vitamins and administration

Shelley75

There is so much liquid in the capsule and it smells bad and he doesn't like it. 

STOP right there!!  If it smells bad it is RANCID.  Don't use it, don't give him any more of it.  There are tons of other Omega 3's you can use -- in fact, I just plain give MY dogs a sardine a day (just cheap ones tinned in water or olive oil).  Too much "omega 3" can actually wind up making free radicals if the body doesn't use all of it and sardines are completely well absorbed and they love them!

Unfortunately dog vitamins are not well regulated and that's not uncommon.  I tend to give my dogs human quality stuff, but I prefer stuff that is just oil (like Sold Gold's flax oil or NOW Brand's fish oil or even salmon oil).  But mostly I just plain use fish in their diet -- and sardines are an awesome option.

And by the way -- Welcome!!!

I had no idea.  I have been looking for this particular brand online and can't find it at all.  I paid $30 for 60 capsules.  It says "sold exclusively through veterinarians."  The Eicosapentaenoic Acid (EPA) is 540 mg and the Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA) is 350 mg.  D-Alpha Tocopherol (Vitamin E) is 3 IU.  I've been searching online and have found similiar supplements with lower mg of the above.  His Efa Vites used to smell bad too.  How could they be rancid if the expiration dat isn't till July of 2012?

 Because oils, and especially fish oils, are extremely sensitive to air and light. They can be rancid before they even make it into the capsule, and often are, depending on the company.

I use Seapet 200 for my girls. It has 200 IU of vit e per teaspoon, and does NOT smell bad, at all. 

Question about the sardines.  I'm going to buy the ones in the water.  I have a 30 lb. cocker spaniel, so if I give him one sardine with one of his meals everyday, do you think that is sufficient?  I will be saving lots of money too.  Is this something I should consult my vet about?  I know Jake will love the sardines because he used to get them when I homecooked for him.  He will enjoy it much more than those smelly vitamins.  Also, are they okay to freeze?  So if I open up a can, freeze them and take them out of the freezer and put them in the frig to defrost the day I'm going to use them.  Do I heat them up in the microwave once defrosted or give cold?  Thanks!

 I would not microwave them. Why not just refrigerate them? How many sardiens are in a can? It's been a while, since I bought them. My Chinese Crested HATES fish.

 Shelley; I know your dog has many food allergies and I was wondering if that's why your vet recommended the product by Butler? Freezing the sardines and thawing them is fine; I wouldn't warm them in the microwave. One small sardine has about 178 mg of omega 3. For reference, 500 mg of wild salmon oil has about 199 mg of omega 3.

Jennie,

I don't remember how many sardines are in a can.  It's been awhile since I bought them too.

 Janice,

I used to give him Efa vites, but since they were discontinued, the vet is now using the Butler brand in place of the Efa vites.  Does Butler have to do with food allergies?  Would the sardines be just as helpful for allergies, skin and coat?

Shelley75

I don't remember how many sardines are in a can.  It's been awhile since I bought them too.

There's about 4 sardines in a can.

Shelley75

I used to give him Efa vites, but since they were discontinued, the vet is now using the Butler brand in place of the Efa vites.  Does Butler have to do with food allergies?  Would the sardines be just as helpful for allergies, skin and coat?

  What I meant was that maybe your vet recommended the Butler product because it doesn't have any ingredients that Jake is allergic to. I'm not familiar with Efa vites, or the product by Butler. Sardines are a good source of omega 3 fatty acids, which are very good for his allergies, skin and coat. If using canned sardines is more expensive than you thought, you could try a good fish oil product. Look for one that is molecularly distilled to remove contaminants, or try wild salmon oil.

Shelley75

The Eicosapentaenoic Acid (EPA) is 540 mg and the Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA) is 350 mg.  D-Alpha Tocopherol (Vitamin E) is 3 IU.

The vitamin E is just a preservative (the typical Vit E dose is 200 or 400 i.u. -- '3' is only a preservative use but it sounds wonderful to have Vit E in it).

As Jennie says -- very often these things are rancid before they leave the factory -- dog stuff just is NOT regulated and when you see that "sold by veterinarians" it sounds impressive.  But then vets tend to simply sell what their companies market to them. 

Years ago ALL dog food had fish meal in it -- because it was well known and obvious that dogs (like any mammal) needed Omega 3's.  But then about 15 years ago the shift began to the mega stores -- and grocery stores, pet stores, anywhere that sells pet food  -- they all wanted to be able to "store" food for a couple of years before it was brought out onto the store floor.  Anything with fish meal in it would go rancid way way before then.

So they stopped.putting Omega 3's IN pet food -- and so vets started recommending supplements (which was fine because it was one more thing to sell).  But the same problem of shelf life occurs.  And hence I feed human grade stuff - and even then you have to be VERY careful. 

calliecritturs

So they stopped.putting Omega 3's IN pet food -- and so vets started recommending supplements (which was fine because it was one more thing to sell).  But the same problem of shelf life occurs.  And hence I feed human grade stuff - and even then you have to be VERY careful. 

  Actually, most dog foods have some omega 3's. And, all bags are marked with "best by" dates.

  Shelly; if you don't like a strong fishy smell, you won't like the smell of the EFA vites or the Butler product. They may smell bad to you but not be rancid.

jessies_mom

most dog foods have some omega 3's. And, all bags are marked with "best by" dates.

yes they do, but most of them truly ARE on shelves for up to two years (and sometimes more) before they are marketed. 

jessies_mom

Shelly; if you don't like a strong fishy smell, you won't like the smell of the EFA vites or the Butler product. They may smell bad to you but not be rancid.

That's actually from both my regular vet and my holistic vet.  If it smells 'bad' -- don't use it.  Most fish oils, and most EFAs really don't have a powerful smell -- but when they smell obnoxious usually they are rancid -- and my holistic vet, in particular, has warned me many times not to use any product that smells foul in any way at all --

I went to the grocery store and bought 3 cans of Beach Cliff sardines in water.  There were 3 really good size sardines in each can.  I decided to give half a sardine a day.  It seemed like 1 sardine was too much.  Exactly how much is too much though.  I don't want to call my vet and ask her, she will think I'm crazy, but I just want to do what's good for my dog.

Also, they are giving Butler vitamins to everyone since that is the only brand they are now carrying, not just for highly allergic dogs.

 If you're just feeding him fish.... As long as it's not more than 10% of his daily calories in extras, you're fine. Seriously. You're not going to hurt him, and it's only going to be good for him.

Even my little girl got a sardine a day -- the bigger ones (the cocker and hound mix) more if they can get it.  One sardine is NOT a lot - in fact I probably give closer to 1 1/2 per dog per day.

Jennie's proportion is about right.  You can reduce kibble by a wee bit  if you feel the need. I home cook so this is planned into my dogs' diet.