Heartworm

• 08-23-2007 1:08 AM

  chezra Joined on 12-11-2006 Posts 19 Points 0

  Heartworm Reply Contact We have rescued a Border Collie recently. We live in Idaho where there really isn't a problem with heartworm, I don't think there has ever been a confirmed case in a dog. However, we are thinking of making a road trip to Florida in a few weeks and plan to take our Janie with us. We know that Florida has a heartworm problem. In talking with the vet today he told us there is no real way to prevent heartworm. He says that a dog needs to have a blood test to check for the adult stage of these worms, then if that test is negative, a heart worm medicine can be given to kill any larvae. He said to take Janie with us and the day after we get back have the blood test. If she doe not have adult heartworms, acquired in her past, she can be treated for any that she may have gotten while in Florida. He says the heartworm is very slow growing, so there would be no way if she is infected in Florida that they would reach adulthood by the time we come home. He was also concerned about using ivermectin (the active ingredient in Heart Guard) on a border collie. He said collies can have life threatening reactions to this drug. I am not well versed in the heartworm area. Does anyone know about heartworms? Does what the vet is telling us make sense? We use Revolution monthly, but again the vet said that is not a preventative for heartworm. Thanks for any help you can give.

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• 08-23-2007 2:17 AM

  In reply to chezra

  sandra_slayton Joined on 09-10-2007 Ingleside, Texas Posts 3,196 Points 0

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact I am a little confused here.  Revolution IS a heartworm preventative.  BUT my vet no longes carriest it because a number of his clients dogs did come down with heartorms while on it.  I do not know if the drug failed, or it was not applies correctly.  I know some use it and swear by it, others have vets who do not carry it because of high rate of heart worms.  Also, it is to take care of fleas, etc, and I do not want that much poison on/in my dogs at the same time.   What you were told about that one drug being bad for collies is correct.  Most who have hearding breeds  use Interceptor--I have golden retrievers and that is waht I use because it also controls hook round and whip worms.   It is my uncerstanding it takes 6 months for heartworms to develope.  I would have my dog tested now, and if clear, start on Interceptor and use it for 2-3 months and that way your dog would be protected fomr HW infestation from trip to Florida.   We adopted a golden mix in Dec. 2002 that was right at a year old and we found she had heartworms and had to go thru the treatment.  It is harsh on their bodies.  She came thru with flying colors and has been great, worm free, ever since....and also on Interceptor.

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• 08-23-2007 2:41 AM

  In reply to chezra

  chezra Joined on 12-11-2006 Posts 19 Points 0

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact Thanks for your reply. The vet told us there is no way to prevent heartworm, that if you give a heart worm med today, and the dog is bitten tomorrow, it can (and will) get heartworms. He said the monthly meds are used to kill the larvae that may have infected the dog in the past month. That is where the confusion comes in. But since this dog has never had a blood test he feels it is only necessary to check her when we get back from our trip. At that time if there are no adult worms found she can be treated for any that she might have gotten. Does this make sense? I'm just learning about heartworm myself.

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• 08-23-2007 2:58 AM

  In reply to chezra

  janet_rose Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW area, Texas Posts 3,748 Points 330

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact The term "heartworm preventative" is confusing.  The "preventative" prevents adult heartworms by killing any existing young baby heartworms.     If a dog gets baby heartworms from a mosquito bite and a "preventative" is given within a month, those baby heartworms are killed.  Otherwise, the babies would become adults in 6-7 months.   Your vet is right about using ivermectin (Heartgard) on a border collie.  The Heartgard folks claim that the dosage is not high enough to cause problems, but personally I don't trust that.  Revolution (selamectin) is a closely related cousin of ivermectin.    Your vet is incorrect on one point.  Revolution is a heartworm "preventative".  I am surprised that your vet is not aware of that.   Preventatives should not be started without testing for existing adult heartworms.  That is because a large die-off of microfilaria (initial baby stage) could clog up arteries and lungs.  However, Revolution is not supposed to have this problem.    www.revolution4dogs.com/content.asp?country=US&lang=EN&drug=RV&species=CN&sec=000 Revolution4Dogs: Revolution® (selamectin) is the safe, simple way to protect your dog from heartworms, fleas and other harmful parasites.  http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_heartworm_prevention.html#Revolution MarvistaVet: It (Revolution) is designed for broad coverage of small animal parasites and will protect dogs against not only heartworm but also ear mites, sarcoptic mange mites, and fleas. I wouldn't use Revolution because it stays in the dog's bloodstream all month.  Heartgard Plus (two chemicals) and Interceptor (one chemical) both kill heartworms and many intestinal worms, but then are out of the dog's system in 24-48 hours.  I prefer to use a topical preparation like Frontline Plus (does not enter the bloodstream) to kill fleas and ticks along with Interceptor for heartworms.  That puts just one chemical in the bloodstream for less than 48 hours.  This combination doesn't kill mites, but Revolution doesn't kill canine intestinal worms.   CAUTION:  If Janie has not been tested for adult heartworms, you should do that.  There is no guarantee where a rescue has been.

  Filed under: heartworms, ticks, ivermectin, selamectin, fleas, Revolution, sarcoptic mange, Interceptor, ear mites, Heartgard Plus Post Points: 0

• 08-23-2007 3:05 AM

  In reply to chezra

  janet_rose Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW area, Texas Posts 3,748 Points 330	RE: Heartworm Reply Contact Maybe this will help:   Heartworm "preventatives" kill baby heartworms and are given monthly.  Heartworm treatments kill adult heartworms and are very hard on the dog.   Janie can be tested right now for adult heartworms.
  	Filed under: heartworm treatment, heartworm preventative Post Points: 0

• 08-23-2007 3:11 AM

  In reply to chezra

  janet_rose Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW area, Texas Posts 3,748 Points 330

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact chezra: At that time if there are no adult worms found she can be treated for any that she might have gotten. No, this sentence doesn't make sense.  Janie could get baby heartworms in Florida and your next dose of Revolution will kill them.  Any adult heartworms that she would have after returning from Florida she already has, so I would not delay testing for them.   ETA: Correction - Janie could have some immature baby heartworms that will become adults between now and the time you get back from Florida.   If she comes up negative for adult heartworms (now or after you come back from Florida), she should be rechecked 6 months after the date you started Revolution because she could have immature baby heartworms that are (1)  too old for Revolution to kill, but (2)  too young to show up on a test for adult heartworms.

