premium/holistic foods and tummy upset?

It takes some dogs a great longer to get use to the richer food. Most people don't have the patience for the transition. I have a friend that has a Shih-Tzu on Innova and they say she either eats too much or doesn't eat all. For Godsakes, its a Shih-Tzu, they're picking eaters however they aren't consistent owners in the first place. Some dogs take several days while some go on for 2 months. Some owners start giving a raw egg or even a raw bone before the transition - smart thing to do IMHO. I never bought into some dogs only do well with lesser quality or grain food. SORRY! I just believe some dogs are so out of whack on what they are use to eating. You know like a spoiled bratty kid living on fast food and junk food in turn the parents start doing a home-cooked meal with the kid yelling for dear life protesting because it doesn't taste good. I am coming from the performance dogs owner perspective. Having been through low quality food at the start for the first 1 month straight to Innova/CN for the first 2 years and now nearly a year on raw. I will not go back to cooked food. I see the difference with a lot of performance dogs. fat is energy for dogs. carb is FAT for dogs. :) You see a lab fed on raw food is nice, lean, toned and fast! You see a kibble fed lab... well fatty pockets here and there. Yes, its a performance dog, he hunts and does agility.

I had a golden retriever that did awful on "premiumj" when i tried tochange him frm Purina.  He threw up after every meal, morning and night and I decided I was not going to kill him trying tyo get him adjusted to "bettyer food."  Life span for golden retrievers is 10 to 12 years.  Buck died of heart attack at12 yrs 3 months.  He had never been sick he nver had ear infection, he had one UTI and one hot spot in hiis life.  he had  beautiful coat, was all muscle, powerful dog.  Purina ageed with him 100% and he did great on ity.

And for the record, Honey, our adopted golden mix is on Taste of the Wild. whic is grain free. because she is 7 years old.  Sh nevrhad a problem wiPuria and no problem when i changed her. 

I woud stick with what works.  I cn not see tarvig a dog or making one ill for months so that it will eat "better food."

jdata

You know like a spoiled bratty kid living on fast food and junk food in turn the parents start doing a home-cooked meal with the kid yelling for dear life protesting because it doesn't taste good.

In my first years on this forum with Willow people had me convinced her issue was behavioral.  Well, it wasn't and now I really regret believing that it was. 

 

 I'm dealing with the same thing with my cat.  We tried a grain free and it gave him massive digestive upsets.  Back on ProPlan he's fine.

We're doing a very gradual transition to Wellness right now and it's going well.  I think part of the issue was the richnesss of the food with a lack of fiber, so I looked for higher quality diets with similar nutrient profiles to the Proplan he's successful eating.

Example:

Foods Pi can't eat:

Prairie Instinct - 50% protein minimum, 22% fat minimum, 2.8% fiber maximum, 10% moisture maximum

Blue Wilderness - 45% protein minimum, 18% fat minimum, 1.6% fiber maximum, 8% moisture maximum

Foods Pi can eat:

ProPlan Kitten -  41% protein minimum, 18% fat minimum, 3.0% fiber maximum, 12% moisture maximum

Wellness - 36% protein minimum, 18% fat minimum, 3.0% fiber maximum, 11% moisture maximum

We're at roughly 1/3 new, 2/3 old right now and I'm not seeing any of the issues I saw on the "better" foods.

 I had a very similar situation with Lex. I tried just about every premium food out there and he still constantly had diarrhea. So I decided to try Purina proplan sensitive stomach and he is doing wonderful. Firm great poops. I am happy, he is happy. That is what matters.

I do think you have to feed what works for your individual dogs.  My dogs eat Taste of the Wild and do fantastic.  Aesop, however, can't have just grain free..he had months of mudlike poo.  He eats a half and half mixture of TOTW and Solid Gold WolfCub, which leaves him with nice stool.  He likes a mix of the two..not one or the other.  He does have a bit of sensitive stomach though..can't go without breakfast or he throws up. (learned this on a few days where I forgot to give breakfast)

my cats have eated a variety of grocery store brands, including science 'death' and currently purina. My oldest is 14, with no heath issues. The others are all sping chickens either, Smokey (who's around 7) was just at the vets and got an excellent check over - no issues with him either. The only cat that has had any issues was Sammy - we had his teeth cleaned when we found him. It works for my crew - and trying to switch caused horrible problems for my old lady (allergy wise).

So - if it's not broken, don't try to fix it!

