Lion threw up? (Mech A)

Is it hot by you, Mech??  Maybe the heat got to him??

Deb W.

It is warm, but I wouldnt say HOT. I think its about 77 right now, but when me and Lion took the walk it must have been around 71.

When he threw up, did any of his breakfast come back up?  It seems like 3 hours would be enough for him to have digested the pill before he tossed his cookies. 

Thyroid meds are leveling, aren't they?  Does he get more than one dose per day?

Yeah, you could see some kibble in his vomit. I didnt actuallly see the pill, and its bright blue so I dont know.

Yes, he gets two pills a day. One for breakfast and one for dinner.

You said ONE word that makes me think he needs to be tested. '*HYPER* -- Have your vet send it to Dr. Dodds ( http://www.hemopet.org ) OR to Michigan State.  But do it **SOON**.

If his thyroid is off (sometimes they need less of a dose as they age) you do NOT want him to move into "hyPER thyroid" -- that's dangerous.  It can make the bloodpressure go up and with a dog that can be lethal before you even know it.

Does he typically pick the pill out?  How long has he taken the thyroid med?  Has he been tested SINCE they put him on it??

Don't try to "HIde" a pill -- it's ludicrous -- a dog's sense of smell is SO astute they know that pill is in there and trying to "hide" it is like lying to them.  Don't diminish your relationship with your dog that way. 

I show them the pill and I put it in something that's SLIPPERY (like butter or something like liverwurst that's mushy and slippery) ... even ricotta cheese or yogurt can work.  But tell him "Just swallow" -- by showing him the pill is IN there and that you don't want him to chew you can train him to trust you.

So -- at about the same time -- give him a piece of steak or even lunch meat -- something solid and HANG ONTO IT and tell him "Chew it GOOD" -- and hold it while he nibbles it -- "GOOD boy!! That's chew good!!"

By doing those two commands one after another he'll "get it" when you show him the pill IN something "Just swallow" (because it's bitter) and then you give him the nummy treat ALONE and say "OK -- CHEW GOOD!" and he'll chew it and let it linger in his mouth.

It takes some work but it DOES work well.  You can also then get them to chew stuff like pieces of apple or fruit that you *want* them to chew so it doesn't give them a belly ache. 

But DON'T let this go on -- go ahead and give him the thyroid pill tonight but WATCH -- is he hyper *after* -- does he look even a bit bug-eyed???  nervous?  pacing or unable to settle?? just anxious??

If so DON'T give him more thyroid med untl you get him tested.  That's one place where it's better to be safe than sorry.  Thyroid meds need to be adjusted frequently .... it's something you gotta keep track of.

calliecritturs

You said ONE word that makes me think he needs to be tested. '*HYPER*

He has always had his playful moods even  before he was on the pill for thyroid. He has had quite a few more recently though. Like, he will go run around the house with a toy and just be really playful. That could be because he has lost weight recently and is more in shape now. He needed to lose about 5lbs and we finally got it off. But. he isnt always hyper after the pill. It just comes at random times during the day. So, do you still think the pill could be causing it? It's not like HYPERACTIVE behavior its just playful stuff.

calliecritturs

Does he typically pick the pill out

No, not usually. He has just started doing this.

calliecritturs

How long has he taken the thyroid med?

 He has taken it since June 7th or 8th.

calliecritturs

Has he been tested SINCE they put him on it??

Yes, he has been tested and my vet said he was doing well with the medicine.

calliecritturs

Don't try to "HIde" a pill -- it's ludicrous -- a dog's sense of smell is SO astute they know that pill is in there and trying to "hide" it is like lying to them.  Don't diminish your relationship with your dog that way. 

That makes sense I guess. I will try showing it to him first and see how he does.

calliecritturs

But DON'T let this go on -- go ahead and give him the thyroid pill tonight but WATCH -- is he hyper *after* -- does he look even a bit bug-eyed???  nervous?  pacing or unable to settle?? just anxious??

No, he's not like OVERhyper. He's more just playful. And definetly not anxious haha. I guess I dont know how to explain it other than playful hyper.

Thank you so much for all your information Callie!

 It can be kinda futzy trying to get the right dose for thyroid supplements -- Billy's goes up and down ALL the time.

He's NEWLY on the med -- that means it won't "settle" for a bit so YES more bloodwork needs to be done.  He wouldn't "zoom" from hypo to hyPER thyroid but hyper is FAR more dangerous so you just plain don't WANT it to go there.

If your vet sent the bloodwork to Antech or a local lab ask to have it sent to Michigan State or to Dr. Dodds.  You'll get a WAY more accurate reading.  (taking his breeds into account which is important)

to a degree it's great that they regain some of their vigor -- but it really shouldn't be hugely noticable.  Really often vets may try to 'save you money' by not doing more bloodwork, but it IS dangerous.

I lost Muffin the Intrepid TO high blood pressure.  I never knew it was an issue for dogs -- and you couldn't tell by looking at him or his behavior when his BP went "high".  It's invisible - often like it is for humans.  Vet usually don't even TEST a dog's blood pressure.  That's why it is SO critical not to let Lion slip into a thyroid that is supplemented too much rather than too little.

