Vomiting, hasn't eaten in 36 hours, Doxepin od?....

You dont know how I wish I would have known some things before my angel died instead of now.  I dont blame myself or feel quilty I just HATE HATE HATE that I didnt know and wasnt able to help out in more ways because of it.  Every new thing I learn I say man I wish I would have known that for Kayla whether it applies to helping her live longer of just better food, treats and toys.  I am lucky to get many signs from her and know shes okay and is still with me.  I have yet to type them, I think until about a week ago all I could do was talk about her and now its hard, I just cant and dont want to because it wears me out, I am physically tired and in pain because of it all and just need a break I guess.... just another phase I suppose...
 
I will be checking here a lot to see whats going on hope she comes back to update

Hi TKO,,wondering how your dog is doing today.

First off, just wanted to say how sorry I am about your loss loveukaykay. Sounds like Kayla was a great dog and that you're a great owner. I lost a dog myself almost one year to the day and although you never forget it does get easier to deal with over time.
 
Just a quick little update - Hap is back home. Still not allowed to eat or drink and has to go back for antibiotics and fluids at least twice more in the next 24 hours but the prognosis is good. I was trying to think of things that may have caused this and it just hit me that I started feeding her Innova Evo about a week ago to compliment her raw diet (she's been eating raw for about 4 months now). I wonder if that did it? Innova Evo is supposed to be high in fat and I've seen some anecdotal reports on the web reporting similar stories about this causing pancreatitis. My vet seems to be more suspicious of the raw diet, but I'm going to ask another vet for their opinion tonight.
 
 

I'm glad Hap is back home,,,its better for him to be where he is loved and taken care of.   Please keep us updated!
I guess you will just have to talk to a vet about that diet... maybe the food is NOT good for all dogs, maybe raw is not either...but just getting him better is the first step, then you can see what you can do about KEEPING him better.

Loveukaykay - I just found the link today and realize what had happen to you and your precious kayla.  Sorry about what happened.  I got all tear up and I didn't even know about Pancreatitis and how deadly it is.  []

Usually when a diet goes high in protein it uses fat as an energy source as opposed to grain.
 
The diet my vet gave me for Pris (and this was like 30 years ago -- LONG before 'home cooking' was cool) literally was cooked hamburger and rice with an egg thrown in when I turned the heat off.  Probably 18-20% protein and that's all.  On top of that I used a powdered enzyme (very much like Prozyme is now) that pre-digested her food for her. 
 
The tendency is that when one organ, like the pancreas, gets riled up, other organs that are in complimentary systems can too.  The pancreas and kidneys are closely related -- and you may honestly have to baby that pancreas a great deal --I can promise you that you may need to change the diet enormously.
 
In total honesty, my best suggestion would be to contact Doggie Dietician.  (a/k/a Monica Segal).  Monica's rates are pretty modest and she will support you for several months -- but she will literally write a diet specifically FOR your dog.  She's not going to beat you up over raw vs. cooked -- she honestly encourages BOTH for different clients. 
 
But I can promise you, with pancreatitis, it is far far better to err on the side of caution and be incredibly kind to the pancreas.  I know my Prissy would literally sicken on ONE piece of nutmeat.  The dog LOVED pecans and would try to steal one any chance she got if I was baking.  Just one would make her deathly ill. 
 
You may not want to go back to regular kibble -- in honesty, I'm not sure raw will be well tolerated simply because I'm not sure her digestive tract can handle it.  Nor may her kidneys be able to tolerate high doses of protein. 
 
See the pancreas manufactures insulin -- and remember insulin is that critical factor in diabetes ... so this is all tied very closely to the kidneys.  Then the heart depends on the kidneys to filter it's blood.  (oh boy, my background in Chinese medicine is rearing it's head). 
 
But you have to find a balance where the pancreas can stay UN-inflamed.  So a diet that is ultra-easy to digest may be paramount right now. 
 
I'm sure the vet wants a bland veterinary diet.  But given how careful you have been in the past trying to feed the 'best' you might find Monica can give you a rational but high-quality alternative.  She WILL work with your vet if need be.  She's good at that, in fact.
 
As my Prissy aged, she had a total of 3 near-death bouts with pancreatitis.  One when she was 3, one when she was about 6 and living with my parents while I was back in college (and I've always suspected a pecan likely was involved -- Mom is a great baker), and then another when she was about 10. 
 
But I know one of the hot buttons with Pris was that I had to keep her protein levels down.  At one time I tried a (for that time) high quality kibble that was known to be higher in protein.  I honestly thot I was being good to her.  Bless her heart -- she developed a horrific UTI and major crystals.  I went back to home cooking and keeping the protein low and she was fine.  As I said she lived to be nearly 21! 
 
I'm positive you are going to hate feeding her grain ... but I'm only suggesting it may be the easiest thing.  I honestly don't know how digestible the pancreas finds many vegetables -- back when I did Pris's cooking I honeslty just didn't KNOW about that.  But I know she thrived in a superior way on just burger, rice and egg.  To me now that sounds most un-balanced, but it's amazing how the body will compensate when it has to.
 