     I've always had good luck with Purina products, namely Purina ONE, yes, even Dog/Puppy Chow. OTOH, like an idiot, I will get the whim to try the fancier feeds, and end up causing serious problems with the dogs :( 
     When I got my GSD, she was painfully malnourished & just a naturally hard keeper on top of it. She was unable to even digest food, she was literally that starved and fraile in the beginning ... she was 6 mos when we got her, weighed 32lbs, had no substance to her at all. We were feeding raw back then, and I believe she actually managed to LOOSE weight in the first week or two I had her! Completely by accident, I picked up a back of Pedigree sensitive stomach, just to supplement her until I had the opportunity to pick up a "better" food. Well, lo and behold, that was the first time Kyra did not have the "stomach gurgles" or diarrhea, and she even began to pack on the pounds! She could not tolerate Canidae at all, that was probably the worst of the foods I had her on. So again, I decided to try something similar to Pedigree, but a little better, and that's when I found Purina ONE ... that was in early 2004, and it's been on my Top 5 foods ever since.
     We just went to CORE a few weeks ago, after having great results with the Wellness puppy, but the dogs went downhill so fast, it caused such serious problems ... never, ever again. I have my 3 pups back on Puppy Chow and the adults are on Science Diet, and really doing great. It's $, but they're doing better on it than even Purina. Can't remember the last time we were hunting the dogs in these temps and didn't have to worry about weight ... but they keep up weight so well on this, when most, if not almost all holistic foods have gone straight through them. Maybe too many ingredients? I dunno anymore.
     BTW, this was my Shepherd on Purina ONE - you can see what poor condition she was in, lol:

This issue is part of the reason we switched to homecooking entirely.

Our now 1.5yr Nova Scotia came to us having eaten Pedigree til he was 4mnths old...VERY sick puppy with all kinds of skin, ear infections, kennel cough, etc.

We immediately switched him to Innova Large Breed puppy food, of which he did excellent on, but we did add yogurt and a digestive enzyme for several weeks.

Only problem was if you fed him a tad more, to go along with his growing, he'd have diarreah; and his ears were slightly itchy.

So we switched to Orijen, again he did great, but we made sure he got yogurt almost daily along with a digestive enzyme.

Eventually we phased out the enzyme, of which he continued doing good until we slowly started increasing his food portions, he WAS growing after all and acting like he wasn't getting enough to eat, he too lost a pound or two.

At that point, with the rising cost of premium foods and scare of recalls in the past years, we just flat decided to give it all up and homecook their meals.

Dogs are doing GREAT, best decision we've ever made.

Our dog started on Pro Plan Selects Turkey and Barley puppy food.  HE did fine the first year but when it came time to transition to adult in the same food we have major problems with vomitting.  So I tried Blue and Fromm and well it didn't work and he was so sick and I then tried the Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach.  No corn or wheat was totally necessary because he is an irish setter and I was told to avoid those and glutens.  He has done very well for a year now.  I was sort of considering trying Wellness core this week and am getting worried I will upset the apple cart.  My husband feels he is just too skinny and thinks it he needs a different food.  He is active, crazy active with no stomach problems and a great coat.  Not sure if I should risk a change at this point.  The vet wanted me to consider a protein change or even prescription food because he just had two ear infections.  I explained to her it was because we have been out in rain and snow and I wasn't on top of drying out his ears but she thought I should consider it might be allergy related.  My dog takes a bath or swims and within a week he is fungal again in those ears.  So anyway she made my crazy mind start churning and I was about to go tomorrow to by the Wellness and now that I read this thread I think I will leave things alone.  I give him scrambled eggs, hamburger and rice with is food a couple times a week, that seems good enough for me!  If I switch to a novel protein source now, what will I have to go to should allergies really kick in later on?  And he totally loves his food.  He is a fish loving dog.

well, the store was out of the other food I was feeding, so I decided to transition Misty over to this: http://www.proplan.com/products/NaturalSalmonBrownRice_DryDog.html  which I think is better than the P1, and she is doing just FINE on it.  In fact, I think she's doing better on it, in that her coat seems to have more sheen again where it had gotten a tiny bit dull.  I thought about trying something else, but I think I'm going to stick with this.  I may try the chicken formula later and see how that goes...or I may just buy some boneless chicken thighs and supplement her diet with those and some cooked green beans and carrots, and maybe some yogurt.

