General Chat

Re: Ticks!

kpwlee — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 14:43:36 GMT

I feel really fortunate so far - we have tons of ticks around here but have only found one on Bugs, ever, and it was walking around on his paw. We used K9 Advantix until last Fall when we started FL+. I am anxious to see if that works as well now that we are more in season. We've also never even seen a flea.

Because of the bad press re K9 Ad I would like to stay on FL+ so my fingers are crossed.

I also recommend Neem spray. Your dogs need to get used to it as it has a citronella smell but we have walked in thick woods and tall grasses and come out clean.

Lyme's isn't huge here but Rocky Mtn fever and erlichosis (sp?) are common. DH got RMF first year we were here

Re: Ticks!

erica1989 — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 01:12:06 GMT

We are using the Vectra now too (in an animal shelter) and so far - I love it!

The promeris is CRAP. IMO. We used it on the cats - and ALL lost hair on the application site. It seemed to be almost burning their skin. We sent our supply back to company.

Re: Ticks!

heinzclown — Wed, 09 Apr 2008 23:29:09 GMT

The problem with all of these new products coming out is that the fleas and ticks have to bite in order for the meds to work. I am a tech and we are now using Vectra and we love it b/c it doesn't have a smell, and it is a contact kill! Meds work just when the parasites come into contact with it. It is a kill & REPEL product. That is important b/c it prevents the fleas and ticks from biting. If they don't bite we avoid not just allergic reactions to the bites but more importantly the disease transfer process. If a tick doesn't bite, it doesn't take a bloodmeal, it doesn't transfer disease! More importantly these are disease that can be transfered to us if the ticks bite. So why not use something that repels the ticks from your pet and decreases the likelihood of you and the kids coming into contact with ticks. It seems simple enough.

Re: Ticks!

rosesheart — Tue, 27 Nov 2007 03:18:44 GMT

I use Promeris and have used Amitraz for years.

Before Promeris, I used Advantage and Advantix

I'm a scientist and have not heard of any of these side effects-what causes cancer in one species does not necessarliy cause cancer in another

Re: Ticks!

SalemsMom — Fri, 09 Nov 2007 14:46:38 GMT

Poodlemom, My vet said to use hydrogen peroxide. I would probably give it until monday cleaning it daily and then bring him to the vet if it still looks bad. As far as the head if you managed to pull it off without breaking it, it should have still been moving when you got it off him. I would inspect the wound and see if you see anything still there. If not you most likely got it. If there is a tiny bit left in him that you cant get out his body should naturally push it out just like ours would a splinter.

The trick to getting them out is getting down as close to the head as possible with tweezers and then giving a good yank. Someone also posted a link to a tick remover earlier on in this post. When you get it off alive soak it in alcohol to kill it.

Re: Ticks!

poodlemom — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 23:58:48 GMT

i found an engourged tick on dallas. he is a black poodle with a pretty heavy full coat. i would have never seen it. i felt it this morning. i was able to pull it off, but i'm not sure i got the head. how would i know? also, it is really red and swollen where it was. it feels like a lump. i cleaned it this morning with witch hazel because i thought it might be itchy. i haven't cleaned it yet tonight. what should i use? hydrogen peroxide? should i put bacitracin on it? how would i know if it were infected and should be seen by the vet?

thanks

Re: Ticks!

janet_rose — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 14:13:57 GMT

calliecritturs:
But it carried a strong caution against humans coming into contact with it (particularly while it was still 'wet') who were diabetic or took the MAO Inhibitors.

The Drs. Foster & Smith agree with you, Callie.

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=0&cat=1463&articleid=1376

PetEducation.com:
Contraindications/Warnings (this section is about the amitraz dip)

People on MAOI containing medication or who are diabetic should not administer the dips. Nausea and dizziness have been noted in people who handle the medication.

Avoid handling the dog for several days after treatment. Wash skin that has contacted the animal. Sensitive people may develop a skin irritation.

