molecule like protein, probably tests "as protein" in their test. So you dope a poor-quality batch of wheat gluten with some melamine and pass it off as a higher-quality product.

ORIGINAL: mudpuppy

I'm guessing what they meant to say is that when they sell wheat gluten, the buyer? tests it for its concentration of protein, and melamine, being a nitrogen-containing molecule like protein, probably tests "as protein" in their test. So you dope a poor-quality batch of wheat gluten with some melamine and pass it off as a higher-quality product.

If that's the case, the crime should be that a company is using testing equipment that can't distinguish between a synthesized polymer and digestable protein.  Proteins are much more complex than "nitrogen containing molecules" like urea or melamine.

we need to find a bulk wheat-gluten buyer and ask them what, if anything, they do to check the batches of wheat gluten before buying them. 

If that's the case, the crime should be that a company is using testing equipment that can't distinguish between a synthesized polymer and digestable protein.  Proteins are much more complex than "nitrogen containing molecules" like urea or melamine.

I think Mudpuppy's suggestion is plausible, although obviously highly speculative. It's true that proteins are more complex than "nitrogen containing molecules", but a commonly used test in general is to test for the presence of the amino acids that polymerize to form protein. The reagents react with the NH3 groups on the amino acids to give a measurable color change. So, IF, and this is again highly speculative, the many NH3 groups on melamime also react with the reagents used to test for protein, then adding melamine would indeed give the appearance of a higher protein content. It's fine to say that coompanies should use tests that discriminate better, but I don't know that such a test necessarily exists, or at least is inexpensive enough to use on a routine basis. IF melamine was added to artificially give the appearance of a higher protein content, the fault lies with the company that fraudulently added the melamine, not the company that used standard protocol to test for protein content.