I tried a bag of proplan salmon adult with my guys last summer and the COATS were outstanding! Poops were firm (even my chronic mud-pooper minpin, GObie). I switched off it because I was afraid I'd "harm" my dogs, given with the "purina is crap" mantra in the dogworld. My guys do really well on PetGuard Lifespan, which is a holisitic food, but not a zillion ingredients. I'm transitioning to TOTW pacific (salmon) at the moment to see how they do but I'm considering trying proplan again, just to see...

shamrockmommy

I tried a bag of proplan salmon adult with my guys last summer and the COATS were outstanding! Poops were firm (even my chronic mud-pooper minpin, GObie). I switched off it because I was afraid I'd "harm" my dogs, given with the "purina is crap" mantra in the dogworld. My guys do really well on PetGuard Lifespan, which is a holisitic food, but not a zillion ingredients. I'm transitioning to TOTW pacific (salmon) at the moment to see how they do but I'm considering trying proplan again, just to see...

The salmon and rice formula is the only one pro plan makes that uses meat instead of corn gluten and is a good formula, and now all that other shredded soy garbage is in the other formulas.  I've considered adding it to the rotation but it's so expensive!

losinsusan

Our dog started on Pro Plan Selects Turkey and Barley puppy food.  HE did fine the first year but when it came time to transition to adult in the same food we have major problems with vomitting.  So I tried Blue and Fromm and well it didn't work and he was so sick and I then tried the Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach.  No corn or wheat was totally necessary because he is an irish setter and I was told to avoid those and glutens.  He has done very well for a year now.  I was sort of considering trying Wellness core this week and am getting worried I will upset the apple cart.  My husband feels he is just too skinny and thinks it he needs a different food.  He is active, crazy active with no stomach problems and a great coat.  Not sure if I should risk a change at this point.  The vet wanted me to consider a protein change or even prescription food because he just had two ear infections.  I explained to her it was because we have been out in rain and snow and I wasn't on top of drying out his ears but she thought I should consider it might be allergy related.  My dog takes a bath or swims and within a week he is fungal again in those ears.  So anyway she made my crazy mind start churning and I was about to go tomorrow to by the Wellness and now that I read this thread I think I will leave things alone.  I give him scrambled eggs, hamburger and rice with is food a couple times a week, that seems good enough for me!  If I switch to a novel protein source now, what will I have to go to should allergies really kick in later on?  And he totally loves his food.  He is a fish loving dog.

I just wrote a huge post and my computer messed up! So here is the short version:

The foods that you've fed (other than Pro Plan Sensitive Skin & Stomach) have had a lot of varied ingredients. Maybe he just has a sensitive digestive system. The "animal" digest and menadione bisulfite complex in Pro Plan would definitely deter me from feeding it. And if your vet thinks the ear infections may be allergy related, then I would definitely do a limited ingredient food trial. That should be good for a sensitive system and testing for allergies. I would try a food like California Natural, Wellness Simple Solutions or Natural Balance (one of their allergy formulas). CA Natural and Natural Balance both have a fish formula.

I would also not feed a food with brewer's yeast to a dog prone to ear infections. It isn't proven, but I've seen a direct correlation between that ingredient and ear infections/yeasty skin issues with several dogs. Brewer's yeast is also grown on grains, so if it's a grain allergy then that could cause problems. I think it would be worth trying a food that doesn't have that ingredient. 

The ear infections could definitely be from the frequent swimming and ears not drying out, but there could be other contributing factors like food. 

As far as introducing a novel ingredient now and having a tough time finding that later, that shouldn't be a problem at all. There are lots of novel proteins these days including duck, venison and kangaroo.

 A little info on brewer's yeast:

http://www.pinnaclepetsupply.com/allergies.html

 

Luvntzus

I would also not feed a food with brewer's yeast to a dog prone to ear infections. It isn't proven, but I've seen a direct correlation between that ingredient and ear infections/yeasty skin issues with several dogs. Brewer's yeast is also grown on grains, so if it's a grain allergy then that could cause problems. I think it would be worth trying a food that doesn't have that ingredient. 

 

  The yeast involved in skin and ear infections is Malassezia. Any ingredient in food that a dog is allergic to can cause a yeast overgrowth, and thus skin and ear infections. 

Luvntzus

The vet wanted me to consider a protein change or even prescription food because he just had two ear infections.  I explained to her it was because we have been out in rain and snow and I wasn't on top of drying out his ears but she thought I should consider it might be allergy related. My dog takes a bath or swims and within a week he is fungal again in those ears.  So anyway she made my crazy mind start churning and I was about to go tomorrow to by the Wellness and now that I read this thread I think I will leave things alone. 

  I think you're okay for now; I used to have the same problem with Jessie and learned to use a good ear cleaner after she'd been in water. If you stay on top of cleaning his ears and he still has problems, then you may want to try an allergy diet. Good luck.