Use only in a well-ventilated area. Use gloves: do not allow skin contact with the medication.

Safety in dogs under 4 months of age has not been established.

Toy breeds may be more likely to have side effects due to their small size.

Do not stress patient for 24 hours after treatment.

Place protective ointment in animal's eyes prior to dipping.

Do not use in dogs with deep skin infection until infection is controlled.

Do not use in diabetic dogs or those taking other MAOIs.

Not recommended for localized demodex or other types of mites.

Not to be taken internally.

Not for use on pregnant or nursing animals.

Not for use in cats.

Re: Ticks!

Jewlieee — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 13:29:28 GMT

I can't believe he had all of those ticks! Thanks for the update.

Re: Ticks!

SalemsMom — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 13:22:27 GMT

I went to the vet last night and had Salem checked out and talked to her a lot about different products. He seems to have an allergic reaction to some of the recent ticks (they were deer ticks and we normally get dog ticks). He also had an infection from the rash that he had that he was biting at, but she said it wasn't had. She gave me some antibiodics to give him if it doesn't clear up within a few days of treating with hydrogen peroxide (the vet is kind of far and I didn't want to have to drive back). She did tests for different nasties he could have gotton from the ticks, but she doesn't think that he has anything. The tests were more because I was worried from reading about ticks and disease all day.

She wont give me k-9 advantix because it is toxic to cats. She doesn't give it to households that have cats. I'm greatful, because I didn't know this and one of my cats is pretty close to the dog. She also said she has a lot of problems with dogs being sensitive to it and breaking out/ losing fur etc.

She removed another 3 ticks off him that I had missed. He has such thick fur they are hard to find, poor guy. I decided to go ahead and try to promeris for 1 month because we really need to get this under control. We have found a few in the house now that must have fallen off him and lyme disease is prevalent here. He is vacinated but we aren't and I don't think the cats are either. She gave me one vial to try out. She said she uses this on her dogs because frontline stopped working and she has cats too. She said she has used it for a few months with no problems and she said they have not had problems with any of the patients there.

So I put it on him last night. It smells awful. My husband described it as paint thinner smell. The smell was gone when we woke up this morning though. No reactions so far.

I think I will research some more holistic things starting now. I really only have to worry about the buggies for another month here so I figure starting in the spring I can try some more natural options. I hate putting pesticides on him, but he was really miserable with all of those ticks especially since they had him breaking out.

Re: Ticks!

erica1989 — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:57:13 GMT

we started the product yesterday, gave it to 14 dogs... we'll see how well it works. No one seemed to have any issues with it, but the smell is not so great after the 2nd dog....

Re: Ticks!

BEVOLASVEGAS — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 05:18:44 GMT

I used ProMeris Duo on the dogs at the beginning of the month with no problems & no ticks.

Frontline makes me break out for 3-4 days after application, & Advantix doesn't work, so I'm grateful to have another flea/tick control option.

Re: Ticks!

calliecritturs — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 04:55:02 GMT

Jewillee - it used to be right in the literature that came with the bottle of Mitaban, to be honest. It told you flat out it was a carcinogen -- however, I'm not talking about it being an ORAL drug. NOOOOO it's topical.

And it wouldn't have been a known carcinogen for humans -- because it's applied to the skin of the animal (cow, pig, dog, etc.) However the list of "don'ts" was HUGE -- and in particular it specifically told you that you, the human, should *not* handle Mitaban (amitraz) if you were diabetic and/or taking MAO Inhibitors.

this isn't a 'holistic' thing -- this is stuff that was right in the literature distributed from the manufacturer AND it's what's at the bottom of the fact that several states (last I knew Michigan and Ohio were first on the list) that just plain forbids it be distributed to the owner -- that any treatment with amitraz has to be done BY the vet.

