Chief is sick...Update, he has parvo. (Ratsicles)

• 11-27-2007 6:28 PM

  Ratsicles Joined on 09-27-2006 Box Springs, GA Posts 1,022 Points 105

  Chief is sick...Update, he has parvo. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact Chief is sick. Hopefully he's going to be fine, but still. This morning, he didn't greet me when I went outside and didn't come when I called him. I found him over in his trough drinking water, which he promptly puked up. He then followed me around the rest of the morning like he normally does, but he was really lethargic. He wasn't his usual bouncy in-the-way, pain-in-the-butt self. He was still reasonably interested in his surroundings and what was going on, he was just a bit listless. I gave him some kibble for breakfast, and he wouldn't eat it. I gave him a satin ball, and he ate that. I don't know if he puked it up later, but he probably did. I checked on him throughout the day and he was still kinda blah. I tried to catch him pooping to see how his poop was, but I couldn't catch him in the act and a walkthrough of the pasture turned up no Chief poop. I decided that if he didn't eat his next meal, he was going to the vet. Dinner came at about 3:00 and he still didn't eat. I even offered him a whole raw egg- his favorite forbidden treat- and he turned it down. If Chief turns down and egg, there is definitely something wrong. He's been drinking tons of water all day, and throwing up water and bits of grass and stuff every few hours. Found a vet that would squeeze him in if we hurried. I'm sick (bad cold/maybe flu) so DH took him in for me. Sucks, because DH doesn't know nearly as much about the dogs as I do, but I was really in no shape to go. DH told the vet his symptoms (vomiting, lethargy, lack of appetite.) Vet  did a CBC, abdominal x-ray, urinalisys, and a fecal. I wasn't there to ask questions or get specifics, (and again, DH is really not very well versed in dog-stuff at all) but apparently they induced vomiting too, which is weird to me since he'd been puking all day, but I guess it can't hurt. X-rays showed no blackages, and the vet wanted to know if he'd eaten anything "weird." Well...define weird? Chief lives outside with goats. He eats goat crap, horse crap, chicken crap, tons of raw meat (some of it not so fresh) catches wild animals and eats them...I guess he eats alot of things that could potentially make him sick. DH tried to explain that he was a working dog and lived outside and he could have potentially gotten into LOTS of things...and apparently the vet went into a big spiel about "letting dogs roam" and how "we need to keep him inside or tied up," and overall just acted like we were incredibly irresponsible owners for having a dog that has free run of our property. When DH said he was a working dog, and tried to explain what an LGD did, the vet said "That's completely irrelevant. Supervise him while he's working and then bring him inside. There's no reason to leave a puppy outside to fend for himself like that." DH gave up at that point.  Anyway, I have no idea what the results were on any of the tests she ran, she apparently didn't tell DH.  She's closed now so I'm going to have to call her in the morning and get specifics. She she gave him some fluids and told us to give him plain Pedialyte to drink. She also gave us Famatidine(sp? Isn't that what's in PepcidAC??) and he's getting 20mg every 12 hours. She told us to fast him tonight and then offer him boiled chicken and rice starting tomorrow and just give him that for the next 72 hours.   She said to watch him for signs of shock, and told us what to look for, and said to bring him in if he gets worse or if he doesn't feel any better within 48 hours. We brought him inside tonight, which he hates- he wants to be with his goats- but it's cold and I don't want him wasting energy trying to keep warm. So is there anything else I should be doing for him?? I'm assuming he just ate something that disagreed with him, but who knows. Please send Chieferson your good thoughts. He's had a very tough day.

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• 11-27-2007 6:50 PM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  rwbeagles Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW, TX Posts 15,350 Points 2,035

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact well I won't be the best one to answer because my little Hero was acting identical to this and that well...didn't end well. My first thought is to continue to watch the blood for signs of kidney or liver involvement because that's what brought down my puppy. I thought of bloat but that would've been obvious to any vet worth anything. If he is the same tomorrow I would definitely take him to a different vet...and redo blood to make sure about the liver/kidney stuff...and I'd leave him there too if he didn't improve...they can crash so quickly if they aren't eating and drinking and keeping it down. Gina H. dog.community Moderator "I'll sleep when I'm dead, I said!"-The Cure

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• 11-27-2007 6:54 PM

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  spiritdogs Joined on 09-10-2007 Posts 10,310 Points 840