But I do know Monica can help you.  She's been a friend of mine for almost 10 years.  She's just plain REALLY good at what she does and she'll know specifically what the pancreas will and won't tolerate.
 
http://www.monicasegal.com

tko; I'm glad that your vet found out what Hap's problem is and that she is on medication. She may not be able to handle the raw diet anymore; do you know about Monica Segal and her website;
                                
                      [linkhttp://www.monicasegal.com/]http://www.monicasegal.com/[/link]
 
 She is an animal nutritionist and would design a diet for Hap if you contact her; she'll work with your vet , too. Please keep us posted about Hap; I hope she recovers and has many more good years.
 
  

Thanks guys...  I did learn that once they get this it is VERY likely they will get it again, so major changes are needed. 

I would like to add in case you didnt read all the way through that my Kayla died of a hemmorage or blood clot... they think that all of the inflammation caused a blood clot or something...?  The person who did her necropsy was a family friend and all he could really do was give a best guess (I didnt want to send her to the university).  He said her pancreas was like red roses and it should have been a light tan color... although it just about KILLED me to hear that my angel bled to death he quickly assured me that something like that happens so fast she never would have felt a thing (all I can hope is he wasnt just saying that to comfort me)... but I dont think she did because she was acting totally happy and fine (aside from shivering).

Just to give you a warning, she was shaking like a leaf that night and had really cold paws, I called the vet and the evet and they both said this is normal for what she was dealing with.  Well you can imagine my mind frame when she later didnt make it through the night.... but after all of my hysteria the thing that really gets me is that a blood clot or hemmorage is totally unpredictable... there wasnt a THING I could have done about it... and also once it happens you cant stop it, so had I somehow known (which wasnt possible) and rushed her in they still wouldnt have been able to help her at that point... so I am so very thankful that she was with me.  I somehow feel like she knew and waited until we were all asleep, because we went to bed very late and I spent a long time loving on her that night before falling asleep and it wasnt 30 minutes after I finally did that this happened.  But me and her were so close, we knew each other through and through and were completely connected on another level so I wouldnt put anything past her.

I would do whatever you need to to make sure this does not happen again or to make it as least likely to happen as possible.  

Thanks for the responses concerning the diet as that is my main concern right now. Although I do believe in a raw diet, I am certainly not a zealot about it, and realize it is not right for every dog which may include Hap at this moment. I have been told to give a bland diet so I have been feeding cooked lean ground beef (with as much fat drained as possible) along with brown rice. I also have had to stick some of her pills in skinless chicken. I just got a shipment of raw ground beef (complete with bones and organ meat) that I'll cook and drain just as I have with the ground beef I bought at the supermarket. I have thought about consulting a holistic vet for diet advice, but perhaps I'll try out Monica Segal's plans. I did notice at her site that it takes up to two months to formulate a diet plan though and I'm worried that that might be too long to wait.
 
fyi, Hap is looking almost completely like her old self already. Still sleeps a lot but her attitude has been back to her old happy, perky self!

You can also rinse the cooked meat under water to get even more of the fat off... good luck and glad to hear she is looking better!

It sounds like Hap is on his way to being healthy!  GREAT NEWS!!!

I'm glad that Hap is feeling better; there is another website you can try for a diet;
 
         [linkhttp://www.petdiets.com/]http://www.petdiets.com/[/link]
 
 They have certified veterinary nutritionists and will design diets for pets with medical conditions. You may not be able to feed Hap a raw diet again but homecooking is still fresher than kibble and canned food. I feed Jessie a very good holistic kibble and she does great on it but I supplement it daily with some home cooked food; I cook her meat to about medium rare. It has been proven in studies that humans digest cooked egg better than raw; I can't find scientific studies concerning dogs and raw or cooked food but it may be that cooking their food is better for them too. I recently learned that the belief that their stomach acid is stronger than ours is not true; it is actually the same ph as ours. I'm telling you this so you won't worry too much if Hap can't have raw again; keep us posted about how she does; by the way, do you have any pics of her? We'd love to see some. []

callie, what ratio of hamburger to rice did you use? I'm using about 50-50 although Hap tries to eat around the rice as much as she can.
 
loveukaykay, thanks for the tip about the water. I have started doing this.
 
jessiesmom, I have checked out petdiets.com in the past and I have to admit I am bothered that they are so anti-raw. While I am totally open to not feeding raw (as I have been doing for the last few days) I do believe it is ok for most dogs just as certain kibble and home made diets are ok as well. I think the problem with nutrition in general, and animals specifically, is that there is so much conflicting info out there about what's right and what's not. I've been meaning to go to a holistic vet for awhile since traditional vets (and this includes a dermatologist that I just started seeing) havent been able to help Hap at all with her allergies, so I figure now is a good time to go to get some diet help as well.
 
And by request here's a few pics of my girl:
 
 
 
 
 
 

I love her sweet face!

Thanks dyan, Happy says woof!