Making the Change to Homecooked On My Own

Well, you know that he does well on beef and rice. You're getting a beef and rice based recipe, and adding the proper supplements. It could go well or it could be explosive, and you know that, so switch carefully I don't think it's a bad idea at all. My 'splodey butt dog does MUCH better on fresh foods (the fresher the better, for her.... she'll take it still moving, LOL).

Please don't feel that way -- you won't screw up.  You'll learn as you go.  My biggest fear in threads like this is that sometimes people get so terrified that that just never start and go back to kibble fearing it's 'too hard'.  It's not.

At first limit the ingredients. Keep it pretty simple and then add to it.  Try something *EASY* -- like ground beef and white potato.  make enough just for a day or two.  Don't worry about "balanced" at first.  Find out what he does well on and then add to it.  Make your 'base' of the meat and potato ... and then rotate veggies.  Mash them cooked -- and just mix one in each night/morning -- and see how well it's tolerated.  You may find something that's not.  Make a list.  Keep notes on how you cooked it and anything that might be noteworthy at the time ("had family over and he had gas -- was it the excitement or the food?";) -- so later you try that thing again in a different circumstance and see.

do some reading -- find a couple of lists on-line of the calcium phosphorous ratio in veggies -- so if you do carrots one night you do kale another.  You'll know then that carrots and butternut squash are both kinda ... well not 'great' cal/phos-wise, but that Kale has an awesome cal/phos ratio soooooooooooo if you want to use carrots again, maybe keep a bit of kale in the freezer to balance it out.

You'll find veggies you never cooked before (I didn't even know what kale WAS til I started making it for the dogs).  You'll find veggies the dogs love that ... well, it's not *your* thing. 

Take advantage of specials and ziplock bags!  Halloween's coming -- and the night of the 31st find a produce stand and volunteer to take some of what they're throwing out.  Talk to your grocery FIRST and tell them you'd love to get jack pumpkin when they "mark ti down". 

Just hack it up and boil it or bake it or however you'd fix acorn squash.  No seeds.  dog's don't mind that jack-o-lantern is a bit rougher than "pie" pumpkin. 

  I think you have a great idea; petdiets.com is run by Dr. Remillard, who is a highly respected veterinary nutritionist. Your dog will be getting a very nice balanced diet. The thing to remember though is when you purchase one of the recipes available on that site or on balanceit.com, it won't be appropriate for every dog. For example, the recipe for a 60 pound dog has about 1400 calories, but Jessie, who is 60 pounds, only needs about 700 calories. If I fed her half the amount in the recipe, she wouldn't get enough nutrition, which is why I had to schedule a consultation. Unlike kibble where you can feed less than the recommended amount, these recipes aren't flexible. If your dog can eat the recommended amount of calories according to the AAFCO for his weight, the recipe you're thinking about will be fine.

I've been cooking for 35 years for my dogs.  I have never -- not even once -- calculated calories.  You CAN learn as you go. 

Monica's Yahoo Group (someone posted the address on the other thread) is free.  I often think the consultations are best left for AFTER you've been doing it for a while.  Get used to doing it.  Then get wiser. 

2DogsMom

I've always just fed the recommended portions of kibble.

 Then you will be fine because your dogs have been getting the recommended amount of calories according to the AAFCO, which is what the recipes will have. Petdiets.com is great about answering any questions you may have, so keep that in mind too.

2DogsMom.....Take a look at Preference at thehonestkitchen.com's website

This is a dehydrated mixture of veggies, a few fruits, balanced calcium, and other supplements, all you have to do is rehydrate with water, and add your own homecooked meats. With the meat added in, in a ratio of 1:1 or 2:1 (meat/mixture) the dogs would be getting the correct amount of calcium and other nutrients.

The stuff is not very expensive either, as a 3# box lasts a while, and DRASTICALLY cuts down on the fear of getting the calcium/phosphorus levels correctly, and time factor in cutting up all kinds of veggies, etc. This has cut my meal preparations in half, and the dogs are doing wonderful on it.

