Kennel Difficulties

I agree huski.  Normally though a gentle leader is a great tool.  I use one with Bob when I want to walk him in areas where I know there are oodles of rabbits running wild.  Our neighbourhood walks are extended because of it.  It sounds to me though that there are marks on Ninagrace's dog where the gentle leader doesn't normally touch a dog unless it is completely askew..the cheeks...which tells me that the pup is acting out or somehow getting into scraps. 

Ninagrace, I read some words today regarding the Pitbull and I thought of you...."They have on/off switches....on when outside and off when inside."  That is the goal here....and in my opinion; it is completely accurate.  It really is as quick as a switch....Terrier!!!  My boy runs around like crazy when outside but inside he just wants to snuggle.  That is not to say that he has not done the rounds from outside to inside when I am working and the back door is open. On the other hand, it doesn't matter if it is rainy for days and he isn't getting out much (his choice and he is not wanting to get any wetter than necessary); he is still calm when indoors. 

It might sound like my boy is laid back; he is not.  He can take apart a large kong in no time.  There are few toys that last any longer than a few minutes.   As soon as a large dog tries to mount him, he goes straight into fight mode and he is ready to fight to the end.  It is all part of not knowing what a rescue has been through, but he will never go through any of that (whatever it was) again.  Hope you and your boy are doing well.

Bruister

I agree huski.  Normally though a gentle leader is a great tool.  I use one with Bob when I want to walk him in areas where I know there are oodles of rabbits running wild.  Our neighbourhood walks are extended because of it.  It sounds to me though that there are marks on Ninagrace's dog where the gentle leader doesn't normally touch a dog unless it is completely askew..the cheeks...which tells me that the pup is acting out or somehow getting into scraps.

It sounded like there were definitely marks from the gentle leader, although the 'odd' marks could have been from something else.

I'm not a big fan of head collars but like any tool, they can be a good tool for the right dog. Any tool that left my dog marked, scabby and bleeding would lead me to decide it was the wrong tool for my dog. I've used head collars on one of my dogs in the past, but despite me going through the proper 'desentisation' training he found it highly aversive, and he no longer enjoyed our walks when he wore it. A friend of mine found a similar issue when she fitted her dog with a head collar, but his reaction was far more extreme - he clawed at his face until he bled in an attempt to get it off. So while they can be useful for the right dog, they are certainly the wrong tool for some dogs too.

The Gentle Leader left a bit of chafing on my current foster Staffy's muzzle as well, so I removed it. I do think he'd be a better candidate for a Halti, but I don't have one right now so we're going with a normal flat collar, although I can still use the GL for short stints if really necessary without causing issues. I think it's the combination of the material rubbing on very short, wiry, hair that is sometimes sparse on the head region where pink skin shows through. Even regular collars have been shown to remove hair or cause chafing or sensitivities in Pitty, Staffy, etc breeds. You just have to be observant and careful. If it's causing problems, though, you really should remove it for the dog's well being. I might instead try a front-clip harness if you need help to stop pulling. Otherwise a normal collar should be fine.

IMO it's not so much about the tool you use but the training you are using with it. Tools are there to aid you, not to do the training for you. One of the most common mistakes I see with people using head collars is that they use them as bandaids for training. Once it comes off, the dog starts pulling again. That and using them incorrectly and when they are an inappropriate tool for the dog. Head collars are often promoted as a positive, gentle tool when in reality dogs can find them quite aversive. I often see people smacking them on the dog as a quick fix or persevering with them when the dog is clearly finding it highly aversive (not saying anyone here does that - just talking generally). Sometimes there is far too much focus on the tool as opposed to the actual training.

We had great luck with a sensation harness on our pit bull Rosco. He doesn't like the head collars very much, and we have just as much control over him in a front clip harness, so that may be something to try along with seeing what's going on with the dog walker.

Pits are very human focused dogs, who often suffer from separation anxiety when they are alone for extended time periods. If you dog is good with other dogs, you may want to look into doggy day care. A good doggy day care will evaluate your dog and tell you if he will do well in that environment (many dogs do not). Daycare would tucker him out and give him social interaction.

huski

IMO it's not so much about the tool you use but the training you are using with it. Tools are there to aid you, not to do the training for you.

You are exactly correct, Huski.  

Ninagrace, you have given us an opportunity to discuss some things.  For example, Kim_MacMillan talked about front clip harnesses.  I have a few harnesses from other dogs (huskies) and days gone by, but they do not have a front clip.  Kim, it would great to hear about these harnesses.  They sound perfect for Ninagrace if the gentle leader is a problem. 

I guess behind everything is the fact that Pits are supposed to wear muzzles in most cities.  I understand that, but .... most of the dogs we are discussing don't need muzzles if they are properly controlled, trained and loved. That is my soap box stance.  

I'm curious if the kennel is covered or left open to the room your dog is in, and do you leave on music for your dog?  I just wonder if either would help your dog calming down while in the kennel until you can put your finger on the problem.  It won't solve the dogs problem but might help her destress.  Do make sure your dog can't pull a blanket through the bars on the kennel though lol. 

We leave music on for our boys because it helps destract from outside noises that sometimes set them to barking fits, and it seems to calm them, sometimes I leave it on even when I get home so they don't freak out about the kids playing outside next door.  Also about toys in the kennel, I wonder if a nylabone would be good?  They seem to be tougher than rubber toys such as kong plus they can be swallowed and passed through your dog.  I am nervouse about leaving rubber toys or soft squeeky toys out during the day while we are gone because I don't want my dogs to choke on them(we put them away). 