  Filed under: heartworms Post Points: 0

• 08-23-2007 3:36 AM

  In reply to chezra

  janet_rose Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW area, Texas Posts 3,748 Points 330

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact Heartworm treatments kill immature heartworms (babies too old for "preventatives" to kill) and adult heartworms.  This is done with an arsenic-containing compound.  The dog must be kept quiet (cage rest) for 4-6 weeks after treatment to help decrease the risk of pulmonary embolism due to the bodies of the heartworms.  (Pulmonary embolism: Blood clot that travels to the blood vessels in the lung and obstructs them.)   Treatment med with side effect description: melarsomine (Immiticide)

  Filed under: melarsomine, pulmonary embolism, arsenic, Immiticide, heartworm treatment Post Points: 0

• 08-23-2007 8:39 AM

  In reply to chezra

  calliecritturs Joined on 09-10-2007 Central Florida Posts 7,283 Points 1,975

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact The vet is 'right' to the extent that none of these are "preventives".  Meaning yes, that if a mosquito bites the dog more than 24 hrs after the administration of the "preventive" the microfilaria are there.  But that's the purpose of giving it monthly -- so they can NOT mature into adults.  The word "preventive" is used in the sense that it 'prevents' the microfilaria from maturing INTO adults.   You don't want adults to develop, particularly *not* in a herding dog.  So giving a good preventive is a good idea.   Now, honestly -- Revolution isn't a good thing ...period.  It 'fails' way way way too often for heartworm use (and there is a lot of discussion down here that heartworm are actually becoming 'resistant' to it.).  Interceptor is a better choice and it also kills all other blood-feasting parasites as well.   My basic problem with Revolution is that it's systemic.  You put it on the skin and it sinks into the blood and you only ****hope**** that by next month it's out of the system and you aren't overdosing month after month.  It has a ton of adverse reactions that have been documented.   Not only does Florida have more than it's share of heartworm -- it has way way WAY more than it's share of other blood-feasting parasites.  Like Hooks, whips, etc.  It would be my advice to tell you to use Interceptor while down here.   And yeah, there HAVE been documented cases of heartworm in all forty-eight continental states.  But it just doesn't make sense to let the dog get infected and WAIT for adults to develop.  The treatment then is horrible -- it's debilitating to the dog and you just don't ever want that to happen.

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• 08-23-2007 1:18 PM

  In reply to chezra

  sandra_slayton Joined on 09-10-2007 Ingleside, Texas Posts 3,196 Points 0

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact After Kartina many dogs were shipped up north for adoption.  There have been/are a couple on here who adopted Katrina dogs and they would found to be heart worm positive and had to be treated..  If one of  those Katrina dogs happened into an area that had been heartworm free, mosquitoes bit it, then chances are heartworms developed in other dogs, which would be bitten, then more dogs would be infected.    Our adopted golden mix went thru the treatment a month after we got her.  She was in a wire crate for 6 weeks, only allowed out on a leash to do her business.  She had just turned a year old and was just a puppy in heart and spirit and as hasrsh as the drugs were on her body, being crated 24/7 for 6 weeks and seeing our other dogs going free was just as hard on her.   This was in Jan. 2003.  Two weeks ago i had a geriatric physical done her even tho she isn't 6 yet.  Her chest x-rays showed heart, lungs and arteries of perfect size and shape, in face vet said her z-rays could be used to show what a "perfect dog chest" should look like.  She has no ill effect from either the worms nor the treatment.   Like Janet, I use Frontline for fleas--and only when i find fleas, it is not a monthly thing like the heartworm prevention--and interceptor for the heartworms.   A few years ago they came out with an injection called proheart6 that was 'good for 6 months".  You took your dog in every 6 months, got the injection, and didn't have to worry about monthly pills.  Well, i decided--after it had been on the market for well over a year--to start mine dogs on it, one at a time.  Hunter was first.  It killed him, brought on autoimmune hemolytic anemia and liver damage.  Ten months after his death the FDA had them pull it because it had killed so many dogs, many with AIHA, many with liver damage, and in som cases like mine they had more than one of the adverse reactions.  One was told if her dog made it til the end of the 6 months and it was out of his system, he would probably live.  He died days later.Nothing can remove those drugs that stay in the body and that is why i will not use any heartworm preventative that is in the body more than 48 hours.    Am posting a picture of Honey, our girl that made it thru the treatment just fine.

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• 08-23-2007 3:43 PM

  In reply to chezra

  chezra Joined on 12-11-2006 Posts 19 Points 0

  RE: Heartworm Reply Contact Thanks to everyone for your input. I think I understand a little better about heartworm and it's prevention/treatment now. I think what our vet was indicating was that if our Janie has adult heartworm right now, we would not want to start treatment with those awful drugs due to our upcoming trip. That is why he said to have the blood test when we get back. That way, if she is positive for the heartworms, we can start to terrible treatment. If she is negative, then she will be given Heartgard (though I've paid attention here) I think I'll ask that he get some Interceptor for her instead. Thus if she became infected while on our trip, the larvae will be killed before they become adults. Again, thank you to everyone for all of your time and effort to help.

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