It does not contain any grain, which is great.

You can do this, say along with beef for several weeks and not have to worry about malnourishment/vitamin deficiency.

I tend to rotate my meats weekly, and I'll throw in other veggies too, but this has been a great system for me, as I too was so paranoid.

The dogs have been on it for well over a month now, and are doing GREAT. This includes an 18mnth old 53# Nova Scotia Retriever, whom in the beginning was getting about 4-5 cups per day of this meat/veggie mix.

Until we added in beef heart, along with his ground beef and ground turkey meat mix, now he only needs around 3-4 cups, depending how active he is that day.

Don't worry, getting the levels correct takes time...but DO keep in mind, they will eat more and require more food in the beginning. For one, fresh foods have a lot of moisture, they're not dried out and dense.

If you're used to feeding one dog, say 4 cups of kibble in a day, start with around 5-6 cups of fresh food a day. 

 If it makes you feel any better, when Penny was having chronic stomach troubles, the difference when I changed her to homecooked was so profound that it was months before I started thinking about doing anything but minced meat, mashed vegies and rice. She now gets a more varied raw diet. Changing to homecooked gave her a new lease on life and it really seemed to turn the clock back for her. She was like a young dog again.

If something doesn't work in preparing your own pet food, the beauty is you can tweak it and know exactly what you've changed and to what extent. It's not rocket science. If it's working, stick to it and make changes gradually if you want to. If it doesn't work, try something else. The dog can't be much worse off than he is now.

Hope things turn out well for you guys. 

corvus

If something doesn't work in preparing your own pet food, the beauty is you can tweak it and know exactly what you've changed and to what extent. It's not rocket science. If it's working, stick to it and make changes gradually if you want to. If it doesn't work, try something else. The dog can't be much worse off than he is now.

I agree 1000%.  The great thing when dealing with a homecooked (or even raw) diet is that you can add or subtract one ingredient at a time and watch for reactions.  This is impossible to do with kibble, each brand/formulation has so many different things, it's so hard to figure out what is causing the problem.

With Indie and Woobie, we had time to figure some things out before getting the consultation because of appointment timing.  By the time we had the diet developed, I'd already learned through experimentation that Indie needed fiber and was sensitive to fats, and that Woobie was allergic to poultry and sensitive to rice.  Without being able to take the time and work through individual ingredients, I never would have known these things.

It's scary at first, I know.  I'm still not moving my cats to a homecooked diet, because of intimidation and a fear of upsetting what my 14 y.o. has done very well on.  But it is worth the trouble.  The drooling faces at meal time make up for all the research!   

What a great thread.

Mostly, I think, if you follow the recipe, which would of course include the recommend supp package, you'll find the kcals will take care of themselves. There are some cases where you have to adjust kcals because of the amount of intake. For example, Labs are known to be chowhounds. Sibes tend to not eat a lot at one time. Toy breeds don't have the stomach capacity to eat much at one time. But, all in all, you can probably feel easy about the kcals because it won't always be exact even in kibble. They do the best they can for the greatest number of dogs but the simple fact is each dog is different, with different levels of activity, and some with different responses to the same ingredient. Some dogs have a special need. Dobies tend to have a slight taurine deficiency, for example.

I agree with everyone else, too. Keep it simple. Simple so that you can judge the dog's reaction. And simple so that you don't get overwhelmed, too. After you have become comfortable with it, like others have said, you can vary things a little bit.

I even agree that you will achieve a balance over time. Dogs have incredible reserves. So, if you don't have the balance just right to start, you will have already changed it or adjusted it before it actually becomes an issue.

