UTI or Diabetes???

    • Gold Top Dog

    UTI or Diabetes???

    My 6 year old Lhasa Apsa started drinking a lot of water and piddling all over the house about 2 weeks ago - I could not get a urine sample at the time but my vet did start her on antibiotics and after 1 week on them all seemed good.  I finally got a urine sample to follow up on this last Friday and the asst. vet said she still saw a little blood in it and wanted to keep her on them for 10 more days.  She also said she saw a little sugar in her urine and started talking to me about her having DIABETES!  This came out of nowhere!!  She said she could have this because she was drinking and piddling - I told her that had stopped with the medicine and we thought it was a UTI!
     
    I have to go in with another urine sample after the meds are done and this time I want my REGULAR VET to read this! 
     
    Could this just be an awful mistake?  Just because there is a small amout of sugar in the urine that automatically mean Diabetes?  I am very upset - and why would the symptoms just stop when on the meds - my husband has Diabetes and was told medicine will help lower his blood sugar, not heal him.  Surely the antibiotics would not make the symptoms of Diabetes just go away ????
     
    Thanks for any help anyone can give - I was in tears last night because a UTI is one thing and Diabetes, from what I read, is very very serious.
     
    Sherry
    • Gold Top Dog
    don't panic -- a UTI can be serious as well.  Diabetes, yes, is serious but it can be a fully managed condition and the dog can have a VERY long life. 
     
    (Seriously -- my best friend's dog wound up with diabetes years ago -- she had allergies and back then the customary procedure to treat them was pred and they didn't know back then how seriously bad it could be.  W/in 2 years the dog had diabetes but they put Mandy on insulin and altho she did go blind by the time she was 6 (4 years later) she lived to be 17 1/2, almost 18!!!!  Her diabetes managed fully for her whole life by regulating the insulin.  Yep, she got shots every day and would RUN to get them! 
     
    I'm not going to give you a pat answer because so much with kidney values only has meaning when compared to something else.  Could it have been mis-interpreted?  You bet.  If you have to pick a kidney problem, diabetes is WAY better than renal failure or albumin in the urine.  I wouldn't worry yet. 
     
    My Billy has had 'some' glucose in his urine but compared to other things it's not a problem.  So don't dive off the deep end yet ok?
     
    And you might suggest to the vet that they do a sterile urine draw and a culture and sensitivity the next time -- far more reliable results (either they have to put a catheter in or they have to aspirate urine from the kidney by needle BUT it elminates tainted results and in this case it might be wise).  Good luck.
    • Gold Top Dog
    I finally got a urine sample to follow up on this last Friday and the asst. vet said she still saw a little blood in it and wanted to keep her on them for 10 more days. She also said she saw a little sugar in her urine and started talking to me about her having DIABETES!

     
    It's really hard to interpret a UA result in the face of significant infection.  Given the fact that there is blood, unfortunately your little one may have a worse then normal UTI (maybe cystitis or pylonephritis) both of which give you some blood in the urine.  You also can have some glucose in the urine with Pylonephritis so it's a good idea to wait and see what the next UA shows as callie alluded to. 
     
    Usually in medicine if you can find ONE diagnosis to explain everything, that's the right one :)  (occam's razor is what this theory is technically called )
     
    • Gold Top Dog
    Thank you for both your comments - maybe I was too panicked when the "D" word was mentioned!  She has been back on the antibiotics since Sat am and seems just fine - does not drink too much water and can go hours without going outside.  If it is that more serious UTI will  antibiotics clear this up?  I guess I will have to wait for the next urine analysis to ease my mind...she is such a sweetie and my lap dog...maybe I overreacted  Thanks again...
    Sherry
    • Gold Top Dog
    All uti's are not the same -- they can be caused by many different types of bacteria and protozoa -- and some of those require different antibiotics. 
     
    my Billy has had repeated uti's over the past 6 months because of a drug he's on for IMHA -- one of the 'side effects' of this drug is increased risk/tendency for uti's.  We've had a MISERABLE time.
     
    Add to that the fact that when a dog is on steroids a regular "caught" urine draw just plain doesn't read properly -- so ... he's had to have a NUMBER of 'sterile urine draws'.  Because they always have to culture them, see what 'grows' and then what drugs will kill them.
     
    The first one was really common stuff -- but it didn't 'die' when we gave the antibiotics.  They went to a stronger one ... and then a bigger dose OF the stronger one .... weeks passed and he's STILL only 'maintaining' on the drug -- the infection is 'there' but not getting better.  *sigh*  (read that a VERY BIG HUGE FRUSTRATED MOM SIGH)
     
    they had to give him CIPRO (big guns huge antibiotic) finally to kill it, but by the time 3 months had passed it wasn't just the two original bacteria/protozoa -- he had pseudomonas infection TOO (big nasty awful bacteria).
     
    Billy has IMHA -- that means you have to be ultra careful what antibiotic is used, how much of it, how fast you throw it at the body, etc.  Let's just say I've got WAY more experience with UTI's now than I ever wanted to have.
     
    What your dog has can be complicated by what 'bacteria' it is causing it -- that may require a change in antibiotics.  Often vets will not ask you to pay for the sterile urine draw/culture and sensitivity test -- they'll just switch antibiotics.
     