Good luck

A front-clip harness (called Easy-Walk harness, Sensation harness, or Halti harness in brand names) is simply a harness that is designed to stop pulling in a non-painful way. The leash attaches to a metal ring that lies on the dog's chest. When a dog pulls into it, it changes the dog's direction such that it cannot get the leverage to pull. You can "steer" the dog if necessary, although not as adequately as a head halter. But if all you need it for is pulling, then you don't need head control. It also takes pressure off the neck altogether, which is good for dogs as well.

I have the Halti brand harness, and I really like it. It comes with a clip that also attaches to the dog's regular collar in case for some reason the harness comes off or undone. It has soft leather padding on it to prevent any possible chafing, and it comes in all sizes. I don't actually use it much anymore, but it's there if it's ever needed again. I like having it as an option if the need ever arises.

Kim, I have been looking for a front clip harness since I saw your post.  It would be great for my boy when around the neighbourhood rabbits.  Went to some local pet stores and then today went to Petsmart...nothing.  I look at some stuff on the net, but nothing.  Will now try the names you mentioned.  Sounds just right.

Thanks...

 Thanks for all the replies, just a quick update:

We switched dog walkers, and now he's getting around 3 hours of walking a day. He got a bigger, more centrally placed kennel, and so far everything has been perfect. Thank you all so much for the walking advice, it fixed our problem.

 We stopped using the gentle leader after the marks on his face, initially to let them heal, and walked him on a pinch collar. Walking him on the gentle leader meant a lot less correcting work for the walker, and he generally did better on it after he got past the first few minutes of trying to avoid wearing it. He's also good on the pinch, but the leader was so effortless that we decided to try it again, and our dog just hates it. After a few failed walks, we're back to the pinch. I read the posts about an easy-walk harness and we'll probably give that a try. Thank you guys again :]

 Just for the lurkers -- Gentle Leaders or Halti head collars are tools that are frequently misused by novices, but which can help you walk a dog that is uber powerful and too much to handle on other devices.  The problem usually is that people just put the collar on and start to walk the dog.  Now, you have a dog that is fearful of the "new thing" panicking and trying to rub it off.  Most dogs will get used to this equipment if they are properly acclimated to it, though some will not.  But, if you have a dog that pulls, do NOT just slap a head collar on.  Learn how to make it fun for the dog:

(By Pat Miller, adapted from The Clicker Journal)

Day one: Acclimate to nose loop. 3-4 times during the day, 6-10 repetitions each time. Hold the top of the nose loop in one hand and a treat in the other. Place the loop so your dog has to stick his nose into the loop to get the treat. Click or say "Yes" and let him have the treat. You can use a verbal cue such as "halter" each time you do this to begin teaching him a word that means to put the halter on.

Day two: Acclimate to nose loop pressure. 3-4 times during the day, 5-6 repetitions each time. Follow the procedure for day one, except now, when his nose is in the loop, pull GENTLY on the strap under the chin to put a bit of pressure on the loop. Keep your hand away from his nose a bit so he must reach forward to take the treat. Wait a little longer each time he puts his nose in before you click (yes!) and reward. Keep using your verbal cue. Withhold the reward if he struggles or paws at the halter.

Day Three: Continue as in day two, but after you have done the nose in the loop 2-3 times, attach the neck strap behind the ears. Feed him treats for a few seconds to distract him from pawing at it. After a few seconds, if he is calm, unbuckle it. If he protests by shaking his head, pawing at it, or stretching his mouth, try to distract him into stillness again. Then, click (yes!), treat, and remove the halter. If he consents to the halter's presence and isn't fussing, let him walk around in it for a bit. Encourage him to follow you. Use your clicker (Yes!) and treats generously.

Day four: Attach the lead and walk. Put the halter on and let him walk around the room or a small, QUIET portion of the yard. Use your clicker (Yes!) and treats to reinforce a relaxed attitude. Attach the lead to the ring under the chin. Try walking him and remember to use GENTLE pressure only---NEVER jerk on the head halter. ALWAYS MAKE SURE THE LEAD GOES FROM UNDER HIS CHIN DIRECTLY TO YOU, NOT BEHIND HIS HEAD AND OVER HIS NECK. Click and reward lots of times when he is near you, BEFORE he has the chance to get ahead of you. You want to teach him that NOT pulling gets rewarded. If he does get ahead and pulls, apply GENTLE pressure on the lead and when he turns toward you, click (Yes!) and reward. After a short practice session, remove the halter when he is calm, NOT if he resists.

Day Five: If your dog is accepting the halter and lead indoors, go outdoors in a quite familiar environment. If you started outdoors, increase the size of the area as you walk around with him. As a safety measure, you can attach a second lead to his regular collar, so if he slips out of the halter or is going to hit the end of the lead hard, you can use the second lead as an emergency stop and then regain control with the halter. Continue to click (Yes) and treat when he yields to lead pressure, or whenhe chooses to stay near you without pulling on the lead.

Day Six: If all is going well, it is time to move away from your house and yard and walk up and down your front sidewalk. Be prepared for him to get excited whenyou leave the yard as the environment grows more interesting. Offer more frequent clicks (Yes!) and treats as long as he responds appropriately.

Day Seven: If you and your dog have progressed well through the first six days, you are ready to "take it on the road." When you take him walking in the real world, be prepared with your clicker (Yes!) and lots of treats and encouragement for walking nicely.

If your dog resists at any of the steps, slow down and spend a couple of days on previous steps instead of moving ahead to the next day's exercise. It is normal that he will occasionally rub his head halter on you, or on the ground, or begin to paw at the halter. If he does this, distract him by moving forward, talking to him, or luring him into paying attention to you with a treat. Reward him with the treat when he is NOT resisting.