My pup is pickiest eater ever.....HELP!

ORIGINAL: abbysdad

Personally, I don't think, the value of the ingredients list is the end all be all of determining the quality of a dog food. First of all you can not determine the quality of the ingredients from an ingredients list, there are many different grades of meals, and of by-products, so company A may be using very good by-products and company B may use a very poor quality meal. 

Would someone please explain to me what these "good by-products" are?
 
No, it's not the be all and end all but the ingredient list + educating yourself about what the ingredients are and who the manufacturer is + knowing where to look for recommendations for quality foods will make it pretty easy to determine whether or not you're feeding a quality kibble or not.

According to Bil Jack, their "by products" are internal organs only. It says it right on their packaging.

Fresh Chicken By-Products (Organ Meat Only), Fresh Chicken, Corn, Chicken By-Product Meal, Dried Beet Pulp (sugar removed), Fresh Chicken Liver, Brewers Dried Yeast, Cane Molasses, Eggs, Salt, Sodium Propionate (a preservative), DL-Methionine, L-Lysine, Vitamin A Acetate, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, Niacin, Biotin, Choline Chloride, Folic Acid, Thiamine Mononitrate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Menaione, sodium Bisulfate Complex, (source of Vitamin K), D-Calcium Pantothenate, Manganous Oxide, Inositol, BHA (a preservative), Iron Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Cobalt Carbonate, Potassium Iodine, Sodium Selenite.

What I don't like about Bil Jac's ingredients is the Molasses (sugar) and Salt.

Would someone please explain to me what these "good by-products" are?

 
From Biljac:
 
Q: What are "chicken by-products?"
A: We cannot speak for other manufacturers, but no one controls its ingredient sources as closely as Bil-Jac. We use only fresh organ meat, which is naturally nutritious (see the ingredients list on our bags). Wild carnivores eat the organ meat first because their instincts tell them it is the most nutritious source of protein. It is no different for your domesticated dog. At Bil-Jac we've studied nutrition for more than 50 years, and we carefully blend our ingredients for optimal nutrition. Bil-Jac chicken by-products do not contain heads, feet or feathers-only nutritious organ meat.
 
 
From Petcenter:
 By-Product... Secondary products produced in addition to the principal products.  Well, there is nothing here to indicate good or bad quality of product.  Maybe we should look at what the principal product is to find out what the secondary products are; then we can decide if the secondary products would make good food for meat-eating dogs and cats.
If Meat is the primary product (meat refers to the skeletal muscles of the slaughtered mammal) then ...
Meat By-Products - the non rendered (uncooked), clean parts, other than meat, derived from slaughtered mammals. It includes, but is not limited to, lungs, spleen, kidneys, brain, livers, blood, bone, partially defatted low-temperature fatty tissue and stomachs and intestines freed of their contents. It does not include hair, horns, teeth and hooves. 
 "Petfood for Boneheads"
 


POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL VS. CHICKEN MEAL
Poultry by-product meal VS. Chicken meal, what's the difference?
 
POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL contains such clean parts as feet, undeveloped eggs, and intestines, where CHICKEN MEAL doesn't contain such parts.
 
There are petfood makers that use POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL, and there are makers that use CHICKEN MEAL. Make no mistake about it this is a marketing battle, truly a "What's in a Name?" game. The CHICKEN MEAL guys have done a "good" job of bashing the use of POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL, creating the stigma - POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL is bad stuff. Such a good job that the POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL guys have tried to use the more consumer friendly "poultry protein meal". Regulators , rightly so, rejected this name switch.
 
BONEHEAD advocates the consumer's right-to-know, changing from by-product to protein is a misguided attempt to mislead the public. It is also BONEHEAD's objective to provide a clear understanding of petfood. The CHICKEN MEAL guys bashing of POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL is just marketing. POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL is an excellent petfood ingredient. Since chickens are not raised to make petfood, it's highly likely that the demand outstrips the supply, resulting in poor quality or adulterated chicken meal.
 
The bottomline BONEHEAD students is;

• Don't relinquish your right-to-know;
• Petfoods using POULTRY BY-PRODUCT MEAL are as good if not better, nutritional and economically, than CHICKEN MEAL products;
• Make informed decisions.

Why is it good that the first ingredient in Bil-Jac is organ meat?  When feeding a raw diet, organ meat should be about 10% of the total diet so I guess I just don't get why a kibble with organ meat as the first ingredient would be a good thing.

Oh, Remillard. She's a hot topic just by herself.
 
I think with by-products one problem is when a label says "by-products" you have no real way of knowing what the nutritional value is for that batch. Did it end up being mostly bone? Mostly lung? Mostly liver? Mostly fat? All are not equal nutritionally speaking. And I don't think any of them should be ingredient #1.

I think with by-products one problem is when a label says "by-products" you have no real way of knowing what the nutritional value is for that batch

 
That is exactly the point of not being able to tell the quality of the food simply by looking at the ingredient list, there are different qualities levels of chicken meal, lamb meal, chicken by-product meal, beef meal etc. For instance most of  TWO's meals are made from what we would call by-products, yet they are always considered to have one of the best ingredients lists, why is that? Also, in my opinion it there beef meal should be called a beef by-product meal, wouldn't you agree, again just a name game.
 
Here is the description of  TWO's beef meal.
 
Beef Meal Our only formula that contains beef meal is the Prey Drive. We have designed the Prey Drive formula to closely approximate a varied diet that a wolf might partake of in the wild, without regard to some consumer's perceptions of certain ingredients. Our beef meal is made from not only the muscle tisue, but also meaty bones, spleens, kidneys, lungs, heart and other organs. It is made from cattle slaughtered for human consumption.
 
 
 

It is made from cattle slaughtered for human consumption.

The answer may be in the last line.....I think there's a big difference in meat fit for pet food,and meat fit for human consumption. I'de bet pedigree etc dont use ingredients fit for human consumption??