    I'd ask for the culture if I were you -- it will lessen your worry.  Read up on the drugs -- find out what the side effects are -- those are your own best weapons!
    • Gold Top Dog
    [Reply to Message] All Forums >> [Dog.com Forum] >> Health >> Illness, Disease or Condition >> UTI or Diabetes??? Page: [1]
    What medicine was the dog on before drinking lots of water???

    I'm so confused. I had a urinalysis done on my dog, and she drank so much water that it was too diluted to test, and was no good, and no help! Haha.

    Excessive urination and water drinking, and eating signals Diabetes. Especially if there is sugar in the urine??

    What do you feed the dog??
    • Gold Top Dog
    Wait and see what the next UA shows.  I would request that the urine for the next UA is done as a sterile collection, therefore not tainted by outside factors.  If after this UA, if there is still sugar in the urine, a complete blood workup needs to be done. (CBC, Chemistry Panel, Urinalysis, Dexamethasone Supression testing, Thyroid panel)  These tests can be split if needed, do the CBC, Chem panel, UA first, if there are elevated glucose levels then go ahead and do the Dex Supression, and thyroid panel. 
    • Bronze
    My female great dane/husky mix was constantly getting UTIs. We'd do a round of antibiotics, she'd be better for about a month, and then the phantom peeing would begin again. The Vet finally let us know that as a big dog (111 lbs.) she was spayed too early and her private parts did not have enough time to develop. All that to say... she said if my "little girl" continued to have UTIs, we'd have to do surgery. Well... I stopped at a Natural Pet Food store that also sells homeopathic treatments and I put my dog on a regimine of two UT Strength pills a day (made by VetriScience, I think). I don't have the bottle in front of me, but I know it includes marshmallow root and other stuff. It has been wonderful!! No UTIs in over a year!
     
     

    • Gold Top Dog
    Thank you all for your kind words of support and advice!  I think I may try some of those pills by Vetri Science...
     
    The vet ran another blood workup and it came back negative for Diabetes - he said sometimes sugar can escape in the urine from stress - especially from a UTI.  He said to continue her on the antibiotics for the next 8 days and it should clear up.  I am so glad he ruled out Diabetes!
    However, she piddled all over my hall today (thank goodness I had thick blankets down) so I will be glad when this is all over.
     
    Thanx for the advice on thoses pills - I will look into it.
     
    Sherry
    • Gold Top Dog
    That's great :)  I'm glad to hear everything's alright :)
    • Gold Top Dog
    MANY times a smart dog will drink a TON of water if the urine is infected - it BURNS and they're smart enough to know inately that if they drink more it will burn less.  There are times when antibiotics are simply a good diagnostic tool -- if it helps it was probably an infection.
     
    There are 2 supplements that can help a dog where there are recurring uti's for some reason (and just like some women get them all the time, some breeds/some dogs get a LOT of UTIs)
     
    Cranberry not only acidifies the urine (dog urine is very alkalyne and when there is TOO much alkaline you will get stuff like struvite crystals) -- but it actually 'binds' with infection cells and helps them not be able to 'stick' in the urinary tract.
     
    there is also a nutriceutical called "D-Mannose" that is incredibly helpful for recurring UTI's -- like cranberry (only MORE so) it binds with infection cells (particularly nasty ones like e coli) and makes them too slippery to 'stick' in the urinary tract.  The one I use for Billy is the NOW brand -- unfortunately the one Solaray makes (which is normally a decent company) has Cran-actin in it (which is kind of a super cranberry pill).  The problem is there is not enough D-Mannose for the amount of cranberry -- so I'm still having to get the plain D-Mannose.  REALLY helpful tho.
     
    I'm not saying not to check out diabetes for this dog -- however, often I've seen vets JUMP to thinking diabetes just because there is a lot of drinking.  But I've seen MANY times ... a smart dog will drink just plain to avoid the burn.  It's not rocket science -- eww, if I stop drinking it hurts worse.  So particularly if you see a dog who will pee and MAKE A BEELINE for water ... that dog usually has a UTI.  It's not 'thirsty' (which you'll see THIRST in diabetes) it's just got burning urine.
    • Gold Top Dog
    That makes sense - so my question now is do I give her as much water as she wants thereby surely having her go all over the place...or do I withhold large amounts of water and only give her a few sips now and then?  I work from 6:30 am to 2pm and have been taking their water up, but boy do both dogs drink like crazy when I put a little down when I get home.
    Thanx...
    • Gold Top Dog
    If the dog feels the need to flush the kidneys I wouldn't withhold water.  In fact, NEVER do I withhold water from a dog just for my convenience (and that includes training - sorry, but I have definitely strong feelings on that).
     
    Put towels down in the crate or where the dog lies so that she CAN pee and kick it aside.
    • Gold Top Dog
    Thats what I did last night and today - I lined our hall with old blankets and filled her water bowl and thought...Pee Away!  But I came home today and for the first time in over a week - no pee!!!  She held it like always and ran outside and went for the longest time!  Then she came in and drank 1/2 bowl of water! 
     
    So maybe we are on the road to recovery....thanks so much
     
    Sherry