I also appreciate the advice of those who feed raw. I don't specifically feed raw but I'm not against it, either. Other than safety issues for those with compromised immune systems. I can say that now because I have seen my dog catch and eat a cotton rat (local common field rodent, here) and everything seemed to be fine and we don't have a rabies problem in our county. However, the back of my mind worries slightly if he were to get a rat that had eaten some poison somewhere else. Anyway, when I can, I will slightly undercook meat for him. A few weekends ago, I smoked a turkey on my grill. I kept the liver and heart aside and cooked those lightly, for him. Although, I couldn't help myself because I am part dog (Husky, if you must know) and had a bite of the liver and heart, myself. Then I sat down and scratched behind my ear.

You might be able to locate meat markets in your area and there are some meat markets that also dress and render wild game and will have parts leftover that people don't want. For example, in Muenster, Texas is Fisher's Meat Market, where local hunters take their deer and wild boar to be rendered. Most people don't want the heart and some people aren't that wild about liver. All the better for you. Even the nearest grocery store is selling organ meat at a reduced price. I've also heard of meat-buying co-ops where you can get together with others to chip in money and reduce your cost.

I also have an added benefit. A co-worker, the illustrious John I have mentioned in other threads, is a hunter and plans to harvest at least two doe this season. I will get some meat for letting him store it in my monstrous chest freezer in the garage. I'll have to fight him for the liver because he likes it, too. But I can get the heart and whatever meat cuts he doesn't want. Plus he's got a dog, too. A Sharpei named Gus, short for Augustus Caesar. (John's a history nut.) Right now, the herds of deer in Oklahoma are over-populated and the wildlife mgmt is asking hunters to harvest the old does. They've upped the limit. You can still only shoot two bucks but you can now shoot up to 6 does.

So, you might try making friends with a hunter. I don't know if you are vegetarian, vegan, or an omnivore but it could be worth it for fresh, lean meat for your dog.

Thanks so much for all of the wonderful advice, Ron. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts with me!

Will definitely keep copies of all of these wonderful messages as a resource for when I feel like I need some extra encouragement and advice.

I have some more questions. Hope you guys don't mind!

For those who feed veggies, do you find that its better to cook or to feed raw? Our recipe says that we can serve veggies raw, cooked or mixed. I was thinking of cooking, but doesn't doing so take some of the nutrients out of the veggies? That's what my mom always used to say anyway. Of course, she could have been making it up to convince me to eat more raw veggies as a kid.

Also, what kind of veggies do you use? Callie mentioned kale, which I've never prepared before so that will be interesting... The recipe suggests carrots, peas and broccoli florets. Just wondering what else is out that would be good to use in case the pups veto some/all of the above.

Finally, I've ordered the supplements (BalanceIT was recommended) and the order may take as long as 7 days to arrive. Should I wait to start their homecooked meals until the supplements arrive, or do you think a few days of just beef, rice and veggies would be ok? Eager to get them going, but also don't want to do so if giving them the food without the supplements will do any harm.

Thanks again everyone! Sorry for all of the questions!

  The recipe I have says to gently steam the veggies, which preserves the nutrients and makes then more digestible. Whether you feed them raw or cooked, you need to finely chop or puree them so your dog can digest them. I think it would be a good idea to mix a small amount of the cooked food in your dog's food so they can get used to it,  gradually increasing the amount each day.  I wouldn't replace more than one meal a day with the cooked food until the supplement arrives though.

 The only thing "cooked" in my homecooked diet is the brown rice or oatmeal.  I partially thaw bags of frozen peas and carrots and puree them in the food processor with either water or low sodium beef broth, because of the nutrient thing.  As long as I really turn them into mush, the dogs digest them fine.  I have used bags of cauliflower, broccoli and carrots also, but Woobie didn't like those or green beans much, so the peas and carrots work for us.

BalanceIT recommends that if you ever feed commercial food in a day that you don't use the supplement with homecooked in that same day because it can throw the balance off.  I think if you start feeding them now and then incorporate the supplement when it arrives, you should be fine.  Dogs often go on bland or elimination diets w/o supplementation and do fine, it's not something you want to do long term, but short term won't cause any major problems.