Great Pyr

    • Gold Top Dog

    Great Pyr

    Ahh!....people never cease to amaze me.

    A new client of mine is a Great Pyrense. The family just wants her let out in their yard to potty and put back in her crate. They told me "don't let her bark" because they got to many complaints about it. They then proceeded to tell me "all this dog wants to do it patrol the yard! she doesn't want to stay inside- ever! *grumble/complaining*"......Hmm isn't that what a Great Pyr is supposed to do? Guard their yard? I honestly know nothing about this breed but why in the world would a BUSY family, in a CROWDED suburban neighborhood, get a breed known to do guard/alert? Plus...this dog is adopted from a FARM- so, she's used to WORKING. Now, she's crated during the day, and let out in a small, fenced yard. Isn't that sad? Sad I feel bad for the dog. She really isn't used to being touched at all. You can tell she tolerates it, but isn't enjoying it, and this family has 3 kids + 1 on the way!!!! The owner/husband told me he thought a Great Pyr was a fluffly white version of a Newfie....what the heck? Really? So, I'm guessing they didn't do their homework!

    Mods, if you need to move this to "breeds" feel free! Sorry if I put it in the wrong spot!

    • Gold Top Dog

     I managed to move it to Breeds before commencing my Kate-bangs-head-on-wall routine, which kicks in whenever I hear of this. 

    IMHO it's cruel to keep a Pyr in such conditions, although now that they've hired you she will get some much-needed mental and physical exercise.

    Yes, Great Pyrs are supposed to guard their homes and gardens, and yes they should alert bark.  If she's barking more than for the odd alert it's likely she was never properly taught what she should and should not be on the lookout for, which is an ESSENTIAL part of training any breed of LGD, and is just as important in a pet LGD as a working one.  

    For the record I live in a suburban neighbourhood with a small garden - with dedication and awareness, this can be done with no ill-effects for the dog.  It doesn't sound like this Pyr was the best match for this family, but credit to them for taking steps to get her more exercise.  You may find that YOU will need to educate her on what is "normal" and what is not on your walks, and also be prepared for her to alert on the strangest things.  What she does and does not find odd will of course depend on what she's been socialised to, as with all dogs, but with LGDs the gaps in socialisation can often be much more apparent than normal. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    Benedict

    You may find that YOU will need to educate her on what is "normal" and what is not on your walks, and also be prepared for her to alert on the strangest things.  What she does and does not find odd will of course depend on what she's been socialised to, as with all dogs, but with LGDs the gaps in socialisation can often be much more apparent than normal. 

    Ohhh yes....she's not used to cars, buses/trucks, trains, police/fire engines, slamming doors, groups of kids (coming home from school), the microwave and coffee maker, the TV.....she bark alerts to it all....this poor girl. She was born/raised on a farm in a rural area her entire life and has lived outdoors/in a barn only....I believe she's 7-ish years old now. She isn't leash broken which is why I'm only letting her out in their yard now. When you hook a leash on her she freezes and will totally shut down.

    • Gold Top Dog

     She CAN adjust.  Eventually.  But she needs some time, and it's best if they can take it slow and not crank on her for, yes, doing her job.  They may need to bite the bullet and just drag her out on that leash - she needs a crash course in the game of What Made That Noise. The good news is that she'll only need to see these things a couple times to realize there's no need to alert.

    There's two things going on here.  One, she doesn't know WHAT she's guarding.  She's guessing wildly. She needs everyone in the family to do stuff with her - no touching please, no snuggling. Take her out on lead, feed her treats, walk in circles in the back yard, talk to her, stop at every darn leaf in the back yard.  It's like mini walks. Everyone needs to do this.  The idea is that she needs to know that the whole family is on the same team together. If she were thrown into a new guarding group, she'd follow everyone around for a while until she knew the ropes.

