Dog Community

rotating food-thought I finally picked one????

Posted : 5/14/2006 5:41:00 PM

I now feed Innova but was going to switch them to NV, everything looked really good to me. They have dry, raw and canned in several different protein sources. So lots of variety. Then I read..........................

That the chicken fat being #3(NV raw instict) on the ingredient label is bad for dogs that could have a problem with bloat. I have 4 dogs 3 over 65+lbs mixed with either lab, gsd, or terrior .I checked chicken fat in:

canidae # 6
innova #9
artemis #9
NV prarie chicken & beef #5
NB - ultra #8

so where should it be?

and one question a little off topic I see alot of people talk about and use a fish base food, is that something I should rotate with also. My dogs so far don't seem to have any allergies, except my one licks and bites his feet but i think it seasonal, he just started in spring.

kennel_keeper

Posted : 5/14/2006 6:06:48 PM

That sounds like some of Solid Golds propoganda. I have never heard (from any legit source) that chicken fat causes bloat.
FWIW, when goats or deer bloat, we use any liquid fat we can get our hands on quickly. The fat settles the fermentation process in the rumen. Mineral oil is a good one, but I have used vegetable oil, canola oil, olive oil, etc.

It could could have some truth to it, but it doesn't sound like a very reliable theory.

papillon806

Posted : 5/14/2006 6:11:18 PM

I too have never seen any studies or anything that related the placement of chicken fat in dog food to cause bloat.

I also don't see how it could cause bloat to occur based on my own knowledge.

Edie

Posted : 5/14/2006 9:06:53 PM

So your discounting all those good foods because of chicken fat? I dont think you will find that there is a perfect food out there....

sooner

Posted : 5/14/2006 9:10:26 PM

http://www.aahanet.org/About_aaha/About_News_JAAHABloat0106.html

An additional finding of the study was the discovery that dry foods that list fats or oils among the predominant ingredients can trigger a higher incidence of GDV in high-risk dogs. Foods containing an oil or fat ingredient, such as sunflower oil or animal fat, among the first four ingredients were associated with a 2.4-fold increased risk of GDV.

3guysandagirl

Posted : 5/15/2006 11:51:22 AM

Thanks Sooner, you're one smart pup[sm=clapping%20hands%20smiley.gif] you always seem to have a great answer. I was starting to think I way misunderstood what I read.

So I guess I should then stay away from foods that have any type of fat listed 4 and above.

Also I see alot of people talk about and use a fish base food, is that something I should rotate with also. My dogs so far don't seem to have any allergies, except my one licks and bites his feet but i think it seasonal, he just started in spring.

sooner

Posted : 5/15/2006 7:08:52 PM

[sm=blush.gif] Thanks. Google is my friend.

You can try fish-based if you want to. I don't think there's any specfic reason for feeding it, except for dogs that have allergies or something. I think I've read that some breeds (border collies maybe) do really well on fish-based food.

Personally I've been looking for a good locally available fish-based food becaused the food that got my dogs the most excited was fish based, but I had to order it, and they didn't do exceptionally well on it, and I've chosen not to buy from that company anymore. But I've yet to find another formula that gets them as excited.

Margaret Tyler

Posted : 5/15/2006 8:04:16 PM

[align=left]I have heard about chicken fat causing bloat. Merrick dog food also claims that chicken fat may cause bloat and other stomach problems, but only if you switch from a food that uses chicken fat as their main fat source to a food that uses another fat source. Merrick philosophy is variety, so all of their foods use conola oil as the main fat source, so you can easily switch between their formulas. By the way meat and not meal it Merrick's main protein source.
[align=left]

loveukaykay

Posted : 5/15/2006 11:56:30 PM

I think alternating the fish in is a good idea.. its good for us, and them too. Its a good way to give them a different kind of protien.

sooner

Posted : 5/16/2006 9:01:02 AM

ORIGINAL: jojo the pogo

By the way meat and not meal it Merrick's main protein source.

I just want to mention that this is not a good thing. After looking at Merrick's dry formulas I see that they are generally comprised of meat, grain, grain, meal. Those ingredients are listed by weight, so when the ~70% water cooks out of that meat, there ends up being less meat than grain. Meal is meat that is dehydrated prior to the cooking process, so little or none is lost in the finished product. You always want to see meal listed before the grains. The Merrick Puppy Plate is the only dry formula that seems to have enough meat, but honestly, I wouldn't buy anything from them with their reputation for lack of quality control.

mudpuppy

Posted : 5/16/2006 9:07:12 AM

I'm not sure how one can draw any conclusions about the placement of fat in the ingredient list. Take food A: they decide to use several different protein sources, so they list chicken, turkey, chicken meal, turkey meal, rice, chicken fat. Fat is ingredient #6. Take food B: exact same amount of meat and fat, but only chicken meal is used. List: chicken meal, rice, chicken fat. How can one of these formulas be risky as to bloat and the other not?

Jennifer

Posted : 5/16/2006 10:23:20 AM

I think it's important to note that the study specifically references high risk dogs. And I would go so far as to say that even some breeds that may be on the 'bloat list' are not even necessarily ALL high risk.

Pyrs make that list, however the number of incidences in relation to our breed numbers is actually pretty low. I would not consider my dogs to be high risk. Possible risk, yes - high risk, no.

3guysandagirl

Posted : 5/16/2006 4:24:36 PM

How about these foods to rotate with?

I use Innova now, but want to rotate with Artemis, Canidae and maybe a fish base food, (don't know who though)

These food have pretty much the same proteins and ingredients.
Does that matter?
And, are my dogs going to get any benefits by rotating these food?

sooner

Posted : 5/17/2006 1:50:30 PM

I think having the same proteins and ingredients will minimize digestive disturbances when switching. And for the same reason I try to stick to a similar guaranteed analysis. I believe dogs benefit from rotating just because of the different kibble formulas, where one might be lacking another might make up for.

That and I know I wouldn't want to eat the same thing every day for years.

sandra_slayton

Posted : 5/17/2006 2:39:16 PM

Altho there are some breeds more prone to bloat, any dog can get it. AND a study done in Florida, I think it was, at one of the universities came to the conclusion that the tendency for bloat can be passed down. One one of the health boards I belong to, one who breeds St. Benards lost 3 out of one family to bloat--the grandfather, the father and one son. She totally believes the tendency can be passed down now that she lost a 3rd generation to it.

I have no idea if certain fats can bring it on or not, I had never read that before. But just a word, if you know there has been bloat in your dog's family, be careful and pay attention to any kind of warning.