I don't have any of the old inserts because I haven't used it in 4-5 years, but further down it went into a lot of detail about the effect it has on the insulin levels in the body, and it also cautioned against using it at all on animals that were potentially diabetic. But it carried a strong caution against humans coming into contact with it (particularly while it was still 'wet') who were diabetic or took the MAO Inhibitors.

Re: Ticks!

janet_rose — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 21:42:33 GMT

rexandbaby:
Okay, so if we can't use Frontline Plus, and this new stuff can be harmful? What do we do?

Fighting fleas & ticks is a four-step process. You avoid the pests you can, repel the pests you can't avoid, kill the pests you can't repel, and remove ticks (alive or dead) that haven't fallen off.

Frontline does not repel! It unfortunately does not kill ticks as fast as it does fleas. However, it takes roughly 24-48 hours after attachment for the tick to transmit a disease.

Here are a couple of sites on natural flea & tick repellents. Repellents can be put on a bandana, a vest, booties, etc. if you don't want the aroma on the dog all the time.
          http://www.holistichealthtools.com/fleas.html (fleas and ticks)
          http://www.flutterbyearomatics.com/flutterpooch/flea_tick.htm (fleas and ticks)
          NOTE: "natural" = herbs and essential Oils

A good tick remover helps, too. http://tickremover.com

          Available in the U.S. at
          http://www.tickman.us/servlet/StoreFront
          http://www.ultimatepetproducts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=upp&Product_Code=trixtick&Category_Code
          http://www.swedenova.com

CAUTION: Kill ticks by dropping them in alcohol. Squashing them can spread disease. Flushing them down the toilet will not kill them.

A product called Garlic Barrier (http://www.garlicbarrier.com) can help to keep ticks out of yards.

Here is a site on Lyme disease prevention (http://www.lymefight.info/prevention.html)- basically just ideas on how to avoid/get rid of ticks.

Plants that repel ticks: Pennyroyal, Sage

http://www.gardensalive.com/article.asp?ai=568&sid=140643

Daminex (or Damminix) Tick Tubes are little cardboard tubes filled with dried cotton balls that have been soaked with a 7.4% concentration of permethrin. Field mice—the most reliable source of the ticks that carry Lyme disease—take the cotton back to their nests to use as bedding, where the permethrin kills any ticks that come into that nest. Sold in sets of 24, the tubes are available at some retail outlets, and you can order them on the web at http://www.garden-shops.com/ticktubes.html, or by calling a very dedicated supplier toll-free at his New England B& B: 866-401-9455 (“Chase House”). <snip>
But she doesn’t feel the tick tube cotton balls will cause cats any such problem; the dose of permethrin is much lower, and it isn’t actually applied to the mouse. Likewise, she has no problem with the home-made ‘tick-proofing mouse runs’ we described last year, where you line the inside of a pipe with fabric treated with a .5% clothing spray (or Garden's Alive "Pyola", which is also a .5% concentration of permethrin when mixed with water at the recommend level) to give any mice that hide inside a de-ticking. “That low a dose is very safe”, she says.

But she adds that she also simply prefers fipronil (Frontline) to permethrin as a flea and tick controller. In fact, were it not a violation of Federal law to recommend any non-labeled use of a pesticide, we might even suggest using a drop of fipronil on cotton balls or pipe lining instead of permethrin. Unfortunately, that Federal law prevents us from making such a suggestion. Ahem.

If you decide to mix your own permethrin from concentrate, use gloves!!!! I don't want information that I provide to put any of our forum members in the hospital.

Re: Ticks!

Jewlieee — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 20:46:40 GMT

I'd be interested to hear what your vet has to say about both products. I have used Advantix without problems, but after researching I'm a bit iffy on the ingredients. This summer I switched between Frontline Plus and K-9 Advantix (2 months of advantix mixed btwn months of frontline dosages).

Re: Ticks!

SalemsMom — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 20:22:58 GMT

My vet carries advantix, but didn't recomend it. I will have to ask her why.

I'm going to talk to her more tonight about the new stuff. She is using it on her own dogs so I want to talk to her more about it.