    That brings us to part two. Now she'll be bonded with the family and knows the limits of her physical territory. She needs to learn what her audible territory is. It would be really nice if a couple times a week, everyone in the family could go for a walk with her together. Besides that, she needs, seriously, about three walks a day as far as possible from the house. It's not important to go on the same walk every day - in fact, the more variety the better.  She needs to see all the sounds she hears, in context, and realize they present no harm to her new family.  She'll take her cue from the one with the lead (needs to be an adult or teenager for probably her first year in the family).  If the leader is calm, she will be too.

    On the crating.  Just, agggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh.  They need to realize that crating while her family is home, is the equivalent of severe beating for another type of dog. If they can't watch her while someone is actually in the house, they need to attach her to a belt, close doors, or use baby gates to limit her ability to amuse herself in another part of the house.   

    LGDs have very high tolerances for physical pain, but are very sensitive to being cut off from the pack. So you can use this for an aversive, but remember how very aversive it is.

    Let's say it's two months from now and she's learned all the sounds in the neighborhood.  The mailman comes to the door. She jumps to the window and barks. That's fine. Mom says, "Thank you!" and now she should be done - Mom can take it from here, there is no danger. But she keeps barking. NOW you want to firmly but without comment or fuss, crate her in another room (or just put her in the room and close the door).

    This is perfectly horrible to an LGD.  She's out of the flock! Something might be happening! She needs to be needed!

    I'd hope she hasn't learned to bark BECAUSE she was removed, at this point.  Even if so, however, you can give it about 30 seconds to a minute, and then let her out.  Ignore her though, regardless of whether she was quiet or not when you opened the door. None of that matters.  You removed her, then let her back, and she knows you have control of that - and more importantly, she can control herself next time and avoid being separated.

    I hope all that makes sense. I adore these guys and if I were a millionaire I'd totally be doing LGD rescue and rehab. 

    • Gold Top Dog

    brookcove
    I hope all that makes sense. I adore these guys and if I were a millionaire I'd totally be doing LGD rescue and rehab. 

     

    You do know that at that point we'd need to build another house on your property so I could help, right?  LOL.  

    • Gold Top Dog

    Becca, thank you! I will bring some of this up with them....especially the crate part. They aren't exactly dog-savvy people at all....and I don't think they have a clue about working breeds at all either...but they're defiantly willing to learn. They're nice, just don't have a clue, lol.

    • Gold Top Dog

    While I'm certainly not the expert Becca is, and don't think I need to necessarily add anything to what she said. I think it's very important for the dog to know what she can alert and what she can't. Misha for over a year and a half did not alert the doorbell or the door. And then one day, doorbell rings, he lets out a low growl and walks up to the window and starts barking. He has a command to tell him that he's done his job, he gets a quick pat on the head and a "good boy" and we move on. If he can't see what's going on and alerts that there might be something going on outside, he gets to go check it out and gets rewarded for that too.

    He was never trained so that he knew what to alert or not to alert, but when he was a pup he was rewarded for being quiet. It took him a long time to even figure out he could bark after that. They're not in a situation to allow her to bark until she's figured everything out though. And about her being an indoor dog, Misha loves being indoors -- as long as the whole family wants to stay in one room where he can see them. So I agree that she can learn (because I'm sure Becca knows better than me anyway), but it's going to be an effort from the whole family, and take that understanding that you can help them with.

    • Gold Top Dog

    You do know that at that point we'd need to build another house on your property so I could help, right?  LOL. 


    We'll just buy the 30 acres next door that's for sale, and the nine acres my buddy Sydney has for sale - you all can live in the pretty little cottage on the thirty acres (already there - no need to build!), and we'll start us a little LGD rescue and rehab enclave! 

    • Gold Top Dog

    brookcove

    You do know that at that point we'd need to build another house on your property so I could help, right?  LOL. 


    We'll just buy the 30 acres next door that's for sale, and the nine acres my buddy Sydney has for sale - you all can live in the pretty little cottage on the thirty acres (already there - no need to build!), and we'll start us a little LGD rescue and rehab enclave! 

     

    Sign me up! Big Smile