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact  The vet probably induced vomiting to see what the vomitus looked like, and to prevent any potentially toxic material from remaining in the stomach.  With persistent vomiting, dehydration is a danger, hence the pedialyte.  Pepcid is what the vet gives Maska when he has a GI upset, and it's quite common for that to be prescribed.  I certainly do not consider someone who farms, and has a legitimate working dog, to be an irresponsible owner - apparently the vet doesn't have any livestock.  A herding dog can come in when it's done, but a livestock guardian is there to protect the flock when the predators are out - which, in the case of coyotes, is always.  She really should know better.  It isn't as if this is a pet being banished to a chain in the back yard or something. I'm sorry your boy isn't feeling well.  We will keep him in our thoughts tonight.  Good luck!    Regional Director for Massachusetts, International Positive Dog Training Association Director, SeniorCare Pawsitive Connections Program AKC CGC Evaluator #3669 Therapy Dogs, Inc. Tester/Observer Sioux, CGC, TDInc. Maska, CGC, TDInc. Sequoyah, CGC Fergie, Retired Lap Dog, Age 19 Dancer, CGC, TDInc. (1989-2006) #1 Heart Dog "If you talk to the animals they will talk with you and you will know each other. If you do not talk to them you will not know them and what you do not know, you will fear. What one fears, one destroys." - Chief Dan George "The fidelity of a dog is a precious gift demanding no less binding moral responsibilities than the friendship of a human being. The bond with a true dog is as lasting as the ties of this earth can ever be." ~ Konrad Lorenz

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• 11-27-2007 8:14 PM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  jessies_mom Joined on 09-10-2007 Indiana Posts 4,323 Points 40	Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact  I'll be sending lots of healing thoughts for Chief and hope he feels better tomorrow. Life isn't about waiting through the storm; it's about learning to dance in the rain. Janice
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• 11-27-2007 8:43 PM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  kpwlee Joined on 06-17-2006 North Carolina Posts 4,322 Points 380	Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact  sending all our best to you and the little big guy.  please let us know how he is tomorrow "I think Karen should get a BC next time because she deserves a more mellow laid back dog! Or a Maremma because she needs a more clingy, biddable, easily trained dog." Brookcove 2008
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• 11-27-2007 10:31 PM

  In reply to kpwlee

  Ratsicles Joined on 09-27-2006 Box Springs, GA Posts 1,022 Points 105

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact  Thanks guys. I just have a horrible feeling about this. He's been laying down since we got him home. He got up once to walk to another room and lay down again. Considering he's a 6 month old normally spazzy puppy, that really scares me. He's still drinking water and refusing to touch even the best, stinkiest food- I know I'm supposed to be fasting him, but I've just been offering him little tidbits to tempt him. Nothing works. He hasn't puked since he got back from the vet- so like, 5 hours? That's an improvement I guess. He also hasn't pooped at all, and I don't know if that should worry me or not- since he lives outside, I really don't know how frequently he normally goes. He eats mostly raw, so if my other dogs are any indicator, he may only poop once a day, and sometimes skip a day- so maybe it's nothing to worry about. I don't even know.   I am just so worried. His facial expression makes it pretty clear that he feels awful. If he's not 100% better in the morning, which I doubt he will be, he's going straight to another vet.  Maybe I'm being paranoid, but I just have a really terrible feeling about this. I hope I'm just being paranoid. My dogs never get sick. I've only had to deal with a serious illness in my dogs once before; when Axl got heartworm and nearly died about 4 years ago. I may be freaking out over an upset tummy, in which case I'll feel pretty silly...but I'm so scared that it's more than that. Thanks again guys. Please keep sending all of the healing vibes you can.

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• 11-27-2007 10:35 PM

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  rwbeagles Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW, TX Posts 15,350 Points 2,035

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact did they do a barium series on him? That by itself often coats the stomach and helps if it's only a tummy upset. That's usually a 'for the day thing' tho so they probably didn't. Something to ask about tho if he's still off tomorrow. Hope the night see's him better....don't feed him as hard as it is...he needs to have that empty stomach...and worse case scenario ANYTHING in the tummy runs up the risk of aspiration during any ensuing surgery....always best to think of the bigger pic... All good things to Chief tonight... Gina H. dog.community Moderator "I'll sleep when I'm dead, I said!"-The Cure

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• 11-27-2007 10:43 PM

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  calliecritturs Joined on 09-10-2007 Central Florida Posts 7,640 Points 2,075

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact The vet is thinking intestinal blockage -- and it surely could be.  The vet induced vomiting to see what was IN the stomach and how digested it was.  But if he's not eating but IS drinking water that is a big deal.  Somehow SOMETHING is getting out of the stomach or he'd be vomiting water TOO Take him back in the morning if he's still majorly off his food.