I'm *not* saying to take him off the med -- I'm simply saying that if the behavior is pretty noticable??? Get him tested and see if the dose needs to be adjusted.  Just because you won't get a warning otherwise really.  When a dog is put on thyroid meds they need to have their blood tested within a month or so  of going on the meds anyway -- and every 4-6 months is CRITICAL.

Billy's been supplemented for 5 of the 6 years I've had him and it's helped SO much -- but his dose has changed probably 5 or 6 TIMES since then -- up and down. 

AND - this may sound weird but he's a smart boy ... he KNOWS he feels different and he KNOWS the drug is being given to him (they DO know -- their nose is SO beyond ours -- they know before they take it and they know by the smell of their own poop that it's "different";).  And if he's a thinker like some dogs are, if he thinks he doesn't like that "smell" he may try to ditch the med because of it.

I don't usually "believe" a dog when they tell me they don't want something -- but I DO check it out.  ****SOME**** times they know more than we do.  Not often -- but sometimes they do ... it's work checking.

Your right, I will definetly talk to the vet about testing him again.

calliecritturs

****SOME**** times they know more than we do.  Not often -- but sometimes they do ... it's work checking.

calliecritturs

AND - this may sound weird but he's a smart boy

Nope, it doesnt sound weird. I fully believe they can tell.

Thankyou Callie!

 Sequoyah is hypothyroid, so she is on twice daily meds, too.  I used to put the pill in peanut butter on a spoon, then scrape off the peanut butter on the back of the top teeth - it gets stuck there and they basically have to swallow it.  But, she's also good enough to just let me pop it down her little throat nekkid too.  She's pretty stable on the meds but still gets tested (Michigan) every six months. 

 Hopefully he's feeling better this morning! He clearly just a funny tummy for a bit.

One thing that really caught me is that you are giving him the pill in his meal - you should be giving it 1 hour BEFORE or 3 hours AFTER he eats.  That is direct from Dodds.

Bugsy takes his tablet in a piece of liverwurst, leftover meat, or food roll.  He also at certain times of the year gets Benadryl.  Normally he swallows everything no problem every once in a while (this morning) he will spit out a Benadryl - in no way do i think he is saying i don't need this.  I have a feeling the benadryl smells or tastes funny.  After his knee surgery he had a million giant tablets to take and never spit one out so it is only the benadryl.

From my understanding you want to go about a month on the dose at first - get tested - then go three months get tested - then go six months and get tested

Because Bugsy's is the autoimmune type I do all the testing through Hemopet

kpwlee

Hopefully he's feeling better this morning! He clearly just a funny tummy for a bit.

Yes, he's much better now. Back to his normal self.

kpwlee

One thing that really caught me is that you are giving him the pill in his meal - you should be giving it 1 hour BEFORE or 3 hours AFTER he eats.  That is direct from Dodds.

Really?!?! I didnt know that! The vet has always told me to give it with the meal. Well, thankyou for that!

kpwlee

Normally he swallows everything no problem every once in a while (this morning) he will spit out a Benadryl - in no way do i think he is saying i don't need this.  I have a feeling the benadryl smells or tastes funny. 

It's the incredible rare situation that I think the dog knows he doesn't 'need' it -- David's more apt to say that (but my husband wouldn't take an aspirin if an anvil fell on his head), but RARELY it can happen.

However -- they WILL decide they don't like something.

Take benedryl for example -- just ONCE try one and let it dissolve on your tongue -- or break a caplet in half and rub it on your tongue.  And heaven forbid it's a capsule (like an actual capsule not a capLET???) -- and BREAK the daned thing ????

Your mouth will fizz and you'll think your mouth is gonna self destruct -- your whole mouth goes to sleep almost instantly.  It is the WORST feeling ever ( at least for me -- shudder) -- so if it does THAT to their tongue and they have a shot at identifying it, yep -- I can imagine they'd get a REAL bad dislike for it.

 But yeah, Karen makes a SUPER point -- you always wait a bit )half hour to an hour) before you give them the pill to have it work well.

ALSO -- when you **DO** go to test him make sure they take the blood ***FOUR TO SIX HOURS POST PILL** (again that's a Dr. Dodds thing).  and again most vets don't know that either.  So *I* time it -- I'll make sure if their appt is at noon they get their pill about 7-8 a.m. JUST so it's timed right -- and actually I'f done it enough times (and screwed it up a few *sigh*) that I've seen it work -- you get a more accurate read 4-6 hours post pill!

calliecritturs

ALSO -- when you **DO** go to test him make sure they take the blood ***FOUR TO SIX HOURS POST PILL** (again that's a Dr. Dodds thing).  and again most vets don't know that either.  So *I* time it -- I'll make sure if their appt is at noon they get their pill about 7-8 a.m. JUST so it's timed right -- and actually I'f done it enough times (and screwed it up a few *sigh*) that I've seen it work -- you get a more accurate read 4-6 hours post pill!

Ok! Thank you so much!

I dont know what I would do without you guys........