Dog Community

German Shepherd Question

Posted : 10/27/2006 4:40:10 PM

My parents own Sky#%92s sister which they both came from Akc parents. My question is would a purebred black and tan German have a White stripe down the center of the nose. I personal haven#%92t seen many with it.

glenmar

Posted : 10/27/2006 4:54:33 PM

I bet if you were to check the pedigree you'd find a white ancestor somewhere in the past. The speckles are a bit unusual and would make ME question whether or not the dog is in fact purebred, and the markings are certainly unusual, but I don't see anything BUT gsd there.

scoobychick

Posted : 10/27/2006 5:15:54 PM

She was the only one in the litter that had the unusual markings. I will do some checking around in the pedigree to see what I can dig up. The good thing is this line will atleast end with these to We're planing a double sister spay next month.

Pwca

Posted : 10/27/2006 8:35:32 PM

I'd question the purebred thing too, honestly- she's got white toetips too, it looks like. And while a white spot on the chest or toes aren't THAT uncommon, I've never seen white facial markings on a PB GSD except for that one lady who has the weird tricolor GSDs that were a somatic mutation.

glenmar

Posted : 10/28/2006 6:28:38 AM

When Shadow was born he was PITCH black, but had white toes. I know he's purebed. In fact as I recall we called Molly Miss Socks because she had some pretty pronounced white on her as well. The rescue did later confirm that in fact Molly and her litter mates ARE purebred.

If white occurs naturally in one out of 200 pups, then I'm just thinking that there is a white somewhere back in the pups pedigree.....In fact my first foster litter we had some white feet...and I actually visited with and SAW both of those parents. I don't think it's terribly uncommon for some breeders, particularly the lesser ones to USE the whites in the breeding program, color being a disqualification or not. And if there is ANY white in the lines, it can show up in some pretty funky ways.

scoobychick

Posted : 10/29/2006 11:37:49 PM

As a whole is there something genetically wrong with the white shepherds. Or is more of an undesired color for the standard set by akc.

As for sky#%92s sister it makes since that there had to be a white shepherd in there somewhere. Even with the girls being almost 8months Dee Dee still carries the white coloring, her stripe on the face has gotten a little smaller in size.

ColleenC

Posted : 10/30/2006 12:04:58 AM

A lot of times, with dogs that aren't normally white, the deafness gene runs with that color. I know of many deaf white boxers and pits. When I was little, we had a litter of Aussies with a mostly white puppy. That one did not survive very long. It's probably the same thing with GSDs.

glenmar

Posted : 10/30/2006 7:41:44 AM

There is NOTHING gentically wrong with a white shepherd. If I remember my history correctly, it was back in the days of Hitler that whites were really frowned upon. Now granted, the white was not as effective working a herd of sheep, or so they said, because they were more easily seen at nite, however logically, does one care if the wolves stay away because they SEE the dog or because they smell the dog, or the dog attacks them when they try to eat the sheep? I guess if I had dogs guarding my sheep I wouldn't particularly care WHY the wolves didn't eat them......

It was around that time that for whatever reason the breed clubs started lobbied the AKC to list the color white as a disqualification. They got their wish. However, testing and studies have shown that the white is in NO WAY genitically inferior to any other color of shepherd.

ColleenC

Posted : 10/30/2006 11:48:25 AM

Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn't sure if it was the same with Shepherds or not.

brookcove

Posted : 10/30/2006 12:48:38 PM

White herding dogs fell out of favor around the turn of the century. There was a lot of eugenics nonsense drifting around during that time and among the silly notions that grew legs then, was the idea that white or light colored dogs couldn't work sheep as effectively. Evidence to the contrary, as there were many lines of light colored and/or mostly white dogs who were quite effective herders before then. One reason was that "sheep didn't respect them" and another was that BCs, which were on the rise as the gold standard of herding, tended to be mostly black. Anyway, selection pressure tipped towards black or dark dogs in many European countries.

If you look at pictures of pre-BC collies/shepherds, you'll see a lot of greys (merle) and whites, while after the turn of the century suddenly the working dogs were mostly black or dark colored (as in saddle back sables).

RidgebackGermansShep

Posted : 10/30/2006 6:16:59 PM

wow, I've never seen it, but i think it's really cute! Kaiser has a white spot on his chest and some white hairs beneath his tail, but he's a black shep (the only one in his litter) a lot of people question if he is purebred because his back isn't sloped, but he is!

rwbeagles

Posted : 10/30/2006 11:26:33 PM

White Shepherds are a separate breed with UKC...we see them quite often. They are quite striking and lovely...nice temperaments...very "solid" in their nerve, the one's we see.

White is also an accepted GSD color with UKC as well...the White Shepherd is another breed entirely. So at one show you can see "white GSD's" in the ring with GSD's and then there'll be another ring with White Shepherds. ALBINISM is a DQ...which is readily apparent as different than a white GSD.

ALBINO GSD's may have issues just as Dobes and other breeds might. Albinism is well documented to carry problems with it.

glenmar

Posted : 10/31/2006 9:57:24 AM

Gina is correct that white gsds are a separate breed, BUT whites do still come from traditional gsds as well....our Sheba did. And while AKC considers white a disqualification, UKC does not.

samshine

Posted : 11/6/2006 6:06:30 PM

Late on this but here's my two cents worth. White markings like this are the result of a white spotting gene. I know there are several types but since they are not an issue in my breed I'm not well versed in them. White spotting genes are the type that can be linked with deafness when there is a lot of white, especially around the head and ears. With this kind of white there is no pigment in the white areas.

White German Shepherds and most other mainly white dogs have a different kind of genetic white. There is pigment but it is so dilute as to appear white. There is no increased risk of deafness in those cases.

So my point is that the markings on this dog have nothing to do the possibility of having a white shepherd in the pedigree. It's two completely different things genetically.