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• 11-28-2007 8:54 AM

  In reply to calliecritturs

  Ratsicles Joined on 09-27-2006 Box Springs, GA Posts 1,022 Points 105

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact did they do a barium series on him? That by itself often coats the stomach and helps if it's only a tummy upset. That's usually a 'for the day thing' tho so they probably didn't. Something to ask about tho if he's still off tomorrow. No, they didn't, but I'll definitely mention it when we go in today.  There's minor improvement this morning I guess...he's up and walking around at least. Still drinking lots of water and not eating. Puked once first thing this morning right after drinking a ton of water, but kept down all of the water he drank after that. The biggest improvement to me is that he pooped and peed- which he hadn't done at all in over 12 hours and it was really starting to worry me. The pee was totally normal, not too dark and not too light and there was tons of it. The poop was total liquid, except for some fragments of what looked like egg shell or maybe really tiny bone fragments. But, it was light brown, and no evidence of blood. It did smell horrible though- sort of a sweaty, almost metallic smell. I know that's gross, but isn't that a symptom of Coccidiosis? I guess I'll mention it to the vet when we go in. I'm a little more optimistic since he seems to be a little more perky than he was, especially after I let him go back out with the goats this morning. Plus, if he's pooping, doesn't that mean that he doesn't have a blockage? I'm hoping he just ate something gross and got a bacterial infection. He has an appt for 2:45, so I'll update after that. Thanks again for the support and advice, everyone.

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• 11-28-2007 9:10 AM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  Pit_Pointer_Aussie Joined on 04-13-2007 Upstate New York Posts 1,255 Points 125	Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact  Sending good thoughts for Chief! Poor little guy, and sorry to hear that first vet was such a bone head about working dogs! It's just a better life with dogs.
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• 11-28-2007 9:22 AM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  rwbeagles Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW, TX Posts 15,350 Points 2,035

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact Ratsicles: It did smell horrible though- sort of a sweaty, almost metallic smell. I know that's gross, but isn't that a symptom of Coccidiosis? I guess I'll mention it to the vet when we go in. The only really marked smell I know of with diarreah is for Parvo...that has a very distinct smell. Might have them do a test for that if they didn't already. Gina H. dog.community Moderator "I'll sleep when I'm dead, I said!"-The Cure

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• 11-28-2007 9:41 AM

  In reply to rwbeagles

  Ratsicles Joined on 09-27-2006 Box Springs, GA Posts 1,022 Points 105

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact Oh god, Parvo?? But he's been vaccinated, and wouldn't he have to come in contact with an infected dog's *** to get it anyway?? Chief never leaves our property and almost never comes into contact with our other dogs, since he's pretty dog aggressive. I don't know how he'd come into contact with strange dogs or their poop. God, I hope it isn't parvo. I don't know if the vet tested for it yesterday, I'll have to call and ask. If not, I'll make sure they do it today. I'm going along today instead of just sending DH, so I'll actually have some clue as to what gets done, unlike yesterday.

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• 11-28-2007 9:44 AM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  rwbeagles Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW, TX Posts 15,350 Points 2,035

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact Rats..don't panic okay? It's just the only smell *I* know of, that you can smell and know what's up. I have never had a dog with either coccidia or giardia but I know there's diarreah there too...and it could also have a special notable scent. Others here likely have some input on that. I know the Parvo test is something they do on poop and even for coccidia you'd need a sample so IF you can collect some IF he goes again I would. But he is feeling better...and that's good. He is drinking and holding that down which is also good. Have you taken a temp? Gina H. dog.community Moderator "I'll sleep when I'm dead, I said!"-The Cure

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• 11-28-2007 9:50 AM

  In reply to Ratsicles

  rwbeagles Joined on 09-10-2007 DFW, TX Posts 15,350 Points 2,035	Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact TOTALLY just thought of this! He had raw pork recently yes? It could be trichinosis? Gina H. dog.community Moderator "I'll sleep when I'm dead, I said!"-The Cure
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• 11-28-2007 10:09 AM

  In reply to rwbeagles

  Ratsicles Joined on 09-27-2006 Box Springs, GA Posts 1,022 Points 105

  Re: Chief is sick...Needs good thoughts. (Ratsicles) Reply Contact I haven't taken his temp., stupid thermometer is broken and I hadn't gotten a new one yet. TOTALLY just thought of this! He had raw pork recently yes? It could be trichinosis? I thought of that too, and looked it up: http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=2&cat=1621&articleid=772 Apparently trichinosis doesn't really affect dogs if they do get it, from the 10 mins of research I did. Plus, Butter has been eating the pig too and he's totally fine, at least so far. Either way I threw the rest of it out. Chief has been eating on the pig for the past week. We got rid of all of the organs and stuff after about a day, but it's been really cold outside so the muscles/bones were still in reasonably good shape and we were letting him eat them. I don't think its trichinosis based on what I've read, but I do think that the pig may be the cause of this- Butter has only been eating the frozen legs and stuff, but Chief has had access to the rest of the body out in the pasture and that stuff definitely wasn't frozen. It wasn't horrible and putrid, since it's been so cold, but it's definitely not fresh anymore. I was planning on taking away what was left of it in the next day or so. I'm pretty convinced that that stupid pig is the culprit though. I've already buried the remains and threw away the frozen parts Butter was eating.

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